Topic: CATS?? is this the solution

[adam04]

ok, point proven have deleted. sorry!!

[PREMTAL]

                                Good lad. :)


                                           PREMTAL

[Derek]

We have a plethera of cats in the neighbourhood and they are making our front garden and another neighbours a cat toilet.

As you can appreciate I am not a happy bunny and cats are not my favourite animal at the moment

I have been told that they don't like Jeyes fluid...now before all the cat lovers grab their pens to protest I am not going to bath the pesky things in Jeyes but merely place pots around the affected areas hoping the aroma will deter them.

This also apparently works with Badgers and Foxes to keep them off the lottie

Derek

[EmmaLou]

I have found owning a cat deters other cats from using your garden and also they tend not to mess it themselves, preferring to go elsewhere. Sorry to those that suffer!

Another thing to try is garlic - apparently they don't like it although I've not tried this myself.

My dad has been known to use a mini electric fence around newly seeded/planted beds.  :oCats don't like going near it so don't actually get electrocuted. Don't worry it isn't a strong shock if they do actually touch it.

[Hyacinth]

The coleus canina...I'd no idea it could become such an invasive horrible plant 'til I was asked this summer to sort out a client's borders which had become infested with it. The lady was a widow of many years and at special anniversaries she'd buy a miniature rose to plant in the borders. These were now being choked by the coleus. There was nothing to do but lift the roses, pot them, dig out what roots I could of the coleus and glyphosate the areas.

Never asked her if she was bothered by cats, tho :o

But another client has large tubs of c.c. which are placed amongst the borders - these look nice & might be the way to go? - Lishka

[Alimo]

Cats really don't like citrus fruits.  You could try sprinkling some essential lemon/orange oil around.  Or just some lemon/orange peel placed around could see them off?

I know my neighbour used it to good effect when a Tom cat used to come round and "spray".

Alimo

[john_miller]

Hi flowerlady,
                      The "Piss-Off-Plant" does not appear to be available yet in this country. :(

It is the result of American genetic manipulation to enhance to the odour of the plant, so that all rights to this plant belong to the Company by registered patent.



                                                       PREMTAL :)

Simply because a plant has a Plant Patent does not mean that it has been genetically manipulated. Many modern varieties of ornamentals that have been developed by normal breeding methods, i.e. transferring pollen from one cv. to another and growing out the results, are issued P.P.'s. P.P.'s are simply that: they are used by the breeders to prohibit other breeders simply copying their work and diminishing any economic advantage they may gain from their developments. Just like any other patent. Among other plants protected by P.P.'s that spring readily to mind are modern Pelargoniums, Osteospermum, Hemerocallis and Argyranthemum. 
  I would also point out that the link you provide specifically cites the plants origination in Europe (second to last line in the description).
 This site, in it's first few lines gives a brief overview,:
http://www.uspto.gov/web/offices/pac/doc/general/plant.htm

[chuff]

I found that cats don't like sharp gravel, the flint type. I had this down in my garden and I didn't get a problem which was a big surprise because I thought it would be like a giant litter tray for them, This isn't the first time it has seemed to do the job, when I moved I put it in my large planters to keep the neighbours cats off them.
Don't know if it would be practical for use on an allotment but it would make your veg patch look a lot posher than everybody else's  ;D

[PREMTAL]

Hi john_miller,
                       I have been on holiday and therefore not able to reply to your post until now.

I think you have missed the point that I was making, that being that the plant ROTM was talking about is not the plant flowerlady was looking for. ::)

I sent flowerlady the link to the catalogue in question and her subsequent post was to find a UK supplier for the "piss off plant" quoted in that catalogue. ;)             

With regard to P.P.'s you state that it does not mean that the plant in question has been genetically manipulated. I would counter that it does not mean that it has not. ;)

PS:- .The USA has flooded the world market with genetically modified soya bean mixed with organic soya bean making it almost impossible to avoid eating GM food. >:(

It did not state that it had done so it was only found out after the fact. >:(

                                                    PREMTAL

[john_miller]

I think you have missed the point that I was making, that being that the plant ROTM was talking about is not the plant flowerlady was looking for. ::)

I sent flowerlady the link to the catalogue in question and her subsequent post was to find a UK supplier for the "piss off plant" quoted in that catalogue. ;)             

With regard to P.P.'s you state that it does not mean that the plant in question has been genetically manipulated. I would counter that it does not mean that it has not. ;)

PS:- .The USA has flooded the world market with genetically modified soya bean mixed with organic soya bean making it almost impossible to avoid eating GM food. >:(

