Topic: Can a self employed Gardners / landscaper earm a living.

[gary]

I know this is a strange question to ask on here but do you think that if someone (ME) went to college and learned a lot more, I could go self employed and make a living?

Me and the GF had an arrangement I would work and support us both whilst she went to uni for three years then the following year I would go to college.

September is my turn for back to school. I was going to try and become a builder, but at the minute there is little work where I live and my friend who is has to travel some distance to work. Also at 32 my age is against me getting an apprentership as every wants a 16 year old the can treat like dirt.

It would also be nice to get paid for something I like doing.

I don't want to be a millionaire I'm not that way inclined, just pay the bills (well half now she is earning), is it possible by cutting a few lawns and privet's a week?

Gary

[Slug_killer]

You can make some kind of living being a gardener, but its hard work, low pay and seasonal.

People looked shocked at you if you charge more than minimum wage, most expect you to work for next to nothing.

The higher the income the punters have,  the less they are prepaired to pay - working class people understand that nothing comes free, professional classes cant understand why you won't work for less that the minimum wage, whilst pulling in 50K-100K themselves - gardeners are in the same bracket as cleaners and carers - low lifes. Professionals just like to be able to tell all their friends that "We have a gardener" - as if your fully employed by them - ie they are so far up the social ladder that they have their own estate (not just live on one).

You will be expected to turn a mud patch into an oasis in a day - after all "Charlie Dimmock does it in a day" - right ?
And be requested to "come and practice on our garden" - at least half a dozen times a day.

Having qualifications doesn't allow you to charge more. It just gets you more jobs - because you can sound as if you know what your about. There will always someone cheaper than you, so once on a job you have to maintain a high standard, or get replaced.

Its hard physical work. Punters expect for their £5.00/hour. If, after four hours toil, you pause for a breather, within seconds they'll be saying "I'm not paying you to stand around allday"

You can get 18 hours work a day, 7 days a week during the summer, but in the winter - a big fat zero !

However on the bright side, you can build up a number of reasonable regular customers, paying £10.00+/hour for 2-3 hours a week most weeks of the year.  If you can get your regulars, then you can shove two fingers at those who sneer at £5.00/hour. Exactly what the going rate for a gardener is depends where you are. In deep dark Surrey as much as £20-£25 ph - but still not a kings ransom.

It is outside work - in all weathers, there is no promotion structure, payrises are the same as inflation (or less), but you can work cash in hand and be your own boss, work the hours you want to work (or less)

Courses are good horticultural education, but not necessarily practical. (Is being able to tell the difference between  a Taraxacum officinale and a Aesculus hippocastanum useful ?) General plant ident is good - it does help to know how to maintain a plant if you know what it is.

Being able to lay patios and build garden walls is a big plus - gets you more jobs and more money.
Being a garden designer gets even more money per hour (but not many jobs per year) -  but you have to know your stuff and be able to draw up site surveys/planting plans etc.

So yes there is money to be made - if thats your thing. But you can make more money working in an office, a nice warm, dry office with regular and consistant hours.

If being treated like dirt is not your thing, look elsewhere.

Slightly biased,
    Slug (HNC in Horticulture, HNC in Garden Design, FCA in Brickwork)

[ACE]

Doing very nicely thankyou, Summer and winter, but I usually try and have August, september and october off. I would not get out of bed for less than £200 a day.

[tim]

Nice comment, Slug.

Knowledge of plants? The difference between a turf-turner & a 'gardener'?

Around here, it's only £10/hr. Thankfully! Remember you charge more if you use your own machinery.

[emmy1978]

I guess a lot of it depends on where you live. A friend of mine works for local council employed gardening firm full time, I think he also has september and october off. This is Bournemouth though so lots of parks and touristy areas. He started off on watering hanging basket duty, but was just involved in the re-landscaping of a Victorian gardens and really enjoyed it. Putting in water features and working with some fantastic plants and trees.
He also does cash jobs ( shut your ears tax man) on the side for about £10 - £15 p/h depending on what people want doing.

