Topic: Coyotes

[GrannieAnnie]

A neighbor called last evening to say she'd been talking with a deer hunter in the woods near us who had seen and showed her pictures of 6 coyotes he'd just seen. 10 years ago there weren't any in our state but they've slowly been moving in. Bad news for pet owners since they'll eat just about anything from birdseed, grasshoppers, cats, dogs, to deer and sheep. I'm wondering if we've seen them at night but mistook them for foxes.


http://www.fw.delaware.gov/Hunting/Pages/Coyotes.aspx

[Bugloss2009]

if we had ferocious animals suddenly moving into our area, and the state government advice on how to deal with them was - make a loud noise, or throw a rock at it, the newspapers would go absolutely crazy  ;D

I expect you Delawarians are a tough lot

[1066]

I guess you could have mistaken them for foxes GA. I thought the advice to look at them through binoculars and not feeding them was pertinent! Could they cause much damage to your garden?

[OllieC]

If they're such good scavengers & breeders, why are they so rare? Have they been heavily controlled in the past? I did like the "throw a rock at them" tip but I reckon the RSPCA would complain about such advice over here. They do sound like a bit of a menace, although one of them down the allotment might keep the rats, tree rats & flying rats away.

[Paulines7]

Rather you than me Grannie Annie, having coyotes on your doorstep.   :o

[GrannieAnnie]

I don't think anyone here would call a coyote "ferocious"!  :D They wouldn't charge after you to attack the way mountain lions and bear do.  They are wily (Wily Coyote cartoon character) and wary, at least in the East...so far. 

They were a western animal- where they've been heavily hunted yet still reign due to their ability to adapt and have large litters, but they have steadily moved eastward I'm guessing for the culture  ;). Or because they have no enemy here like wolves, except man.

So explain this: in England, if you DID have a ferocious breed of animal move into a developed area and it endangered people, what would the authorities and newspapers advise to protect yourself and children from attack while eg. out on a walk in the woods?  Carry a knife, gun, or climb a tree. Or be attacked and afterwards call the authorities?

[Bugloss2009]

  Carry a knife, gun, or climb a tree.

a knife? A gun? are you mad! I don't even thing we're allowed to climb trees anymore...

I think it would be generally decided that Something Must Be Done, without specifying who or what should be doing it ( so long as it was somebody else doing it and not us)

[OllieC]

Every school day for over a month, my children have had to wade through a river of sewage from a broken sewer near the school gate. Along with a number of other parents, I have spent ages talking to different people and different authorities/companies to try to get it fixed. It may now be mended by the end of this week, 6 weeks after first being reported to Thames Water. This is Britain. These are our values. So, if we had wild monsters in Britain, what would happen? Everyone would find someone else to blame. Call centres would put you on hold. Tabloids would blame immigrants. And we would be eaten.

[GrannieAnnie]

Every school day for over a month, my children have had to wade through a river of sewage from a broken sewer near the school gate. Along with a number of other parents, I have spent ages talking to different people and different authorities/companies to try to get it fixed. It may now be mended by the end of this week, 6 weeks after first being reported to Thames Water. This is Britain. These are our values. So, if we had wild monsters in Britain, what would happen? Everyone would find someone else to blame. Call centres would put you on hold. Tabloids would blame immigrants. And we would be eaten.

Where are the Winston Churchills when you need them? ??? Sounds like it is time for a major shake-up if they won't deal with a simple sewer line.

I guess here someone would have sued by now which gets action but is an unfortunate way to deal with problems. Or the local senator would be called to apply pressure. And the news media would certainly be in on the free-for-all. And the parents would be interviewed about whether their child was ill due to possible typhoid from the sewage. And Themes Water would have pickets marching at their gates daily and LOTS of bad press. I hope it is resolved for you soon.

[Robert_Brenchley]

I have a friend who watches mountain lion; he says they're extremely shy, very hard to get near, and completely unlike their image. The same could be said for wolves, the only 'ferocious' animal that anyone's suggested reintroducing here. I'd be all in favour; they're needed to control the deer in the Highlands. But I can't see it happening.

