butter beans

[Hels_Bels]

Dear All

I've been trying to persuade my parents to join A4A and haven't quite got there yet! :( So I thought that if I got a smashing reply to their question, it might persuade them! ;D

They want to know whether you can buy butter beans to grow in the UK and if so, what do you do with them.  Do they go under a different name perhaps? ???

Thanks a lot guys - I know you'll come up with an answer!!

HB

[Hels_Bels]

[Palustris]

THis is going to be one of those 'if and but' answers. It all depends on what you mean by Butter beans. To me they are dried broad beans, which are of course very easy to grow in Britain. However, the Vegetable Book of Rix et al. says that Butter beans are dried Lima beans. Sadly they do not really crop well in Britiain as they are a tropical plant.  Take your pick!

[cleo]

Just ask and you will receive ;D,-try White Emergo from Suffolk Herbs and as typing this I see Eric has replied,and yes I agree but now you have two smashing replies ;)

Stehan

[ina]

Here comes answer number three!
To me, butter beans are fresh lima beans. I found a type of lima's, supposedly the only type suitable for our climate in Holland. They are: Phaseolus lunatus.
I tried them last year and............nothing, sorry. One came up and died, the others? Maybe mice, rats or rot?

[tim]

Not quite, Ina. As I see it, they're the same (P-l) thing, but Butter beans are twice the size & less sweet.  And fresh or dried, no matter. = Tim

[ina]

Well, at least I was half right hahaha.
Ohhhhhh, them baby lima's, fresh and young, now that's good eating.

[tim]

Dammit it - you were too quick, Ina!

I was just going to clarify (?), and say that a butter bean is a large lima, but only the latter is normally eaten fresh.

The broad bean is similar, but different - Fava or Windsor - both common currency here & in the ME (Falafel etc) long before t'others invaded. Does that make sense? = Tim

[Hels_Bels]

Wow!

You really are amazing.  ;D ;D

I'm going to email this page over to them now!

Will look forward to any other thoughts too!

HB :)

[ina]

Heeeeeeeey, thanks Tim for reminding me. I still have a large bag of dried fava's or broadbeans and I haven't made falafals in a long time. Going to make some soon. I make them in patties instead of balls as I don't have a deep fryer.

Hels Bels, get your parents over here! They'll get a warm welcome.

[gwencross]

OK This is Hels-Bels mum introducing herself after a lot of advice on how to log in ::)
Lets broaden out the topic of butter beans.
The dried pulses we buy from our stores must be grown in a climate where they can ripen in the field then be harvested and packaged.  With our climate change, and our experience of a very hot dry summer here in SW london, what pulses could I hope to grow here for the same result?
Presumably an early forced start then planted out June onwards. We could harvest some fresh leaving the rest to ripen if we get enough heat.
Which pulses have the shortest growing season?
Has any one tried this?
Having succeeded how could the pulses be  best stored  and then cooked for safe eating?   The warnings on the shop packets about soaking and boiling hint at dire consequences if not treated properly. :'(
Thanks   Gwen

[tim]

Good evening Mum. So far as I know, the consequences of not following the rules are no greater for broad than for any other bean?? = Tim

To save space, Ina - peas, beans or lentils.

[ina]

Welcome Gwen, glad you made it. Sorry I can't help you with pulses, I don't know what they are. The dictionary just says beans so that doesn't help. Hope you get answers soon, good luck.

[The gardener]

Hi Gwen,

Why do you want to dry them? normally most beans are best when young.

The surplus I freeze!

I have never tried them 'dried' I suppose the ones I have selected for seed would amount to dried beans.

If this is what you are after just leave them on the plant until they ripen then pick, pod & store.

They all take about the same time from sowing to maturity.

[Mrs Ava]

I have a jar of dried beans from last year...now what were they.....I can't remember.....note to self, label jars  :-\, and I know that I should soak them overnight before using, the same as you would when you buy packet dried beans, however, I have bunged a handful or two in stew that was going to cook for a good few hours, and we weren't poorly, HOWEVER, I am not suggesting that this is good, safe, big or clever, we may have just been lucky!

By the way, a great big welcome, come in and join the fun!  ;D

[gavin]

For The Gardener - Why do I want to dry beans?  ??? ??? ???  Cos they're gorgeous - in all sorts of ways!!!!!!  I'd be lost without them!

And hi and welcome, hels_bels Mum!  Dried beans - love 'em.  But I'm not very systematic about it - so I'm probably not much help; sorry.

For both my French beans and Broad Beans, I sow enough (?) to get a good usage of fresh beans, plenty in the freezer --- and a whole lot more.  

For the "more", I just cut the plants from their roots when the beans are well-filled, hang them in the house until the pods have dried, blackened and started to split open - strip and shell the beans, and store in jars for the autumn and winter ------ and all sorts of middle eastern recipes too.  

I have grown French beans for drying - but didn't really see the point - I treated them just the same!

I believe that there's an enzyme in many "bean beans" (phaseolus - French/Runner), which can be unpleasant or dangerous if eaten raw or undercooked - hence the advice not to eat French beans raw!  Cooking destroys the enzyme.

Broad beans are from the vetch family, closely related to beans, but not quite beans - and so, as Tim says, different from butter beans/lima beans.  And dried broad beans?  (OK, I'm biassed - years of living in the Middle East!  The ful or foul bean.)  A wonderfully meaty, flavourfull bean - superb.

All best - and welcome again!

Gavin

[gwencross]

Thanks for all that.  Most helpful. Husband wanted his own plot this year so will have plenty of space to grow ALL the seeds from the packet. My freezer isnt big enough to store all the food as fresh and buying another seems uneconomic both financially and energy wise.
Perhaps at the end of the season we could compare notes.
Off to sow some seeds.      :)
Gwen

[cleo]

Hi Gwen

You could try growing climbing Borlotti beans-grow them as you would a runner bean but let them dry naturally on the plant.

Stephan.

[Hels_Bels]

Dear Stephan

Gwen may well be growing borlotti beans - she's going to use some I bought at a whim a while back! The packet's in Italian so I'm a little uncertain about planting times etc... :-\

But, I was going to post about drying vs eating small and fresh, so this seems a good time. Is there any reason why I can't grow them and then treat them as other beans and eat / freeze fresh? It would be lovely to think that another hot summer's coming that would give them a chance to dry out on the plants, but would like a contingency plan just in case ;D

HB

[cleo]

Hi HB, Borlotti can be eaten fresh,it`s only `tradition` that they are allowed to dry.

[Hels_Bels]

Great - thank you!!! ;D