The Monty Project

[Robert_Brenchley]

Some people do manage to get clean in prison, but it's an environment which is full of drugs, is pretty boring, and there's next to no money or effort going into rehabilitation. It's not the answer.

[Robert_Brenchley]

[silly billy]

Can't help wondering if your relation was beaten close to death so a drug addict could get his fix if you would have the same attitude.I see it all day in day out on the front line. I and my colleagues are usually 1st on the scene and first to clean up after them dealing with the after effects and wrapping them in cottonwool isn't the answer.Deal with an 80 year old lady beaten black and blue on christmas eve so a heroin addict and repeat offender who has been on numerous detox and get clean schemes can have his fix then see if you have the same answer.I strongly doubt it.

As for getting clean in prison it rarely happens as drug smuggling is rife my parent works in an all womans prison having visitors coming to see their "loved ones" with a piece of dental floss tied to a tooth and the drugs swallowed until they meet and kiss in the visiting room and exchange the drugs whilst kissing.Can't put them behind glass as it upsets the poor prisoners and we can't have that!!!!

[caroline7758]

I think it's a case of having to agree to differ on this one, but I'd like to add one final comment-the Monty project and others like it are not just about getting addicts off drugs and therefore reducing crime, they are also about providing them with a sense of self-worth and some training for work, and improving their mental and physical health. I wish them well.

[redimp]

Can't help wondering if your relation was beaten close to death so a drug addict could get his fix if you would have the same attitude.I see it all day in day out on the front line. I and my colleagues are usually 1st on the scene and first to clean up after them dealing with the after effects and wrapping them in cottonwool isn't the answer.Deal with an 80 year old lady beaten black and blue on christmas eve so a heroin addict and repeat offender who has been on numerous detox and get clean schemes can have his fix then see if you have the same answer.I strongly doubt it.

As for getting clean in prison it rarely happens as drug smuggling is rife my parent works in an all womans prison having visitors coming to see their "loved ones" with a piece of dental floss tied to a tooth and the drugs swallowed until they meet and kiss in the visiting room and exchange the drugs whilst kissing.Can't put them behind glass as it upsets the poor prisoners and we can't have that!!!!

My best mate was stabbed to death by a drug addict and I so want to tell you what I think about what you think.  But I ain't. Some people just make me so cross >:(

[Georgie]

I think it's a case of having to agree to differ on this one, but I'd like to add one final comment-the Monty project and others like it are not just about getting addicts off drugs and therefore reducing crime, they are also about providing them with a sense of self-worth and some training for work, and improving their mental and physical health. I wish them well.

Thank you, Caroline, for articulating that so well.  Hear hear.

G x

[moonbeam]

One of our members asked for a plot for his son in law who was on drugs as he felt that if he had something to do it would help him to curb his drug habit.
After a lot of thought and soul searching we gave him one on the proviso that his father in law would keep an eye on him.All went well for a couple of months and then we started to have a lot of break ins we thought it was the vandals again so it was reported to the police in the usual way.
The next week the bloke we had given the plot to was arrested by the police on a shoplifting charge and when he was being questioned about it he told them he had been breaking into sheds on the allotments and sheds in and around the area where he stayed ,The police came up to our allotments and i went along with them to the blokes plot when we got into his shed it was like an Aladdin's cave he had been using it to store a lot of the things he had stolen.some members got some of there belongins back others didn't as he had sold them.The bloke got 3months in prison. Would we give another person with a drug habit one of our allotments i don't think so.

[cacran]

Nothing is Black or White, is it? One day I think one thing and the next, see things from another perspective. If I were doing a job where I saw the effects of violence towards people due to drugs, it would maybe sway me into the argument that if drugs were freely available at a similar cost to other drugs like alcohol or tobacco, these victims would not have been attacked. there would be no reason to steal from them for money to buy the drugs as they would be  as affordable as the other aforementioned drugs which are just as much a blight on society.
As I say, though, I am not sure what the right thing to do would be but I do think that trying to get drug takers to have an interest which is safe and legal, can only be good for society.

[ipt8]

I say well done for seeing if the project will work. It is easy to criticise but much harder to do something. Mind you I saw he had a job convincing em to eat proper food.

