blind daffs mystery.

[moonbells]

I've got some very odd daffs this year. I have a lot along my front path, and clumps in the back garden, all of which have been there for over 7 years as they came with the house. 
I've added loads each year, too, so the front garden's usually narcissus heaven for 3 months a year.

This year nearly all the old ones are blind. About half the pathful are still flowering, the other half there's two buds and the big patch in the back is also nearly all leaf.
The only exception to the oldies being blind is a clump in a half barrel which was replanted 3 years ago and is well watered in summer. In between these blind clumps are the new ones I've planted, and some of them are blind too.  If it were eelworm or bulb fly, I'd have thought there would be a radius of stunted foliage etc.

The leaves do not look virus infected.  I've tried to dig up a bulb but they're so deep I'd have had to lift the entire clump with my fork!
The blind patch of 2 year old King Alfreds are now under a rapidly growing evergreen bush, and the other 2 year old blind ones are in pots.  I tend to forget  to water the front pots.

So, can I blame the past two summer's weather and perhaps overcrowding in the old unsplit clumps for the failure of the flowers, and lack of light/nutrients/water for the younger bulbs?  And please can anyone suggest any organic solution which doesn't require a JCB to get deep enough to dig up the culprits?!!

I'm tempted to (try to) dig up the lot and replant with fresh stock in the autumn,  but it seems such a shame.

moonbells

[moonbells]

[rosebud]

Hi Moonbells(love the name ).  I think your poor plants are in desperate need of a good feed, we have some daphs in the garden much older than 7yrs . but after they have died down each year i give them a good feed, and then again in the Autumn,the ones under the evergreen bush do not stand a chance when they have died down i would most certainly move them ,replant and give a light feed and of course same as the others in the Autumn a good feed. I would en`t move the others just feed and make sure they are watered if its very dry.
You don`t tie the foliage up do you Moonbells, just leave it on until its yellow then twist it off (a tip from a gent who grows outstanding daffs).
Hope something here helps OK all the best Rosebud. :D

[moonbells]

Hi Rosebud

thanks! :-)

I was wondering if (and hoping that) feeding was the problem. I think I can logically say why each of the blind clumps is indeed blind, while keeping fingers crossed that it isn't bulb fly or eelworm. Given how deep the things are planted, I'd have expected the newer plantings to go first if that had been the case...  but you always worry that a new GC-bought potful will not bring in something nasty.  But if it's that, why are they blind in both front and back gardens when the back's not had any new ones? So must be something else...

No, I never tie the foliage. That was just it: I've always been very careful to do exactly what you're supposed to do. But I think the light levels are a bit iffy in a couple of cases.  But the other thing that occurred to me as I was going to sleep last night was that we had that very hot dry spell in May last year, during the flower formation period for this year. They weren't watered at that time as I wasn't in the country, so perhaps that contributed to the blindness.  After all, I don't worry unduly if my hippeastrums miss a year. 

I have narcissi which flower from early February all the way through to May - have to admit they're my favourite flower - so it's doubly puzzling.  And it's predominantly the large flowered yellows that have gone, ie the biggest flowers (and bulbs). Snowdrops have been the best ever, ironically.

moonbells

[Palustris]

I think you have provided the reason in your question, it sounds very much to me as if they have been short of water (and thus nutrients) at the time when flower formation takes place. Depth of planting is only really a factor in newly planted things, bulbs can and do move themselves up and down in the soil in reaction to conditions.  Over crowded clumps do stop flowering mainly because there is not enough food and water to go round. Feeding is best done when there are leaves on the plants. I would suggest you use a feed which is taken in by the leaves, applied when the normal flowering time has just finished. If you cannot dig up the bulbs when they are dormant because of the depth then, next February, when their noses are poking through, give each clump a really good lot of something like bonemeal. Or if you don't mind artificial fertiliser look for something with the numbers 10:10:10 on the packet.  However there is no real substitute for re-planting with a good dollop of 'muck' under them.
And just to cheer you up here are some real Moonbells for Moonbells

Narcissus cantabricus petunioides. Wish they were mine!

[moonbells]

Wow!
They are lovely, aren't they?

Thanks for the reply, Palustris. I just wanted to put my theory past the folk here, to see if it was a reasonable one, or whether I really should be digging and burning virusy bulbs.  I shall invest in some BF&B and a face mask... if they're as bad next year, it's the JCB!

(I've never quite trusted anything with bonemeal in since BSE... but that's a topic for another thread)

moonbells

[Nigella]

I read in a garden mag that it can be a virus that causes the bind daffs ....

I will check it out and let you know what they said  :)

[Palustris]

True, virus can cause Daffs to stop flowering, but there are other signs, such as silvering of the leaves and general poor growth. At Bodnant Gardens today, many of the clumps in the grass were flowerless or with just one flower per clump.

[moonbells]

True, virus can cause Daffs to stop flowering, but there are other signs, such as silvering of the leaves and general poor growth. At Bodnant Gardens today, many of the clumps in the grass were flowerless or with just one flower per clump.

This is exactly it. My theory is that I think last summer (or at least spring - late April - May) was very dry for narcissi at the very time they need it a bit damp to form new flowers.  But hearing about other poor flowering places (and now they're mostly all out, seeing how many other poorly flowering clumps are about!) cheers me up as it all seems to rule out anything else, esp as I'm growing some nice leaves.
Thanks for letting me know!

moonbells

[rosebud]

Hi Moonbells, i have read this evening an article in a gardening mag, that blind Daphs could be caused by drying out and also large clumps of daphs that they cannot generate enough energy to produce the flowers, it recommends taking off top 2ins of soil and lightly forking in some manure in early summer or digging up and separating but digging up they will take a couple of years to flower again, keeping them well watered when it is hot and dry is a must they say.
   Hope this will help,  try and get some good old horse dung ::).
      Rosebud. :D

[moonbells]

thanks rosebud
Have large heap of the stuff at lottie - I've just dug over the culprit bed and it's absolutely FULL of tree roots. So I think I have the reason for why it's so dry... the pigging sycamores yet again. :(  I have planted ground cover geraniums every 6" (split a clump) and with luck they'll take. But the daffs - will just have to manure a bit (didn't last year due to having wedding to do) and make sure I remember to water.

moonbells

[Sarah-b]

Hi Moonbells- you and em both on the BFB issue. We did have an interesting discussion on this forum a while back about whether it was safe or not - use the search facility to find it if you like. Sounds like it probably is safe...

sb

[Garden Manager]

I have a similar problem. A few years ago i planted a load of (surplus) bulbs at the back of a herbaceous border, by a hedge. Up until last year they gave a good display with little interference from me. However the display this year is poor, a lot of the bulbs are blind and a few in the middle have disapeared completely. I am begining to think there is just too much competition from the hedge. the bulbs did though look nice and filled a gap before the border plants in front grow up and take over. Without the bulbs i would just be left with a bare strip which would get weedy very quickly.

My other main worry is in the front garden, either side of the drive. Here there has been daffs growing for as long as i can remember, but on one side at the top, the bulbs are starting to die out, with one clump showing classic signs of virus or eelworm (stunted foliage). I fear that if the bulbs down here are killed by either of those i will lose what has been a wonderfull display over the years. Unfortunately i have had eelworm in the garden elsewhere so this cause is highly likely.

I am not realy looking for help here i just wanted to share this problem with you.