Veg yields

[GrillMonkey]

Hi, there are band new allotments being provided in my area and it looks like I'm going to get a plot so I'm starting to plan what to plant and do up a diagram.

The problem is, and I realise there are a number of different factors that will effect it, how much of each to plant. We're a family of 2 and bump and I want to plant enough for us but not end up with so many potatoes that McCain's would be jealous.

I realise this is a "how long is a piece of string" type question but I want to grow potatoes, carrots, beetroot, leeks and runner beans. plus others but this is a start. How much would you plant of each or what size beds would you use for each?

Thanks in advance,

[GrillMonkey]

[RenishawPhil]

What ever you dont start doing anything for a while yet, you will do more harm then good on this wet sodden soil

[GrillMonkey]

:) not got the allotment yet, just attempting to plan it out on paper.

[goodlife]

I think 'planning on paper' is going to on going thing and you'll be doing over and over again until you really know what the given plot is going to be like.
But if you are really itching to do something and the pen and paper is calling..why not just stick getting you actual seed list/varieties together.
As to how much of each..that is so personal thing. From experience I know how much of each type of veg we are able to eat as 'fresh', what to able to store, freeze etc.  and grow those crops accordingly. But even then some years you end up far more or not enough..something always go too well or go wrong...that's gardening for you!
But if you want to start from somewhere.... 20 plants of runnerbeans should be enough for 2..more than plenty in a good year..unless you truly LOOOOve eating them for weeks and weeks...
Small things like turnips, carrots, beetroots...salads..you can sow many times during growing season and stick them where you get space as other are cleared out/harvested or even before the main crop grows too big. You can plant salads and sow radishes between runnerbeans as those are harvested quite soon and then the runners can take over space.
Potatoes take lot of room..nothing wrong with it but it all depends how you rate it them in you 'crop importance list' and how much room you have available...each row of potatoes will need minimum of 2 ft of space..they don't look that big to start with, but the foliage grow tall and eventually flop over as well..and the spuds can 'crawl' under soil quite away from the parent plant.
I could go on writing a gardening manual..but at least you have bit more to think about...

[small]

You won't get better advice than Goodlife's posts.....so much though does depend on whether or not you are intending to freeze stuff. You've said you want runner beans, have you considered climbing French beans as well, or even instead? I reckon you get more for your space, (I grow Blue Lake), maybe half a dozen of each....if you think you might get the allotment soon, start to chit some early potatoes, maincrop are a lot of work and space (especially the nicest of all, Pink Fir Apple) but your own new potatoes in June take some beating. Don't forget a patch for herbs, either, but don't put mint or lemon balm in direct!
Most of all, though, read the archives on this site. There is so much wonderful advice and experience on here.

[Nora42]

Hi I have had an allotment for two years and my first advise is to grow a variety of things. my favourite book is A Dk Step by step veg patch Lucy Halsall.
which shows you how to grow veg in  a 3 metre are by block planting ie 9 1 metre square beds.
it then gives you lists of plants to put in each bed.
top row
sweetcorn x9 plants with 1 summer squash.
runner beans x 8 French beans x 6 (all on the same frame)across two beds with four main crop potatoes in front
Middles row
dwarf bush tomatoes x 5 with 3 x cucumber plants
kale x 4
courgettes x 2
bottom row
beetroots x 20 carrots x 40 radishes x 40
swiss chard x 8 khol rabi x 12 oriental greens x 12
lettuces x 20 coriander x 6 parsley x 4 .
I gave my kids a plot about as big as this and allowed them free range in my seed box and there allotment plots won a small prize last year so it was good all round.
do you have friends who could swap seeds with you or a seed collection from somewhere like vegetable seeds .net might be good for you.
if you have space plant some raspberry canes these are wonderfully productive things.
Nora

also when planting seeds remember if you only plant 1 courgette and it gets eaten by slugs then all is lost if you plant 3 you still have two left.

[Digeroo]

I think you are right about the piece of string.  How big is the plot?  It is windy or sheltered, what sort of soil do you have?

What else do you like to eat?

Vegetables are very fickle you can end up with gluts or not enough however hard you plan.   

Rotation of plots is important so you need to think about several years.

Also sow in succession.  Lettuces for example can all mature at once.  How many can you eat in the same week?

I love runner beans so tend to have loads.   Yes Goodlife I like piles of them for weeks and weeks and weeks.   Climbing French as well.

Also think about strawberries and other soft fruit, they are expensive to buy and taste lovely fresh.  They are an investment because it takes a year or more before you get much from them.

If you like squashes and courgettes they can fill the space when the potatoes come out - simply plant them at the end of the rows.

Best advice I think I can give is be prepared for keeping the weeds under control.  It can be constant battle.   Look into hoeing and mulching.

Quite frankly I do not see you growing so many potatoes.  I buy brassicas in packs of 12 but actually six of different types would be better.  When I sow my own I tend to have far to many. 

