Topic: Who has made their own Sour Dough?

[PurpleHeather]

Over winter my day time TV viewing included far too many of those cheap to make cheffy programmes along with 'how to spot a valuable antique at a car boot'. Or let's emigrate shows.

One subject which cames up a few times, which, up until now I was 99% ignorant about is Sour Dough.

It seems that  after the supermarkets put the bakers out of business and upped their loaf prices, proper bread is increasingly hard to get hold of. Granted most of us are happy enough with a the sliced stuff which stays fresh forever spread with a yellow substance one molecule short of plastic which gloats over being low in cholesterol.

I decided to check out sour dough and found a technically basic web site which is within my science education free ability to comprehend.

http://www.io.com/~sjohn/sour.htm

Before I embark on this mammoth task of testing my patience, I wondered if any one else uses/has used the method and can perhaps confuse me further (no effort needed) on the subject.

[InfraDig]

This is something I've "been meaning" to do for a long time! I make simple bread with instant yeast and that is very successful. Hugh F-W has a section on sourdough in "River Cottage Everyday" that I have been procrastinating over for a long time. That's a very interesting link from you. Let us know how you get on.

[qahtan]

I had to smile at your post,,, you do know that bread making, I don't mean bread machine is very addictive. very addictive.....

 there are all kinds of sourdoughs, one can purchase a starter and go from there or you can do your own starter.
 I have been making our own bread/yeast baking all my married life 53 years next Tuesday. It gives one great satisfaction to turn out a good loaf... I made regular white bread yesterday, 4 loaves at 20 ounces and 1at
16.
  It really is quite easy and is not as time consuming as people think, it can be timed to suit you......
 this is sourdough loaf baked in a cloche.


.qahtan

[Duke Ellington]

Qahtan.......

Do you use a mixer to mix your dough or do you mix by hand?


Duke

[qahtan]

 When doing a large amount , yesterdays bake was 1 litre water and 10 cups flour.
, yes I use a mixer with lots of power,  before I bought this mixer I used  my Cuisinart food processor....

  qahtan

                                

[Duke Ellington]

Thanks Qahtan I keep hoping that Santa Claus will bring me a really good food mixer one year! I would love a Kitchen Aid or something similar. :)

Duke

[PurpleHeather]

Now come on.

Any one can mix a bit of flour with yeast, sugar, water salt and a midgin of fat. Leave it to rise a while and either knock it down and then let it rise again and bake it. I know that because I have done it. I am not asking for a bread recipe.

This is going back to basics big time.

NO yeast.  Creating yeast from the flour is what I want advice on.

I too first made a loaf in 1960. Using fresh yeast. I have also used dried and that wonderful stuff you simply add to the dried mix.  Cottage loaf with one round loaf stacked on top of another was the one I did aged 12. It is supposed to be a difficult challenge. In fact I have not seen one for years.

Constructive advice on medieval style or even sooner baking techniques. How bakers left their dough under apple trees overnight to get their dough to rise using the yeast naturally produced from apples sort of advice. Is what I am after here.

Back to basics. Not how to use a food mixer or bread machine. I can do that all that.

I can do all those breads from around the world. Been there and been taught by people who have learnt from generations who have done it before.

They always use pre made yeast in one sort or another.

This question is about making your own natural yeast. I tried to make it clear that I did not want a recipe for commercial bread. Obviously I failed

[qahtan]

pardon me, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, I didn't see any recipe posted.

 What you are asking is about wild yeast, that can be obtained many fruits or veg or just from air if you live in the right environment.
 
 here we have a lot of vineyards..... so obviously a lot of wild yeast around in the air,
If you make a wild yeast starter it will be of the area that you live, even if you got a starter from say San Francisco, it would soon turn to your local....
 There are hundreds of sites on google that you can if you want find out more and more about sour dough....
Also there was a question that I answered, about by hand or machine 
qahtan

If, as  it appears you are a dab hand at making bread but want the challenge of  making sourdough, you may wish to attempt DESEM.
 

 
  

[Duke Ellington]

Bad day PurpleHeather??!!! ::)

[PurpleHeather]

Duke

We all get to the point of serious disappointment when we find that we have failed to express ourselves properly and I think that is what I have done here. I did not want a competition about the best made loaf.

Never mind , I will try it myself.

Infradig, I will PM you if I get any success.

[goodlife]

To make your own starter=yeast=root...so many names...
well you mix little water and flour (wholemeal or rye is best) to make sloppy mix, cover with tea towel and let it stand, add another spoonfull of flour and water after few hours and repeat this couple of days.
Let the starter stand and every so often mix it to give some air. When you see froth on surface your yeast has started to develop...it may take a week to happen...
Now throw away or use up your mixture with normal yeast to make bread but do not wash the bowl....
start process again bit of flour..water and new starter from the bowl...
Strenght of the yeast grows after few batches of making bread...
My own starter is few years old now.. I save about egg size lump of the dough, covered with flour in the bowl. It keeps fine few weeks providing it doesn't sweat as it goes moldy....so no lids on bowl just towel...

