Topic: New technology used to grow produce and allotment questions

[sophie.triggs]

My name is Sophie, I am a final year Interior Architecture student at Nottingham Trent University.

For my final project and dissertation I am exploring the issue of waiting lists for allotments in the UK, and as part of my research I am looking into how I can come up with a concept to combat this by bringing allotments back into the city centre using modern techniques in derelict buildings.

I was wondering if you could answer a few of the following questions to help me get an insight as to how allotments differ / or are similar

At your allotments how many plots are used all year round?

What are the demographics age/sex of people that use the allotments?

What are the busiest days at your allotment sites?

How often do you visit your plot?

Does the idea of using modern technology appeal to you, ie: aquaponics / hyrdoponics if it were available at a community site at a reasonable cost?

Do you like the idea of a 'pick your own' shop - a farm shop in the city centre where you can pick fresh fruit, veg and herbs that are growing on hydroponic living walls right in front of you, you can see the food growing and actually cut what you want and pay for it.

Any feedback / comments would be much appreciated, thanks :)

[BarriedaleNick]

In for a penny!

We have about 70 plots on site and we are in New Cross - South London.  Very urban.  Most people have a month or two off over winter with an occasional visit to dig out carrots etc.  Some people don't over winter much so don't do anything at all for a while.  Some people have greenhouses at home so will be growing some stuff there.   Say 80% of our plots are productive for most of the year.

Demographics! We have them all.  From 80 yeas old Italians to young mums with kids, Middle aged men, gay couples, grumpy old geezers.  It has changed from being mainly male 50+ over the last ten years to more women and a younger age group as allotments have become quite trendy.  This may be reversing and there is talk of empty plots again which is interesting.

Obviously in an urban environment weekends are the busiest days especially in summer.  In winter we struggle to get to the plot during the week as most of us work or have kids and its dark by the time I get in.

How often - once a week minimum in Winter - almost every day in Spring and Summer if I am in London.

I've done hydro and have looked at aquaponics but they are not for me - although if I were in a different situation I might have a crack at aquaponics.  I like dirt and bugs and being outside.  I like digging and compost and I like the smells of a carrot just pulled out the soil.  I am also a cheap bastard and setup costs for aquaponics are high plus you still need inputs in the form of fish food.  It can take years to pay back the capital costs in terms of produce.

Hydroponics I am not sold on.  Sure things grow very fast and very tall and produce great crops but it isn't for me.  They can be quite high maintenance - keeping the water PH and temps right, keeping the fert levels right requires monitoring and of course you need pumps which require power.  Aside from that I grow for taste - not sure that you get that from hydro and it is more divorced from nature which is the opposite of what I am trying to do personally.

Your probably asking the wrong people about a veg shops as we are growing our own and try to keep out of the shops.  It may not be a bad idea but its not for me.  I suspect it may appeal to a younger demographic.

Are you planning to use open brownfield sites - I am not quite sure how you can grow veg in derelict buildings unless you are planning to take the roof off and replace it with plastic or glass.  There have been some schemes set up on roofs and paved areas using massive builders bags full of soil.

[squeezyjohn]

Hi Sophie,

Interesting!  my direct answers are below.

At your allotments how many plots are used all year round?
Most are used all year round - except when there are flooding issues.  Obviously more is grown "in season" so allotments are more active from March to November.

What are the demographics age/sex of people that use the allotments?
It's still predominantly male and 50+ where I am - but I'm in my 30's and so are most of the recent takers.  That demographic is also skewed here because it's in a rural village where the majority of residents are older.

What are the busiest days at your allotment sites?
Weekends definitely

How often do you visit your plot?
On average everycouple of days - but less in midwinter and more at peak times

Does the idea of using modern technology appeal to you, ie: aquaponics / hyrdoponics if it were available at a community site at a reasonable cost?
No.  While it's interesting it goes against much of what allotmenting is about - it is not sustainable and cheap - especially not on a small scale - and the food only tastes as good as the additives you put in to the water!

Do you like the idea of a 'pick your own' shop - a farm shop in the city centre where you can pick fresh fruit, veg and herbs that are growing on hydroponic living walls right in front of you, you can see the food growing and actually cut what you want and pay for it.
It sounds as if it would be an interesting novelty ... but given that I grow my own tasty food for next to nothing with the glow of having done it myself, I'd be an unlikely customer.

