Author Topic: Disability Discrimination Act. (Read 22501 times)

merv · « **on:** October 09, 2003, 16:31:55 »

Hi,

Are your Councils all geared up for Aug 4th 2004 compliance?

Allotments are Public Open Spaces. Don't be put off by silly argument that it restricted to "Tenants". Tenants are Public, therefore your allotment is "Public"

So, your Council/Authority must comply with The Disability Discrimination Act "Access".

Which IMHO means that your Allotment must be able to be accessed by those with a disability. So, are your entrance road-ways up to standard?

Remember..... they must comply. No excuses.

Mrs Ava · « **Reply #1 on:** October 14, 2003, 02:16:11 »

Does this count for non-council owned lotties? I am guessing not. We have a very steep hump up and a sharp dip down through a narrow gate into our site - I am fit as a fiddle....well most of the time, but I find it hard going especially when carrying tools!

merv · « **Reply #2 on:** October 15, 2003, 18:40:13 »

Hiya,

It depends who the landlord is. Effectively if it's a company of any sort, inc the Church, they have to comply.

In the first instance,I suggest you just ask them if they have to comply with the act (in the nicest possible way).

Who does own your site? We will be asking the question of some of the bigger landlords, railway, church etc. We don't wish to scare them, but maybe give them a chance to occupy the moral high ground.

merv · « **Reply #3 on:** October 16, 2003, 15:22:58 »

Oops :-[

The access is for PUblic Open Spaces. Yours must be public.

Linda · « **Reply #4 on:** October 18, 2004, 15:17:51 »

Hi Merv

We are council owned, but self managed, and we have responsibilty for all expenses incurred, including major stuff like fencing.

Guess this means that it is we who are responsible for disabled access, as council devolves all responsibilty to us.

Good job a wheelchair could get in through our gate, as with about £400 a year to play with and almost a kilometre of falling down fencing, disabled access would not be a priority!!

Interestingly, our council does so little, we didn't even know about this latest bit of legislation. Like the new thing about protection of information (?) - keeping lists of allotment members names and addresses. Also this year there has been new legislation about asbestos, which they did deign to inform us of - a few weeks before it came into force.

I guess some allotment association committees would know about this sort of stuff, but we shouldn't assume all do!!

Love and compost
Linda

Wicker · « **Reply #5 on:** October 18, 2004, 22:53:49 »

Coincidentally, I have been told that "a man from the Council" was down at our site (and other sites) one day last week checking for suitable plots to be adapted for use by disabled/wheelchair bound i.e. making raised beds etc. Think this is an excellent idea and one we have spoken of before on our site and would very much welcome but would mean that paths would have to be much better too.

Of course, could be that the Council is only going through the motions of "investigating" and "exploring the possibilities" in order to comply with new legislation.

ken (69) · « **Reply #6 on:** October 22, 2004, 17:30:08 »

Don't you think, Merv, that rights to the disabled ,have got a bit out of hand. There is a limit to what a disabled person can do , so why not accept some things are not attainable. Soon, you will want steps to the top of Everest.

rosebud · « **Reply #7 on:** October 22, 2004, 23:34:01 »

Ken that rather unfair statement, says much about what people think of the disabled.
Should we not be allowed the pleasure of a lottie just because we are disabled,and have safety a consideration.
Maybe people should spend a whole month acting out a disabled persons life and then lets see how many would complain about there being certain legislation out there to help those who want to help themselves.
Or would you prefer we sat behind closed doors so as not to offend
the able bodied, with our disabilities. Heavens above should we not have some rights going for us, its not much to ask for.
Why shouldent an allotment with raised beds be attainable.
And yes one day we may want steps to the top of Everest.!!!!!!!!!!!!

ken (69) · « **Reply #8 on:** October 23, 2004, 09:10:09 »

My council allotment site has just been sold off for building.It could well be the requirements you mention Merv, is what prompted them.If slabs, possible risk of being stolen, so a extra wide concrete path up to the lottie site plus the same each side of the beds.It's gonna cost a fortune. Surely some raised beds at home would do.Of course I don't want you to stay at home all day, Rosebud, but there are plenty of places to go, the library for one.What I am saying, is that disabled people should cut back on their expectations, and not want the unreasonable.After all old people pack up doing things because of age and illness.Are we still friends.