Slug, people seem to feel that way about anyone who does this kind of work whether builder, plasterer or gardener. My OH was a carpenter, then retrained as gas and heating engineer. The fav moan when we meet up with his work mates is the attitude of people who don't want to pay you more than they earn an hour, expect you to work for nothing for 15 hours a day, can't believe it's so much, even when you explain your insurance, corgi registration and training, no paid holiday, no sick pay, etc!!!  ::)

[Hyacinth]

Excellent comments Slug - you're telling it as it is 8)

Would endorse the ability to lay/re-lay slabs - 'patios' are they called these days? :-\, construct pergolas, etc.

And look at garden debris removal....do the local council operate a free removal scheme which the client can use? (here in Birmingham they do, every 2 weeks (I think) during the growing season & you can arrange for removal of 20+ bags of garden debris on a one-off basis)....otherwise (again here in B'ham) you will have to take stuff to the tip - and they can charge if you're making frequent tips & they think you're a business...

A strange thing...while clients will happily offer "money for a drink" to house decorators or even to the person employed by the local G.C. to deliver bags of soil, etc. kerbside & can be persuaded to take it round into the garden, the person who'll consider giving a tip  to the person who's been grubbing out on their knees for 4 hours is as rare as hen's teeth...

I co-ordinate work for a team of gardeners (6 strong, now & we're into our 3rd year)......those who rely totally on the money they earn from gardening etc. do best if they've other skills to draw on during the winter months, ie hardscaping, decorating etc.  Those who earn the most during the growing season for least effort, are those who have the lawn-cutting services in my area sewn up....all that money & not have to put any aside for knee cap replacements further down the line? Gotta be good! ;D

[Trixiebelle]

Very helpful thread to me  :) Thinking of starting up doing the same thing.

[Slug_killer]

Nice comment, Slug.

Thats probably because I've been there, seen it and gave up as too much hard physical work for too little money from too many "Come and meet OUR gardener" types.

Now I just do a few gardens strictly for friends and family - no charge. The rest of the time is spent on the lottie.

PS for those who didn't know Taraxacum officinale = Dandelion, Aesculus hippocastanum = conker tree.
Do the council still allow children to play conkers or has Health & Safety struck again ?

[Slug_killer]

Slug, people seem to feel that way about anyone who does this kind of work ...

People can accept builders and plasterers as being skilled as its not easy doing their jobs. Cleaners, taxi drivers, gardeners etc are seen as lower as it is believed that anyone can push a duster around/drive a car/pull out a few weeds - you don't need training.

"People do these jobs because they aren't capable of getting a real job"

As Tim said - The difference between a turf-turner & a 'gardener'. 

The number of times I'd quoted for a job, be under cut, and then asked back to make good the work that a couple of lads with a chain saw had done - I just got fed up with it all.

[Barnowl]

Round here, for a gardener who knows what he or she is doing, £100-140 a day, but regular work comes at about £10 hour - provided you keep paying through the winter!  Assume it would be more in central London.

Tree surgeons can charge quite a premium over that and you have to cover the expense of disposing of what they cut off. Have you got a head for heights?

[triffid]

.... it is believed that anyone can push a duster around/drive a car/pull out a few weeds - you don't need training. ....

The sort of thing that's believed by people like a neighbour of mine, who hired the bloke who strolled up to the door offering his gardening services, then wondered for the rest of the year why their garden just didn't look the same.
The bloke had been asked to do the weeding. His definition of a weed? Anything that didn't have flowers and wasn't a bush or a bulb. And this in early spring :o... cranesbills, lupins, hollyhocks, peonies... even a couple of young clematis (Niobe and Cardinal Rouge as I remember) -- all these weeds were efficiently exterminated. But at the time, the neighbour was really pleased and recommended the bloke to me so he could 'tidy up' my weeds too... 

[Mrs Ava]

I do okay - for me it doesn't have to be enough to live on as the better half has the full time job.  For me it is a job that fits in perfectly around the children.  I only work when they are at school, and my private customers and the landscaper I work for know and appreciate this.  This means, I don't work in August, I am off for 2 weeks now, have half terms and Christmas off, and if the children are sick, or have a school event, I don't work.  However, this was always my plan, for me, looking after the children, hubby and home is my full time job.  I could work full time - the landscaper I work for turns work away he is so busy. 