Any feedback / comments would be much appreciated, thanks :)
I agree with much of what BarriedaleNick says above.  It sounds like a nice idea but I don't think that hydroponics and aquaponics indoors (under lights?) is a particularly sustainable way to go.  If it were truly a community project then I could see it being of massive value as a place for schools to visit in deprived areas - so they could see food being grown in an exciting futuristic type setting and get an idea about where their food comes from.  That would have value - but a commercial farm shop based on this technology would be unlikely to succeed in competition with the supermarkets unless it was in such a well to do area that the local residents don't have to think about the price of things.

[vague]

Hi Sophie!

 Im always interested in hearing about other people's idea's for growing spaces.  I used to live in the middle of manchester before moving to a small coastal town down south.  I remember that green spaces always felt precious and not everybody have gardens or access to growing spaces.

To answer your questions:

At your allotments how many plots are used all year round?

We have over 100 plots at our sites. We usually have a waiting list so they are all rented out.  However, there are usually around 5-10 that I notice are only used occasionally.  People take on plots and do not always know the level work it entails, and other commitments get in the way.  Others tend to clear their plots end of september and leave it for the winter, or just visit when it's sunny!

What are the demographics age/sex of people that use the allotments?

Quite a mixed bag.  Rough guess is that around just over half are 65+, I would say most are in the 35+ range.
  I took on my plot when I was 27 (32 now!!), and I did meet one or two who were around that age at the time.  I have noticed that we have taken on a few younger plot holders.  Also people bring their children/ grandchildren down, so you get all generations.

There are probably 65% men to women as a rough guess. 


What are the busiest days at your allotment sites?

Tends to be sunny bank Holidays!! Then the BBQ come's out! I tend to go weekends as I work during week, which i think is when most people go down.

How often do you visit your plot?

Never as often as I would like, but try and go at least once a week. More often during the summer to water. If I take a week off and Im not going anywhere I may try and get up there at least 3 days.

Does the idea of using modern technology appeal to you, ie: aquaponics / hyrdoponics if it were available at a community site at a reasonable cost?

I do like the idea of hydroponics to grow crops were there isnt the land to do it.  I have used hydroponics to grow peppers, chillies and herbs with good results.  I dont think it necessarily needs to be expensive.  Although there is nothing like tending your own bit of land and digging over the soil, and im lucky enough to have a fairly large plot.  Although if you think of costs of soil, fertiliser, seeds plants etc not to mention structures such as green houses and sheds (that have been known to be demolished in high winds!!), it can all mount up.

I think if the technology is a bit more accessible and done on a large scale it would probably more cost effective, especially if you did crops that are expensive in the shops.  i also like the idea it can save space, so more room for extra crops!!


Do you like the idea of a 'pick your own' shop - a farm shop in the city centre where you can pick fresh fruit, veg and herbs that are growing on hydroponic living walls right in front of you, you can see the food growing and actually cut what you want and pay for it.


I like the idea of any pick your own.  The fresher the better! Especially as lovely pick your own farms are not always accessible without transport or driving for miles.  I think also demonstrating how how crops can be grown hydroponically can also inspire other people to grow their own even if they don't have a garden or access to a plot of land.

My boyfriend also recomends you check out rndiy.org and our.windowfarms.org

Makes for some interesting reading.

Good luck with the project!!

[kt.]

Echoing exactly what squeezyjohn said

My name is Sophie, I am a final year Interior Architecture student at Nottingham Trent University.

At your allotments how many plots are used all year round?
Same as others have said with winter being mostly harvesting brassicas etc,  repairing of broken greenhouse glass and fences as well as maintaining paths etc.  Some plots are visited daily as some plotholders have livestock of pigeons or hens.  I have hens so they need feeding daily.  This means I have to make more of an effort to go in inclement weather but usually doe a little job of sorts whilst there even if it is only  minutes.

What are the demographics age/sex of people that use the allotments?
We have around 180 plotholders on 114 allotments.  Many allotments were halved to cut waiting lists but those with full or more than one were given grandfather rights when the rules changed.  We have 4 sites in our town, 2 privately owned and 2 owned by the local parish town council which are the 2 sites I look after.  Youngest plotholder is around 15 with his mother being the named tenant & oldest is almost 90who comes down in an electric mobility scooter.  Lots more families on now and many couples tend plots together or as families.  Not just the flatcap brigade, though some of the pigeon men are not happy with young families on site near their plots. 