Wicker · « **Reply #9 on:** October 23, 2004, 10:55:44 »

Ken, I am trying to convince myself that you are a "wind up merchant" and not serious in your viewpoint >:( However, I do know that there are people who do have these attitudes.

I wanted to answer your post earlier but thought I would perhaps over react, however Rosebud has had more conviction than I but I will reply now.

Selfishness because your site had been sold seems to be what prompted you to post but if your site is being sold it is for money and perhaps because it wasn't being adequately tended - I don't know but you would be given priority for a plot at another site.

Don't assume that everyone has a garden at home and don't assume that every allotment site will be transformed to comply with this legislation, there isn't the money available. The legislation applies to ALL public site and buildings and there is only a very small percentage of those that have or will adapted. Not everyone with a disability is in a wheelchair so there are different levels of access which can be attained relatively cheaply.

In a perfect world no one would have to suffer a disability but I am glad that my husband's disability is in his body and not in his attitude to life like you.

Sorry folks if I have overstepped the bounds of politeness - but no I don't apologise.

By the way Ken if you had read further back on this site you would have seen the kind of man Merv was and his "fate" and I doubt he would have appreciated your reply.

rosebud · « **Reply #10 on:** October 23, 2004, 14:06:29 »

Yes Ken we are still friends . That dosent mean i will except what you say. I feel you are of the old school regarding the disabled,That we must keep out of everybodys way, to hell with what we would like in the world. Well thats tough for all the old school because things are CHANGING for us for the better. I am able to get about slowly because of dreadful pain in my knees,need double replacement. also bad heart . BUT I DO NOT WANT anyones sympathy i want change, to be able to do the things i really enjoy.
"Go to the library indeed " go spend your day in the library Ken hide yourself away , how would you feel after a whole day??
Regards Mary.

ken (69) · « **Reply #11 on:** October 23, 2004, 14:10:03 »

Yes I'm sorry about the Everest remark.But I do know about Merv's condition and I do know about disabled peeps, helping out at the local library with adult special needs.What I can't get my head round is how a disabled person could actually do an allotment, when in my prime I barely managed.The available money would be better spent elsewhere, e.g. at the library or day centres, and I can't see my local council voting funds for allotment access for the disabled, some councillor probably suggesting sell up instead.A better solution would be to let the disabled park on their own plot.We were given the opportunity to relocate, Wicker, but several of us packed it in (myself because of age and infirmity).I am not a wind up merchant, but was an auditor for 30 years so cost is all.No offence intended

rosebud · « **Reply #12 on:** October 23, 2004, 14:11:37 »

Ken having read your post again ,i am wondering if Wicker is right .
YOU ARE A WIND UP MERCHANT. You cant be serious about lowering our expectations. Shame on you Ken .growllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll.

ken (69) · « **Reply #13 on:** October 23, 2004, 15:50:19 »

Rosebud....I am not saying lower your expectations...just re-direct them to something more attainable, and less potentially harmful, and less costly to yourself or other ratepayers. Be on the committee of a lottie association, but don't try to maintain a plot. You'll kill yourself, and we've only just met too.:-)

ken (69) · « **Reply #14 on:** October 23, 2004, 16:14:09 »

Hi Mary....I have in my neck what you have in your knees caused by....yes......digging, when I did gardening full time.And the library is a marvellous place..meet lots of people...play with the comps. Love you.

ken (69) · « **Reply #15 on:** October 23, 2004, 17:01:06 »

Thank you Merv for allowing the diversion. How are you? Is your treatment progressing

busy_lizzie · « **Reply #16 on:** October 24, 2004, 00:44:40 »

Unfortunately, I don't think dear old Merv will still be with us. I feel sure by the tone of his original posting however that he approved of gardening facilities for the disabled.