I would also suggest trying lots of different crops. I am a huge fan of parsnips, broad beans and courgettes, calabrese and purple sprouting broccoli.   Others have a large areas of onions and leeks. 

Rhubarb if you like it - a couple of plant would be great.

[antipodes]

hello and welcome.
As a family of four, I have been planting usually 9 kg of spud plants (small spuds you buy for planting purposes) and that will give you several month's supply of potatoes, from June through to the winter.
In general, onions give about 4 or 5 times the weight of the planted sets so for several kilos of onions, aim to plant about 2 kgs of sets.
Peas? I would say 5 to 10m row and sow in succession so they don't all come at once; Sugar snaps types also crop for longer and are very nice.

For summer stuff, about 6 to 10 tomato plants give plenty of fruit, 2 or 3 courgette plants, 2 or3 cucumber vines;
Lettuce, radish etc you will sow over the whole season so you will see from your first sowing how much you get and act accordingly. Sow a small patch of lettuce seeds, under plastic bottles if it's cold, a thinly sown patch of about 3O cm square will give plenty of seedlings. Radish -thinly sow a metre about every two weeks and that should give you several bunches to be going on with :-)

For winter, about 100 leeks is a good starting point and 6 to 8 brussel sprouts. Cabbage you quickly get too much of but about 20 different brassica plants should give you greens throughout the winter. about 8 swiss chard plants too.
Hope this helps.

[bridbod]

Lots of good advice already given above. Might I add that its a time consuming passion taking on a plot, so be prepared to put in the hours (if your new baby allows), but the rewards can be truly awesome.
Normally, a great source of advice is the older gentlemen/ladies that have plots surrounding yours, but since all the plots are brand new, you may be surrounded by newbies.

You say you'd like to grow spuds, carrots, beetroot, leeks and runner beans. Cool. How about onions, they're pretty easy to grow from sets and who doesn't use 'em in the kitchen. French beans are always pricey in the shops and also easy to grow and if you like runners then probably you'll like to eat them as well.

With regard to spuds, its about now that folks buy their seed potatoes and start the sprouting process (chitting). The choice of which varieties to choose can be mind boggling but either do a search on this website or just post a request for peoples favourites.
As for leeks, its around now that some people sow their seeds indoors to get an early start (me for one)
Among others, good varieties to go for include "Oarsman" and "Musselburgh", but others will mature earlier (sep/oct time).

Carrots can be tricky to grow, especially if your soil is stony, but beetroot easy. If you like to eat it, sweetcorn can be fabulous when home grown, a real treat 
Runner beans can give a truly humungous yield, so unless you're planning on supplying your whole neighbourhood with them
I personally wouldn't grow more than say a dozen plants (ask me how I know)

[digmore]

Being an old fashion type of guy, I would in this first year, plant various potatoes to break up the soil and clear any bugs lurking in the soil.

Giving you time to get the feel for the plot, which parts are better than others, wind direction, sun shadows and soil fertility.

Then let rip next year.

Digmore. 

[Buster54]

You should also be planning what your gonna do with it once your crops have grown are you gonna make soups - freeze it - make pickles and chutneys to enjoy your produce in the winter months,or just grow to eat in the spring/summer growing season,runner beans will no doubt if you plants do well produce more than you can use for about 6 weeks,potatoes can be dug up and stored,beetroot and leeks can be left in the ground and picked as you want them for several months,cauliflowers will blow if they are not picked and cabbages will bust open,do you eat  cooked dinners in the summer months or just salads and a roast on Sunday,I think everyone plans what they are gonna grow but never plan what to do with it once they get a glut

[RenishawPhil]

good point buster!

We got a chest freezer this year as we were gifted one and had massive crops and froze lots of stuff, in the end we have made lots of things like soups, stews, curries and all done in to portion pots ready to use!

[GrillMonkey]

Wow, lots of information. Thank you all for your input.

The plot will be 10m x 12m and it sound like I'll be able to grow more than I thought!

[goodlife]

Wow, lots of information. Thank you all for your input.

The plot will be 10m x 12m and it sound like I'll be able to grow more than I thought!

With a bit of planning you can crop/grow all year round..it doesn't have to be just 'summer thing'.
I don't eat many 'soup' or 'stew' type of veg during summer months as there is so many other things to eat..berries, fruit, salady type of veg..so I tend to sow more 'hearty'  veg slightly later to crop and to be used later on the year when harvesting otherwise slow down. It saves me lot of unnessary work..and space in freezer for not having to prepare crops for storage.

You probably are starting to get idea that the 'world is your oyster' when it comes down to growing...don't worry yourself too much with planning...you just get frustrated when they don't work...just try little bit of everything. You will learn best from your own experience and see what you like growing and how much more/less of each thing you need following year. The main thing is that you get something to eat..that will encourage your to do and learn more and venture in more organized way of growing.
Even I've grown stuff for years...I'm still learning, we all are. I tend to grow good amount of veg from my 'usual list' and leave some ground for some experiments..every year I try something new or experiment with some different growing methods.

