Allotments 4 All

I'd say that the only cats that are unsuited to going outdoors were ones that have been declawed (fortunately illegal) or those poor things that are bred to have no fur.

Unless you are talking about how much they are worth?  :-\

Ragdoll cats are a very docile breed

Their character and behaviour is much more like a dog in my experience - they are loyal, attentive and excellent pets for housebound people - they love people and adore children.

Whilst they may true - they are valuable cats - It is not recommended that they be allowed outside unaccompanied - the local moggies when they are not crapping in your border would beat the crap out of them.

In any case, evidence shows that letting a pet cat run around outside is cruel and selfish

Sorry I think you are wrong.Never to feel the sun or the rain.Never to breathe fresh air. >:(

daxzen,
                 I think you are a very responsible cat owner, ;)

Not been on here for a few days...Crikey!! what have i started?? only wanted a bit of advice on my cat poo problem!!!   Ha ha!!!


Ps have tried a few things, nothing works yet, so just resigned to checking daily and removing the offending bit of poo...!

maybe you should try small bear traps..... or snares....   ;)

Quote from: Jokerman on June 05, 2009, 21:59:54
maybe you should try small bear traps..... or snares....   ;)

to catch the cat haters, of course  ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)

Mr Smith... My hero... totally agree with you.

I am also a Cat owner. 2 and love em to bits. They are house cats. 100% Never let them out. They are well adjusted, healthy, fit and happy cats and they are moggies. Fully neutered, chipped, up to date on all injections, wormed and had drops for fleas.

I have a friend who volunteers for a local animal charity that takes in injured cats. The amount of cats/kittens that end up there is disgusting. either badly injured or with in hours of death, but their owners love em.... not that the owners know the cat has been killed/badly injured.

The amount of dead cats I see on the road is criminal. all because "cats lovers" want to gives little Tabby the right to roam just to feel the air and rain. They feel the air all right, the air inside the tyre of a car at 30 and 40 and 50 and 60mph!!!!  enough said there.

To me a cat owner that lets their beloved tabby out, doesn't love cats, They just want a pet on a part time basis and believes that other people should look after it the rest of time, because they cant be bothered.

I work with a lady who has two cats. She always lets them out. They are never gone for more than 12hours but yesterday, she had not seen one for 48hrs plus. She is very worried. I refer to previous car comments. Both her cats have bad health problems. bad teeth (have had operations etc...) and other intestinal related issues. They are always getting fleas. They are always going to the vets (has had lots of expensive fee's). She loves her cats though and they feel air and water on their faces. They are only 6yrs old. She says she loves her cats. Give me a break will you!

As for cat owners finding it acceptable for their pets to spoil other people gardens. No it isnt ok. As for cat owners who think that it doesnt hurt little tabby killing birds, yes it does hurt. An estimated 90million birds are killed by cats every year!!!! rare birds and more common garden birds, but at least little tabby is feeling fresh air and rain.

One word describes this type of person "selfish"

There is a sad truth in some of the things you say.

However I would prefer to have no cats than have cats that have to live in a gilded cage.

Selfish ? The word pot and kettle come to mind.

Glad you and your little prisoners are so happy ::)

Quote from: betula on June 05, 2009, 23:00:59

However I would prefer to have no cats than have cats that have to live in a gilded cage.

There isn't a pet on the planet that doesn't live in a gilded cage?

whether it be a horse, dog, parrots, finches, donkeys? any domesticated animal?

The only question is, how large is the cage? Is there a minimum size of cage that makes it acceptable?

Just because you let your cat out doesnt mean it doesnt live in a guilded cage, it does, the only difference is the size of the cage, it is still very reliant on you or some one else (whether you know who doesnt matter) for the life style it has. You will have trained it to come back to your house with food and as long as you keep feeding it then that is the cage you speak of.

With out the assistance of humanity, their would be no cats or if they did exist, they would have considerably shorter lives due to disease, other animals and colony dynamics.

Quote from: cjb02 on June 05, 2009, 22:54:42
Mr Smith... My hero... totally agree with you.

Mine too, he's great! Well balanced arguments, thoughtful, relevant & insightful input...

There isn't a pet on the planet that doesn't live in a gilded cage?

whether it be a horse, dog, parrots, finches, donkeys? any domesticated animal?

The only question is, how large is the cage? Is there a minimum size of cage that makes it acceptable?

Just because you let your cat out doesnt mean it doesnt live in a guilded cage, it does, the only difference is the size of the cage, it is still very reliant on you or some one else (whether you know who doesnt matter) for the life style it has. You will have trained it to come back to your house with food and as long as you keep feeding it then that is the cage you speak of.

With out the assistance of humanity, their would be no cats or if they did exist, they would have considerably shorter lives due to disease, other animals and colony dynamics.

No you're wrong. I find your arguements and logic infantile.

You're cats are animals who have natural instincts however you try to erase them they will still be there. You are in fact being cruel to your beloved pets by denying them the outside. Neither of course should a pet be denied the protection of shelter in the house or food and medical support when needed but nobody on this thread has suggested otherwise ( apart from those who have advocated harming or killing them) so what's your point.

As for the birds, cats are predetors just like you ! you seem to find this fact horrific. May I ask are you a vegetarian? Do you eschew all animal products ? If you are then my apologies for assuming the rank hypocrisy in your arguement.

Far more birds are destroyed by human produced poisons and destruction of natural habitat then the humble girl thingy cat can aspire to.

[/quote]

Quote from: carbonel11 on June 06, 2009, 09:40:49
No you're wrong. I find your arguements and logic infantile.

[/quote]

Can I ask why do you find  my arguments and logic infantile? what an interesting comment.