And

[goodlife]

..the starter may dry up and go hard in storage..thats ok...just luke warm water and good soak to soften it up again...
next day you feed it again with a cup of flour and when this is "bubling up" again you can start making bread again...
very slow process...but worth it...
good thing with sourbread is that you are not in hurry with it like with normal yeast,
I soak my starter over night, activate it in the morning ,make the dough in afternoon and bake it in the evening...almost 24 hour process,,only 5 mins at the time though..

[goodlife]

Whoops..I should have looked at the website...would have saved some typing...
I noticed some difference though..
I never store the starter in the fridge,,,after making the bread, I scrape the bowl and all the left over bits are sprinkled with flour and stored in same bowl in room temperature in cupboard,,under the loosely covered towel( to keep dust off but letting the air circulate).
In storing the starter in fridge there is allways the danger it going off as it is active all the time although very slowly so.

[Jeannine]

I have a starter that I have had along time, originally is was simply flour and  water from boiled potatoes,equal amounts and a tad of sugar which was covered  with muslin and  left out, it picked up whatever yeast spores were in the air and  made itself,

I feed it with flour and water again equal amounts every so often and a touch of sugar sometimes. It has travelled with me wherever I went and lasted a long time.
 You can cheat a little by adding a wee bit of yeast  to the original fluids, it makes little difference in the long run as it adjusts to your kitchen anyway. You can then use some of this when making your bread, it has the consistency of a thickish batter, or you can save a piece of your dough to start your next bread. I find the batter starter works best for me as it is easy to keep going. Don't store in the fridge, I have mine in 2 litre fat juice bottle which gives it plenty of head space.If I don't use it for a while I chuck a bit out. If left for along time it separates and has a liquid at the top. I am told that is Hooch and very alcoholic but never dared!!If I go on holiday I put my starter it in the fridge to slow it down.

Hope this helps.

I can find you a printed How to make a starter if you prefer, I know I have a few in some book or other,will look for you.

XX Jeannine

[Jeannine]

Just found these. some are yeast fortified and some are wild. 

Apologies in advance for the typos but I am working one handed ,book in one hand,typing with right and laptop balanced on tummy.


flourless starter
3 medium potatoes
4 cups water
1 tablespoon dry yeast
3 tablespoons honey or sugar

cook spuds till soft,drain save water,mash spuds,when the cooking water has cooled to lukewarm put in large bowl.add all the other stuff including the spuds,stir,cover with towel,leave it in warm place two days,when frothy store in fridge


potato water starter

1 tablespoon yeast
2 teaspoons sugar
3 cups warm water from boiled spuds
2 more cups of water
2 cups bread flour

dissolve yeast and sugar in potato water,put in large bowl, cover with towel leave 48 hours,stir in rest of flour.it will get frothy.store in fridge

milk starter without yeast

3 cups milk
2 cups flour
let milk stand in warm place covered for 24 hours,add flour,when bubbly store in fridge..for extra insurance you van add a tablespoon of sugar and  half tablespoon yeast

raw potato starter
1 cup warm water
1 teaspoon honey
1 cup flour
1 cup raw grated potato
combine all in large bowl.cover,leave in warm place for few days until foamy..be patient, this one will take up to a week to get frothy. store in fridge, feed weekly


honey starter

1 tablespoon yeast
2 tablespoons honey
2 cups warm water
2 cups bread flour
dissolve yeast and honey in water.add flour.cover ,leave in warm place till frothy, store in fridge.

all the above are from thegarden way bread book..a bakers almanac


I have three pages also from Bernard Claytons complete bread book but they are much the same  if you want those too.

XX Jeannine
                   

[InfraDig]

I have been galvanized into action! Loosely following Hugh Fwa-Fwa at 8am I mixed 100g of ASDA Strong White Flour with warm water until like thick paint, giving it a lot of air by thorough whisking, and put it in a bowl and covered with cling film, and left it on the kitchen bench.

6pm Nothing obvious yet!

[Jeannine]

Don't use cling film, use muslin, wild yeast spores can't make it through cling film. XX Jeannine

[qahtan]

 Take off the cling film,,, the dough can't breath,,, gasp gasp..... qahtan

[InfraDig]

Ok. Thanks for that. I had been wondering, because it mentions lids, tupperware etc. Makes a lot of sense!!

[InfraDig]

That's: thanks both!!