[GrannieAnnie]

I have a friend who watches mountain lion; he says they're extremely shy, very hard to get near, and completely unlike their image. The same could be said for wolves, the only 'ferocious' animal that anyone's suggested reintroducing here. I'd be all in favour; they're needed to control the deer in the Highlands. But I can't see it happening.

But mountain lion do chase people, even bikers have been killed, read of a case in California. The trick is to not run. Or be scared. Ha ha.

[GrannieAnnie]

http://tchester.org/sgm/lists/lion_attacks_ca.html

above has some very interesting reading about documented mountain lion attacks in
California.  start reading around 1994 when the attacks seemed to pick up.

[Robert_Brenchley]

I think that bears out what I said; there are very few attacks until recent years. Something's changed; maybe they're becoming acclimatised to humans as the population rises?

[GrannieAnnie]

I think that bears out what I said; there are very few attacks until recent years. Something's changed; maybe they're becoming acclimatised to humans as the population rises?

One theory is that the deer have moved into the suburbs as their habitat has diminished and the mountain lion are following the deer. Unfortunately hikers and bikers on lonely trails are easy pickings.

As far as the attack numbers go, surely in those earlier years some folk just plain disappeared in  the wilderness  after an attack and left no trace to be documented.

We have Pennsylvania friends who live in a 1700's house where the first owner was killed by a mountain lion (stated on his tombstone.)

As far as reintroducing the wolf, probably your sheep and dairy farmers would have a fit. We've heard ranchers talk about their stock being attacked in areas where the wolf has been reintroduced, but the game wardens are reluctant to admit it is a problem. 

[Robert_Brenchley]

That's why there's a problem. If you go to the Highlands, it's mostly open moor, with forestry plantations surrounded by massive deer fences while the trees are young. If you look at the little islands on the lochs, you'll see a hint of the natural vegetation; pine forest. The trees were cut down in the 17th and 18th Centuries for charcoal (I've seen stumps in the bogs which still bear the marks on the axe), wolves were exterminated at the same time, and overgrazing has prevented regeneration, as well as causing serious soil erosion in places. The sheep farmers would be up in arms though.

[GrannieAnnie]

That's why there's a problem. If you go to the Highlands, it's mostly open moor, with forestry plantations surrounded by massive deer fences while the trees are young. If you look at the little islands on the lochs, you'll see a hint of the natural vegetation; pine forest. The trees were cut down in the 17th and 18th Centuries for charcoal (I've seen stumps in the bogs which still bear the marks on the axe), wolves were exterminated at the same time, and overgrazing has prevented regeneration, as well as causing serious soil erosion in places. The sheep farmers would be up in arms though.

Sounds similar to our problem. Where we live, in the 1600s was thick wilderness right up to the ocean practically. The Indians cleared out under the tree canopy somewhat for agriculture, then when white man came he cleared off most of the trees for farming, essentially scalping the land and the thick topsoil vanished leaving us with our bad clay sub-soil. Some has been re-forested but the soil will never be the same.  It seems impossible to move backwards ecologically sad to say now that mankind has spread out (short of a massive pandemic which I'm not promoting.). Re-introducing species=different set of problems.

[Unwashed]

I was involved with a software company from Colorado and the main man there was quite inspirational (and completely weired from an English perspective) and he would read passages of stories he'd written in between sections of a lecture.  One of his central themes was Coyotes, and it seems these creatures have something of a mythology, though I don't think it's easy to understand it without understanding so much more about the history and geography of that bit of North America.  I'd like to understand more.

And much as I like the idea of wild animals, I'm very happy that we don't have anything more dangerous than foxes and badgers in the British Isles - though I did get chased by a pheasant last year.

[GrannieAnnie]

I was involved with a software company from Colorado and the main man there was quite inspirational (and completely weired from an English perspective) and he would read passages of stories he'd written in between sections of a lecture.  One of his central themes was Coyotes, and it seems these creatures have something of a mythology, though I don't think it's easy to understand it without understanding so much more about the history and geography of that bit of North America.  I'd like to understand more.

And much as I like the idea of wild animals, I'm very happy that we don't have anything more dangerous than foxes and badgers in the British Isles - though I did get chased by a pheasant last year.

Maybe he iinserted coyote data to wake up those sleeping through software?