My regular maintenance jobs are 12 months of the year, but in the winter, only really fortnightly, and I may only have a couple of hours work, leaf sweeping, edging, spot of weeding etc.  I will do pretty much whatever my 'client' asks in the garden (not rude!) but I will sweep the drives, weed the paths, weed their borders along the pavements etc.  I love it, I love being outside, I love chatting to people about other things - not children!  And for me the perks are all the plants and other bits.  I don't know if that is just luck, but I have been given rolls of turf, grass seed, more plants than I know what to do with including cuttings and seeds, pots, rocks, slabs, green shreddings for the compost heap and woody shreddings for the paths and so far, touch wood, everywhere I have worked has been a pleasant atmosphere with tea, biccies and a friendly face.  I have gone into lots of gardens where cowboys have made a pigs ears of things and I have made it nice again and I get a real sense of satisfaction.

The weather gets me - if it is pouring, I am either soaked through, or at home loosing money and having to do housework  :-\ - if it is snowing then I am definately at home, and if it is tropical, I am getting sunburnt!  ;D  I love it and would never work in an office again.  ;D ;D ;D

[bennettsleg]

With O/H being self employed we've learned about the levels of marketing, advertising, financial nowse nouse skill & cunning required when you start a new business venture.

The good news is: it can be done. HOWEVER:
Do your market research first. 
If you have a garden, call in a few garderning companies for "quotes", see how imaginative/unimaginative they are.  Keep schtum about your plans.
Speak to your neighbours about their impressions of hiring in garden-related skills - without mentioning your plans, go for unbiased opinion.
Idenitify your target demographic and their actual needs. 
Be prepared to compete with other gardening companies.
Be prepared for it to take time before money starts coming in. We had to be prepared to wait for 3 years before seeing a profit with the deli, what is the average wait for gardening companies?

and finally:

What can you offer that's different, why are you offering it and - most importantly - is it financially viable for you?

[upthegardenpath]

I am doing a friends garden (for some money) as my first and will rely on word-of-mouth as that is nearly always the best recommendation - I am fitting around a FT job and allotment as well as own garden so I'm not working to deadlines as such - it's just something I am having a go at

[Garden Manager]

After having done menial jobs for mimimum wage and been unemployed, i can tell you £10 per hour doing something i enjoy and am good at, seems like good money.

In my veiw proper Gardening is a skilled job. Any fool can cut grass and hack back shrubs and hedges but to do it properly you need to know your plants and have training/exprience in the various techniques required. That is what you are paying for when you hire a gardener for £10 or more per hour. Plus of course there is the time aspect as well as the gardener's expenses (Petrol, machinery hire/maintainace etc).

Anyone who expects to pay peanuts for a gardening job shouldnt expect too much in terms of job quality.

[Ceratonia]

Paul Power's book 'How to start your own gardening business' is less than a tenner on amazon - definitely worth a look for someone thinking of going down this route.

He spends a fair amount of time talking about identifying which jobs are not worth taking, how to set your hourly rates & estimating costs, insurance etc.

[Garden Manager]

Paul Power's book 'How to start your own gardening business' is less than a tenner on amazon - definitely worth a look for someone thinking of going down this route.

He spends a fair amount of time talking about identifying which jobs are not worth taking, how to set your hourly rates & estimating costs, insurance etc.

Sounds interesting. Might just treat myself to that. Thanks

[simon404]

I make 10-15 pounds an hour but only from March - November. I like to think I know what I'm doing as I learnt my trade with the parks department of the local council. I reckon after about 7 years I was starting to get the gist of it and after 12 I made chargehand. Don't think for one minute that you can learn enough from a college course, it's practical experience that counts. Most of my customers are elderly and appreciate what I do; I've built up a round and visit most of them on a fortnighly or weekly basis. I don't work for yuppies. I could make much more money just grass cutting but I'd be bored to death. The real money is in landscaping but that's not my cup of tea either. If you don't mind spending your days up a ladder with a chainsaw doing tree surgery that's seriously good money too.