I don't understand the narrow view that disabled people should not be encouraged to take part in as many aspects of normal life as possible, particularly gardening which can enhance a persons life so much. To be out in the fresh air, growing plants is a fantastic experience so why not? Here is the url for an allotment association geared up to do just that. http://www.nsalg.demon.co.uk/societies/moorlands_allotments.htm.

We have a blind man on our Site. He has wooden posts arranged all over his plot to guide him to his beds. He loves being out in the fresh air and seems to get great of satisfaction out of culitivating his plot. It is not the tidiest plot on the site but our committee don't think that is important, - we can only admire his patience and grit in the way he tackles his garden. :) busy_lizzie

rosebud · « **Reply #17 on:** October 24, 2004, 11:11:44 »

Thank you for your input BL. Sadly of course Merv will not be with us
now. Yes i agree the fresh air and growing anything is one of lifes pleasures. And joining i on this site is another because we all learn from each other. Having a lottie or not there is always something
interesting to talk about. Have a lovely day everyone.
Cheers Rosebud. :)

Andy H · « **Reply #18 on:** October 24, 2004, 23:02:41 »

strange ideals of conversation going on here, if I was dis-abled and wanted a plot then it would be great to have one with suitable access.
Unfortunately money seems to be everything these days.
Access costs money.sad world but true. If I was dis-abled and wanted a plot then it would be life changing to be able to have that but councils that would find it cheaper to sell the plots than provides disabled access would probably sell as they are hounded from all directions for money and service etc. I think if my plot was at "risk" because of one dis-abled person wanting access then I would be very annoyed to lose it but then couldn`t a plot containing about 60 plots chat with the person involved and if that person was serious about sharing costs then everyone could chip in and work weekends and make it so! bit of hard work and bit of money divided by 60 or so and the councils descision can go up their butt :o
So long as that disbaled person is serious about the plot for more than a year or so then community spirit could manage it. Then again there are dis-abled people and hypocondriacts(prob spelt wrong) who are lazy and want everything on a plate due to a slight disposition... ruins it for the people who really have problems.
It is a sad world really, I often help a blind couple in Lloyds bank which is a slow process and the lady used to help on allotment till blindness took over, they need help with everything, including setting clocks twice a year and stuff like that,cant even read the mail! we take it all for granted but we are so busy in our own lives with work etc that we sometimes lose sight of other peoples hardships. me included.
You have to really be in a tough position to appreciate things from thier prospective.
Mind you, Kens point made me write this...brave to type it really, it shows what a crap world earth can be.

I will shut up now :-X
Drunk and rambling and abled, but had the pleasure of being able to go to my plot today.

Wicker · « **Reply #19 on:** October 24, 2004, 23:21:25 »

I do know where you are coming from Andy but doubt if any Council would genuinely sell allotment site because they couldn't put in disabled access - for heavens sake most allotment sites don't have toilets or running water (well maybe the fact that there is no toilet means that at times there is "running water" if you know what I mean :o) As to cost part of it might well come from Disability Groups who are anxious for their "clients" tolead a fuller life - and not all disabled are old and feeble there are many young disabled people too who might not wish to spend their days in the library as previously suggested.

I am sure there have been many many articles of legislation proposed for the good of the general public which have yet to be acted upon. Public buildings will surely be taken as a priority for equal access first, visitor from our Council was simply talking about one neglected plot having a couple of raised beds and slabbed path. And I'll believe it when I see it - if I am still alive!

Oh well, no one knows what is in their or their family's future and when they might require facilities themselves and we may not all be as independent as we think we would be ...

Just as an afterthought, Andy, if access/facilities was providedfor a disabled plot (whoever pays for it!) do you not think that would be grounds for keeping a site open - another string to the bow so to speak

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Author Topic: Disability Discrimination Act. (Read 22501 times)