Quote from: carbonel11 on June 06, 2009, 09:40:49
You're cats are animals who have natural instincts however you try to erase them they will still be there. You are in fact being cruel to your beloved pets by denying them the outside. Neither of course should a pet be denied the protection of shelter in the house or food and medical support when needed but nobody on this thread has suggested otherwise ( apart from those who have advocated harming or killing them) so what's your point.

[/quote]

Lots of cat owners neuter their cats, does this mean they are also trying to subdue their pets natural instincts? of course they are. Does that make it wrong? Is that being cruel also? no it is not. Owners who lets their cats outside are lazy, wanting a part time pet because they dont have the desire, knowledge or experience to look after an animal on a full time basis.

All pets have natural instincts and all are subdued by man, by the very act of keeping them as a pet. There are plenty of animals that are kept inside and this is accepted as being the norm, birds, hamsters, dogs, rodents. Denying these animals an outside life, is that also cruel? no because it accepted by the communities we live in.

Quote from: carbonel11 on June 06, 2009, 09:40:49
As for the birds, cats are predetors just like you ! you seem to find this fact horrific. May I ask are you a vegetarian? Do you eschew all animal products ? If you are then my apologies for assuming the rank hypocrisy in your arguement.

Far more birds are destroyed by human produced poisons and destruction of natural habitat then the humble girl thingy cat can aspire to.

[/quote]

Cats are indeed predators just like me. I do not find it horrific at all that they kill 90million birds a year. I dont agree with it and I believe it to be morally wrong. Cats don't kill birds for food (or not many do) it is usually for sport, fun, entertainment.

I do not eschew animal products either, but I dont get a cat in a corner and torture the animal for fun just because I can. I do eat meat, that has been reared as food and killed humanely.

Quote from: carbonel11 on June 06, 2009, 09:40:49
Far more birds are destroyed by human produced poisons and destruction of natural habitat then the humble girl thingy cat can aspire to.

[/quote]

As for humanity destroying more birds than cats could ever do. You are correct, but that doesn't make it right. It doesn't make it acceptable for cat owners to let their cats to carry on more carnage.

I dont know what a girl thingy is

Quote from: cjb02 on June 06, 2009, 10:08:20

I dont know what a girl thingy is

Probably because you haven't worked out how to change the settings to grown-up!

Quote from: cjb02 on June 06, 2009, 10:08:20I dont know what a girl thingy is

Girl thingy cat = pussy cat. Leaving the swear filter enabled can make some innocent comments difficult to understand, you can disable it by going to your profile>Look and Layout Preferences> & ticking the 'Leave words uncensored' option.

Quote from: OllieC on June 06, 2009, 10:15:07

Quote from: cjb02 on June 06, 2009, 10:08:20

I dont know what a girl thingy is

Probably because you haven't worked out how to change the settings to grown-up!

Ah, an individual who believes in some thing, but has no idea why and cannot justify their own actions. So to show some sort of defence of their beliefs can only resort to sarcasm and deriding wit.

My cat has a cat flap and goes in and out as he pleases, now he is getting old mostly stays in, and has difficulty jumping on the shed/fence now so doesn't catch birds. His favourite spot was asleep on the shed roof where he could survey the world. I often see notices on lamp posts about cats going missing which makes me sad.  Also some cats seem to walk in the road.  The point I am trying to make is it up to the owner to know their own cat and where they live if they want to let it out.  Next doors cat doesn't go out on its own, it is a bit fat but happy, as her previous cat was run over in the alley near my house and it was very distressing for her and me.  My cats have always been allowed out, but when they were kittens if they went out the front they got a gentle kick on the bottom and soon learnt that was not allowed.  I think it is how they are bought up, our allotment cat is getting old, and one man wants to take it home next winter but don't know if I think that will be too much of a shock to it as its home is the allotment, but on the other hand if it gets old and ill needs to be rehomed.  As long as their is no cruelty involved surely it is up to the owner how they treat their animals and everyone else should not interfer.  Just off to bury the cat poo that my own cat left in my garden.  

Quote from: cjb02 on June 06, 2009, 10:21:05

Quote from: OllieC on June 06, 2009, 10:15:07

Quote from: cjb02 on June 06, 2009, 10:08:20

I dont know what a girl thingy is

Probably because you haven't worked out how to change the settings to grown-up!

Ah, an individual who believes in some thing, but has no idea why and cannot justify their own actions. So to show some sort of defence of their beliefs can only resort to sarcasm and deriding wit.

Er no, just making a joke that you have to change the settings to see the words... it took me a couple of years to find. You're a bit prickly, aren't you?

  Hi olicat,    would second the suggestion from legless -  that you block all the routes

 that the local cats take through your garden.   No cat likes to feel trapped and they need to

 know they have a clear run in an emergancy.

 Had the same problem as our garden was a free run for many years,   blocked off or created

 a hazzard at every access and have had no more problems  --  or the odd puss who has made

 a panic induced mistake -  and not a hair hurt on their heads !

 Like cats  --  don't like pooooooo,     :P

 floss xxx

 

Quote from: OllieC on June 06, 2009, 10:23:22

Quote from: cjb02 on June 06, 2009, 10:21:05

Quote from: OllieC on June 06, 2009, 10:15:07

Quote from: cjb02 on June 06, 2009, 10:08:20

I dont know what a girl thingy is

Probably because you haven't worked out how to change the settings to grown-up!

Ah, an individual who believes in some thing, but has no idea why and cannot justify their own actions. So to show some sort of defence of their beliefs can only resort to sarcasm and deriding wit.

Er no, just making a joke that you have to change the settings to see the words... it took me a couple of years to find. You're a bit prickly, aren't you?

Fair point, was over sensitive there in my response. I didnt appreciate their are adult setting on this forum.

thanks Baccy man for explaining more clearly