Most productive Borlotti beans?

[squeezyjohn]

Hello,

I've grown the Lamon variety of borlottis for the past 2 years and found that they just do not make very many dried beans per plant at all even though the few beans I do get are great quality.

Does anyone here have experience of a more productive type of plant for the allotment?  I'm really looking for a bit more quantity and don't mind if the beans themselves are a bit smaller - I only use them is casseroles anyway!

Cheers

Squeezy

[squeezyjohn]

[chriscross1966]

Ooh boy.... tough question.... I grow a lot of shelling beans (I'm a veggie) so I'll give this a go....

Most true "BOrlotti" beans want a longer summer than we get, they originate in Italy and they need an Italian summer, there are things you can do to try and help them along, start them a bit earlier and grow them in biggish pots indoors before planting out, that might get you a couple of extra weeks....

There are alternatives, top of my list would be to grow one of the rose beans that doesn't need such a long summer, Polish CLimber, Bridgewater adn Bird Egg all leap to mind. Almost indistinguishable from a Borlotti, I can just about do it if I've got a pile of them them to look at and knowledge of when they cropped, Polish is the smallest (on average, just) but the earliest, you should always get a crop of it, Bird Egg (slightly more globular) and Bridgewater (bigger than Polish, smaller than Borlotti) are a bit later than Polish but should also pretty much always crop if planted out toward the end of May...... but there's more, there are beans other than Rose types to consider:

The assorted Pea-Bean types the most common being Egyptian pea-bean and the slightly different Box, good beans, guaranteed crop cos the cycle is well inside UK summer timing, but they do take a lot of cooking....

In the Kidney bean fold it's hard to recommend a climbing one in this country as far as I'm concerned, I've never found a reliable red one, though I do have some going at the moment that might make me change that view, if you're happy with a black kidney bean then it's pretty much impossible to look past Cherokee Trail  of Tears, lovely bean, crops heavily and early enough to be reliable in our summers...

Others: well if you like canellini then grow BLue Lake (the climbing French bean that isn't quite as good as Cobra) and let it dry on the plant... crops well and they cook very fast, I'd also recommend San Antonio, nice bean, reliable cropper, quite a distinctive seed too so easy to spot in the box. If you want to really have a fight with a triffid then try Giganda, massive beans in massive pods on a plant determined to become its own jungle... but they taste lovely .... it can run out of time as it's a greek plant, I'm growing a few in the GH this year to compare with outdoors.... trying them in pots did restrict the  growth but hasn't made them any earlier as far as I can tell.....You can get Painted Lima bean seeds from Pennard PLants, they are a lovely bean, short season enough for the UK and won't interbreed with runner beans (Gigandas will ) finally Mennonite Stripe.... massive beans and it crops as a wet bean fairly early, but trying to get the huge fleshy pods to dry can be tricky... it's very nice though...

There are also a whole slew of dwarf beans you could try but seeing as you're talking Borrlotti's rather than Borlotto's I'm gussing you aren't that interested........

If I had to have just one it would probalby be Cherokee ToT, I'm glad I don't have to make that call...

[squeezyjohn]

Wow - thanks for such a detailed reply.  I'm not veggie - but love beans and pulses as much as the alternative.

I think I just need to allocate beans far more space and plant a variety of types (including borlottis which are just amazing at the moment used fresh and shelled). 

Strangely I have a packet of Trail of Tears beans - they never really worked for me before - but maybe I should just give it another go as they come so highly recommended by loads of people.

I'll start planning next year's beds now then!

Cheers

Squeezy

[Digeroo]

Though I think Bridgewater is good and very productive, I personally think that the best fresh shelling bean ( ie not dried eaten like a soya bean) is O'driscoll very good flavour and nice juicy bean and very quick to produce. The dwarf borlottis are in my experience slightly quicker to produce.

Mennonite stripe will dry ok if put pods on top of a radiator.

If you grow Trail of tears for beans they are very small.  Never rated them personally.

Major cook is a great bean if you like baked beans,though very late to produce another bean that you need to dry on a radiator.

[chriscross1966]

I'm going to try CObra for a kidney bean this year, if it works out it solves a problem (it's that or go back to having a patch of Black Pencil-POd Wax dwarfs again).... If CObra comes out OK then I'll prolly abandon my search for a reliable climbing red kidney. Had a quick poke round the beans tonight before it got dark and...

Indoor Gigandas seem to be OK, outdoor ones have got some crop but are still flowering like crazy (and will be getting a major flower removal this weekend). Mennonite Stripe has started to dry on the plant (woo hoo!), AS have Cherokee ToT, Bridgewater looks to be carrying the best crop, the solitary Bird Egg has done OK, there seem to be a lot of Lima Beans (fantastic, I love them), the pea-beans look OK and the Borlotties look like they'll make it if we have a decent September.... on the down side the usually reliable BLue Lake isn't going to give me a load of canellini this year, some, but not loads, all the dwarfs are a bit disappointing, but will have plenty for seed for next year (had to restrict space this year due to manure issues)... POlish CLimber adn San Antonio are doing OK.... just fingers crossed that the Mennonites dry properly, be nice to start them off from big fat good looking  seeds rather than hoping that som e wrinkled and undersized thing that finished drying in my lounge will grow....