It did not state that it had done so it was only found out after the fact. >:(

                                                    PREMTAL

  When I had the time I was going to come back to this as a result of something I saw on e-bay over here. However I didn't realise you had in the meantime posted again.
  I will start by saying initially that I was not disputing your point about the plant ROTM and flowerlady were looking for- I agree with you! However, I do disagree with your assertion that the plant was subject to patenting by a U.S. company as the link you provide to Richters specifically states the plant was developed, and would have been patented by, a company in Europe. The reason it, and most patented plants, have a U.S. patent is due to it being far easier to get a plant patent in the U.S. than in any other country.
   Additionally I believe that you are misunderstanding the point about what can be granted plant patents.  From the link I provided to the U.S. patent office:
"The law also provides for the granting of a patent to anyone who has invented or discovered and asexually reproduced (my emphasis) any distinct and new variety of plant, including cultivated sports, mutants, hybrids, and newly found seedlings, other than a tuber-propagated plant or a plant found in an uncultivated state". My understanding of the issue regarding genetic manipulation is that it is not the plant varieties themselves that are patented but the technology involved in inserting trans-genic genes into seeds of these varieties which has been patented by Monsanto (see para.3 here: http://litigationcenter.bna.com/pic2/lit.nsf/id/BNAP-5W5S43?OpenDocument&PrintVersion=Yes.) . These varieties are not generally subject to asexual propagation so would be disqualified from the plant patent process on this basis.
  Which brings me to my original intent to revisit this subject. While checking out the background of a plant being offered on e-bay (primarily whether I could propagate it) I came across this:
http://www.plantdelights.com/Catalog/Fall/Detail/06252.html
which provides a brief description of how this plant variety came about. Given all the seed sowing that takes place among the people who post here, and not just vegetables, I wanted to post the link as an illustration of where the process can start and that you don't need to be a mega-corporation, American or otherwise, to get a patent.

[Robert_Brenchley]

I don't know what the legal basis is, but GM varieties are definitely patented. There's been all sorts of argument about stray seed; is the guy who has a few on his farm infringing the patent, and are the GM companies liable if the farmer loses organic status due to GM accidentals?

[KevB]

I only asked about cat preventatives??and we have moved on somewhat!! And I'm still no closer to a definitive answer than I was before!! apart from the tuna one!! (Which after all was a joke)
cheers KevB

p.s. There may NOT be one!!

[PREMTAL]

Hi John-Miller,
                      We seem initially to have got our wires crossed. ::) 

A most informative update, but the consequences of GM crops are real threat. 

Regardless of how the science is applied or the US laws which control who makes money from it, Pandora's box has been opened.

There is no definitive evidence which can state what effect GM crops will have 20 years down the line
on the immune system of humans or other lifeforms  which ingest them.

I may be, as an organic type in the minority when it comes to what I grow, but I honestly believe that GM will come back to haunt us with a vengeance. :(

                                                   PREMTAL

[PREMTAL]

Hi KevB,
             Sorry for straying from the original subject matter to which I unfortunately can't assist. ::)

                                                       PREMTAL

[Derek]

Hi Kevb

I am still trying to persuade the various cats in my neighbourhood that the patch of grass between my front door and where I park my car is NOT a toilet.

I have tried most of the various ploys suggested on this thread and others but as yet have not been successful.. the little blighter is still at it.

Interestingly enough the comment about citrus fruit as a deterent is the method I am using at present...I sprayed the lawned area which is being continually polluted lightly with a citrus odour control product...its early days yet BUT so far so good.

I will keep you informed... I haven't tried the electrified fence yet ... there has to be a way

Derek

[hemajo]

We renovated a patio up in our garden recently, and hubby wanted gravel, in his wisdom!  well, our cat and all the rest in the neighbourhood immediately used it as a toilet.  I bought some cat-off pellets at the local garden centre (which smelt to me of citronella).  Very sceptical about whether they would work, and first day after, there was a deposit.  However, there haven't been any more since :)  So is it a coincidence, or have they actually worked?

[john_miller]

I don't know what the legal basis is, but GM varieties are definitely patented. There's been all sorts of argument about stray seed; is the guy who has a few on his farm infringing the patent, and are the GM companies liable if the farmer loses organic status due to GM accidentals?

My post in no-dig reminded me to add to this post. Monsanto did not just patent the seed they patented the gene itself. The practical consequence of this is that any plant that is exhibiting characteristics considered desireable, even if independent of the implanted gene, found to have these patented genes in it becomes the property of Monsanto. This is even extends to chance seedlings found in a hedge. If they had simply patented the seeds then farmers, in theory, could simply save seed from year to year (only theoretically as genes are only implanted in F₁ hybrids).
One farmer who did save his own seed and who challenged Monsanto over the legality of their patent, in contrast to the many who chose to pay Monsanto, has his story told here:
http://www.percyschmeiser.com/conflict.htm

[Robert_Brenchley]

Thanks; I had seen that before, but didn't know what the result was. At least he didn't have to pay them in the end. The other side of their 'ownership' of the gene is, if I'm an organic farmer, and my business is ruined because I lose my organic status due to their accidentals, I can presumably sue them. I don't think we've heard the last of this one!

[return of the mac]

Wow- complicated, patenting plants seems a bit silly to me, i mean coudnt very very slight genetic variance between generations of plants bypass such laws, they cant keep track of seeds and inadvertant growth from them- after all the plants do the work, growers simply provide an environment for them.
And cats- oh dont get me started- woudnt domesticate any animal- ultimately they are wild animals- owners should need a permit to prove responsibility for them.

[john_miller]

they cant keep track of seeds and inadvertant growth from them

They, Monsanto, can. They do too. The article mentions that, as far as the farmer was concerned, Monsantos checkers trespassed on his land to get the plant samples necessary to verify that his crops contained their patented genetic material.