[cornykev]

I'm with Billy and Red on this one, to many do gooders >:(

[redimp]

Oh no - don't get me wrong - fully support the project.  Hopefully things like that will stop so much heartache.  Don't think prison works for drug offences and users me :-[ :)  Fully support all efforts at rehab.

[GrowingChillis]

I think Monty's project is the most inspired thing anyone has done for drug users.
They do need a purpose in life, most people get into it cos they are lonely, as monty said. I dont think it is the persons fault, once they are addictied they have their
'drug  goggles' and are unable to see anything other than they need a drug.


I do think that it is a little crazy that on the monty project the
attendees left the site whenever they wanted, and this seemd to be when they
lapsed and used again. they shud do this in middle of nowhere
and then they would have less temptations

[Georgie]

RC, I fully understood your last post. 

Corny, I'd love to know exactly what harm you think 'too many do gooders 'do.

GC, you need to read the book.  The attendance on the project was dictated by the participants DTTOs.

[GrowingChillis]

I have watched a few of the shows

So when the blonde girl was on the phone to her mate
sorting out heroin for when she got home
her DTTO's(probation i assume?) we happy to let her go?

[Georgie]

I don't watch TV but I have read the book.  As I understand it there was no requirement for participants on the project to be  'clean'.

[caroline7758]

No, only that they didn't bring drugs onto the site.

[GrowingChillis]

seems a little silly to me.
Telling drug addicts they can go onto a farm, spend all day in the country, and then when they go home at the end of the day they can do their drugs again!
They will just lie to make out they are doing fine,
they will do anything for the drugs, I think it woulkd give them more chance
taking the chance to take drugs again away.

[redimp]

It's about showing them an alternative and hoping they choose it.  Drug addicts cannot be dictated too - they are like petulant teenagers.  It is a case of bringing them worund.  Also forcing them to be clean out in the coutry is also a non-starter as a lot of drug addiction is psychological and tied to environmental factors.  Consequently, you can get them clean when you take them away from where they live, send them home and the old withdrawal symptoms kick right back in again.  Giving up drugs has to be a voluntary thing.  This scheme is about showing them it is worth living without them, getting them some worthwhile experience and giving them an opportunity to do something with their lives.  I think it stand a better chance of success than many other schemes.

[GrowingChillis]

Yeh your very right.
Yeh they need to want to give up.
Showing them an alternative is like you said probably the best way. Maybe they should make more schemes with other things that might inspire people to change their lifestyle. There is a series on Sky I think it's called Hard Labour. They take asbo kids and put them through really hard but challenging jobs. Only seen a few episodes but quite alot of them seem to change for the better.
Anyone else seen it?

[Robert_Brenchley]

I've worked in both mental health (where many of my clients were on drugs) and teaching, and I found exactly the same thing in both cases. Motivation has to come from the person themselves. You can't force anyone to learn, to get better, or to come off drugs.

[sally_cinnamon]

I think with a topic like this there will always be disagreement as people will have had such different experiences.  Obviously if someone you know/love has been hurt/mugged/worse by a drug user then you are more likely to have bad feeling towards them which is understandable.  If you have a friend/family member who's lives have been ruined by drugs then you will have an entirely different opinion.  I have worked with drug users (albeit quite limited) and I have to say that it changed my view quite considerably.  Having never really had any contact or knowledge of drug users beforehand I had the stereotyped idea that all drug users are young delinquents no-hopers who think its "cool" to take drugs and they choose to continue their drug use.  But I have met people who have had everything - families, good jobs, great friends - and they have tried heroin as a recreational drug thinking they have control over it until the day comes when they are scrabbling round the house trying to find a tenner to buy their next fix and that is the only thing they care about.  I think the thing to remember is that "drug users" can't all be bundled together one way or the other and they are still individuals - some will desperately want to get clean and hate the way their lives are when they are on drugs and others will be perfectly content being addicted and will carry on committing crime regardless of whether they are given wonderful opportunities like the Monty Project.  As always there is no right answer for everybody.  Also, there are lots of non-drug users who commit awful crimes and don't seem to be regarded with, and evoke, the same level of emotion as drug users.  I think I have quite an open view on it and like cacran my opinion could alter from day to day depending on what I've read/seen about it - and you're right, it's never black and white.