[GREGME]

good luck treat your plot as fun and don't worry too much if its not the saving you are looking for- that shouldn't be the aim

[squeezyjohn]

I know just how exciting the potential of taking on a new allotment can be ... and from recent experience I know how your time in the years after having a new baby can be eaten up!

I wish that when I started out - that the seed companies and garden centres categorised the various things you can grow in a completely different manner.  Usually you just get them categorised by plant family ... but I find thinking of them in the following way much better for planning purposes:

1) Perennials - includes all fruit trees, soft fruits  like currants, strawberries, raspberries, gooseberries and blueberries, rhubarb, globe artichokes, tree kales (brilliant if you can get a cutting of a good one), Asparagus, woody herbs (sage, thyme, oregano, marjoram, rosemary) ... These are things you put in and leave there for years and years (although strawbs and raspberries benefit from replenishing with new plants every few years to keep yields nice and high) - while it's tempting to chuck them in as soon as you take the plot over, if you don't research the soil needs and prepare the soil accordingly including removing all perennial weeds from the place then results can be disappointing - these things need proper soil preparation and careful planning ... but will be low maintenance for years to come if you get that bit right.

2) Fussy stuff - in this I include everything that will take a lot of care and attention, and even then you need to prepare for it to go wrong some years.  Things like sweetcorn, which takes up a fair amount of space and in bad years can give you very little for your efforts.  Things like classic leaf brassicas that need molly-coddling in order to avoid the whitefly/cabbage whites/pigeons/rabbits/club-root that also will eat them at every opportunity.  Outdoor grown tomatoes which look after themselves OK but go down with blight in September every 3 out of 4 years leaving tons of green diseased fruits!  There's quite a list of these which the seed packets don't make clear ... celeriac, celery, sweetcorn, cabbages, brussels sprouts, tomatoes, carrots (root fly), leeks (leek moth).  Some of the things on my fussy list might be a breeze to grow on your plot though - so it's worth trying and seeing how they do but taking precautions too.

3) Annual stuff which just gets on and does the job every year.  They still need weeding and maintenance - but less netting and molly-coddling.  I would include in that Chard, beetroots, parsnips, radishes, potatoes (Sarpo ones aren't the tastiest - but guarantee blight free crop), peas, beans (both for drying and eating green), courgettes and other squashes, kohl rabi (they get the same problems as cabbages - but you don't eat the leaves!), onions, garlic, turnips, swedes, oca, lettuce ... it's quite a long list actually thank goodness.  These can still be spoiled by late frosts, blight, slugs etc. but there are few surprises.  Concentrate on these for the least disappointment.

If you're likely to have only a little free time to maintain things I'd agree with Nora42 - dense and mixed planting will mean less weed competition - I like the challenge of an old fashioned row system on mine - but it's sometimes more trouble than it's worth trying to hoe everything throughout the spring and summer!

Anyway ... really good luck with it ... sounds like it will be a nice sanctuary whatever you end up doing with it!

[kt.]

Like many plotholders, you will no doubt spend the first few years changing varieties to find what works for you.  I grow crops as follows:

1.  Yield - Some crops produce masses, others not so much. Example being sprouts, some plants grow 18" tall with small button sprouts.  I grow Maximus that grow about 3ft tall with sprouts almost the size of golf balls.  Earliest harvest has been 31 Aug and they stand well in the ground through to March.
2.  Disease resistance - No point in planting / sowing varieties likely to be eaten by pests so F1 and disease resistant varieties are worth the extra few pence.
3.  Seed to harvest - All my seeds have a very short harvest time.  Some caulis take 10 months from sowing to harvesting whilst mine take 5-7 months depending on the variety and time of year.  This allows you to get double crops from the same space in any 12 month period.

[Lady of the Land]

Although they are new plots so no other experienced plot holders to ask, try to find out what animals there are within the plots area as this may determine what you grow or at least how you may protect crops. For example rabbits, foxes, deer, pigeons and badgers ( which we have) and are gradually doing more and more damage- digging up crops, paths and eating all the sweetcorn. I have had to build a strong wire cage using welded wire and large wooden supports to stop them- they are so large and strong have got into all the other barricades I have used before. We also have foxes they occasionally do some damage but not so worried about them as they mean we do not have rabbits.

Regarding amount of crops to sow as others have said as depends on what type of meals you cook, whether you have many take always or eat out or what you will freeze or space you have for storing those crops that are suitable. I tend to try and cook using the veg from the allotment as much as possible whether it is in the main meal, or making a soup with the vegetables or using the fruit for a pudding. For the first year I would concentrate on preparing the plot, digging out perannual weeds, deciding where you are going to put compost bins, shed, permanent crops and growing a few basic crops. Cover any areas without crops or still covered in weeds with weed suppressant. With 1 child and a baby on its way you are likely to struggle with keeping a plot going unless you try and make it easier for yourself. Each year after you will have more areas ready and can can add 1 or 2 new crops each year.

Good luck