What are the busiest days at your allotment sites?
Weekends mostly but there is always a hive of activity summer weekdays in the evenings until the sun goes down.

How often do you visit your plot?
Daily due to live stock.  If not it would be about 2 days weekly Mar-Nov plus days to harvest.  If the weather was right and I had the right family life balance then I would love to visit daily even without livestock.

Does the idea of using modern technology appeal to you, ie: aquaponics / hyrdoponics if it were available at a community site at a reasonable cost?
Not interested. Modern technology on site for me other than my rotovator occasionally is advancement in disease resistant veg seeds.

Do you like the idea of a 'pick your own' shop - a farm shop in the city centre where you can pick fresh fruit, veg and herbs that are growing on hydroponic living walls right in front of you, you can see the food growing and actually cut what you want and pay for it. 
If I want veg that is not in my allotment or that I have ran out of, I try to by locally produced stuff, farmers markets are great but would not be swayed by what you have stated in your question.  This question may be unfair for me to answer as I have 2 allotments and live on the north Yorkshire moors and only 10 minutes from the coast.  The hustle and bustle of living in the inner cities does not appeal to me though I am content at the half way point in our small town.



Any feedback / comments would be much appreciated, thanks :)

[goodlife]

Hi Sophie!
I suspect most of our answers are quite similar...and certainly many sites nearby here in north Notts. are very much like ours...

At your allotments how many plots are used all year round?
- on our site we have..umm...76 plots...and propably 80% of them are visited and looked after all year round...lots of winter hardy brassica crops that need harvesting during  that time.

What are the demographics age/sex of people that use the allotments?
-majority of our allotment people are at retirement age and men...though year by year this is changing more into mixed 'bag'.  We don't have many young ones joining into fun...but do have couples and odd few women only plots.

What are the busiest days at your allotment sites?
-we seem to have most activity from Tuesday to Saturday, particularly Saturdays being busy as it is our shop's only 'official' opening day.

How often do you visit your plot?
- during winter few times a week.. or every other day. Most of the year daily basis.

Does the idea of using modern technology appeal to you, ie: aquaponics / hyrdoponics if it were available at a community site at a reasonable cost?
-No.  Although I have little experience of this kind of technology, I do like to keep this growing fairly simple terms..both in practice and cost wise.

Do you like the idea of a 'pick your own' shop - a farm shop in the city centre where you can pick fresh fruit, veg and herbs that are growing on hydroponic living walls right in front of you, you can see the food growing and actually cut what you want and pay for it.

- the idea is good, but it would need few trial shops to see how people would act on it...and probably would need some media hype to get this sort of shops really going.

[electric landlady]

Hi Sophie

I think my answers will be pretty similar to everyone else's, but here goes!

At your allotments how many plots are used all year round?
Almost all of them are used all year round to some extent. Even if people aren't growing much during the winter, they're still digging, clearing/mulching the ground, harvesting parsnips etc.

What are the demographics age/sex of people that use the allotments?
It's still more men than women I'd say, but the age range is pretty wide and we have a lot of families.

What are the busiest days at your allotment sites?
Weekends, by far.

How often do you visit your plot?
At least once a week, I like to spend most of the day down there if I can. A bit less often in winter. More than that in summer when I also pop down in the evenings during the week.

Does the idea of using modern technology appeal to you, ie: aquaponics / hyrdoponics if it were available at a community site at a reasonable cost?
To me personally - no, not at all. What I like most is the earthiness and low-tech nature of growing things. It's just me, my spade and some seeds. It might be interesting for kids though. Have you thought of maybe sending your survey out to schools or colleges?


Do you like the idea of a 'pick your own' shop - a farm shop in the city centre where you can pick fresh fruit, veg and herbs that are growing on hydroponic living walls right in front of you, you can see the food growing and actually cut what you want and pay for it.
I think it's an interesting idea, and in general I'm a big fan of pick your own, or anything which makes fresh produce more accessible and affordable. But I would think that the costs of installing and running all the equipment would make the prices of the resulting veg prohibitive for most people. Plus I'm not sure how ecofriendly/organic it would be, which is a big reason why I grow my own in the first place.

I like the idea of using abandoned or otherwise unused urban spaces to grow stuff. Using rooftops to grow things in the fresh air appeals to me much more than putting a hydroponic system inside a derelict building.