Topic: Saddening

[ACE]

Although the Lady did me no favours, I find some of the comments in the press and on line about Maggie Thatcher quite offensive. Lets all remember she has a grieving family. I have family who were miners, friends who died in the Falklands, I worked 3 jobs to keep my head above water. I now pay the fat cats in public utilities vast bonuses. But If she had not done it somebody else would have instead. Bitter yes, but not vindictive.

[betula]

My heart bleeds for her ACE

[daveyboi]

I also initially took that view with some of the quite spiteful comments around.

However after sleeping on it I guess it proves that she really believed in what she was doing and the divisions in opinion that still survive today shows her iron will in carrying out her ideas never wavered.

[OllieC]

My heart bleeds for her ACE

I can hear it from here! I actually find the fawning from Labour MPs and others who should know better the most nauseating.

Here's a challenge though - let's see how long we can keep this discussion the shed! 

[Digeroo]

Not a fan at all. But at least they can now stop wheeling out a look a like on her birthday. 

She had dementia.  Are her family grieving?  I was very happy when my mother finally died, it is not a nice way to go. 

But I am not sure that I agree that now is the time to put the knife in.

I am more concerned with what is happening now we cannot change the past.

[goodlife]

I do have to say, that as a woman and getting where she was and staying in office as long as she did, is quite achievement...does make you wonder what price she had to pay for it in personal level.
But what she did while she was in charge is another matter. It was all before my time here in UK..but effects are still clearly seen and felt even now. In midlands where her decisions ruined many lives, feelings towards her are still bubbling under the surface..it don't take much talking and the steam is out! Not much sympathy feelings when listing people talking about her.

 

I am more concerned with what is happening now we cannot change the past.

Yes...my thoughts too.

[galina]

This is a little story one of our local councillors used to tell ..................

Councillor Maye Dicks started from humble beginnings as a worker in the shoe industry.  She later became a Labour councillor, town councillor, county councillor, had a street named after her and got an MBE shortly before she passed on.  She was very plain spoken if she wanted to. 

When Maye was a child, every summer holiday a girl used to stay in the neighbourhood.  "She was a right stuck up cow even then, was into everything and didn't take no for an answer", so Maye told us.  One day the girl fell into a pond and Maye (who was a few years older) struggled to pull her out.  The girl was ok.  Her name was Margret and had she not been ok, things could have been very different!

As for Maye's hard work in the Labour party?  As she put it with a twinkle in her eye: "I am still doing penance!"

 

[rosebud]

 Well said Ace, mrs Thatcher did some things wrong . She also did somethings right she made other countries stand up & take notice of us  for the better.
If a good person does something bad, it does not make them bad it makes them human.
All my Northern family were miners. I do take the view that respect should be shown the woman has a family.

[star]

I certainly didn't agree with all her policies and such a lot of what she did was not beneficial to poorer families, and the country. BUT you have to admire this woman's determination and grit. She was a strong lady who would not be swayed from a decision made.

I do admire her in that respect.

[Nigel B]

 "There's no such thing a society" she said, as she set about dismantling it.
A lot of the vitriol and the glee shown over her death should be directed at Thatcherism, which is still in rude health.

[Chrispy]

Most of the bad things that Maggie is getting the blame for were going to happen anyway.
Face it, it was the 70's when this country fell apart.

Yes, you can blame some of today's problems with the extreme Thatcherite policies, but it was TB and GB that reintroduced those policies, so don't go blaming today's problems on what happened decades ago.

Just be grateful and let the woman lie in peace.

[OllieC]

I don't think I've ever read a post that I disagree with quite as much as that Chrispy! Still, each to their own.

[ACE]

I don't disagree Chrispy, I was there. Although I do not agree with the disrepect with a lot of people venting their spleen. A lot of people where affected badly by some of the actions. But lets remember, she did not do it on her own, she headed a govenment. I am a bit peeved at the funeral arrangements though. I am wondering if it will also be a day for slipping some bad news by us, hoping we will not notice. One thing I do remember about the times was the cost of living rises. Nearly every month we had a rise.

[Obelixx]

OllieC you are far too young to have any memory of how dire it was in the 70s.  Nothing was working very well.  nationalised industries all thought they had a job for life and didn't need to worry about paying their way, using public money efficiently or using a costs and profits sheet to see just how much public money they were pouring down the drain.  Productivity was low, strikes were rampant, manufatcturing quality was bad and services were poor - all under labour governments who couldn't face up to the economic facts or manage foreign policy that well.

Margaret Thatcher came along and gave hope and aspiration to people who wanted something better for themselves and their families and restored public and international confidence in GB plc.    She made mistakes - but who doesn't?   Funds raised from selling off council houses should have gone to building more housing stock.  Funds raised from selling off the utilities should have gone to better infrastructure such as roads and more modern railway tracks.  Funds raised from selling off the mines could have gone to retraining people for other jobs.

She conributed a great deal towards bringing down the iron curtain and communism and left the UK in good financial heart.  It took years of Labour to bring the economy to its knees again with high inflation and lack of investment in infrastructure, education, training and poor job prospects and job security, failed government agencies such as Border Control and the financial services authority and no money left in the national coffers to turn this around.   Compare the UK at present with other EU countries and see what the prospects are for its children.   The UK has the fewest people staying in education after 16, the highest rate of teenage pregnancy, the highest rates of teenage binge drinking.  A fine legacy for Tony Blair and Gordon Brown.

You don't have to like or approve of Margaret Thatcher to recognise that she got a lot right and believed in what she did.  Today's politicians on both sides are mere boys by comparison.

[OllieC]

Meh, whatever. I didn't like the 80's much and I blame her for the poverty I saw. You can have a lengthy debate about politics on a gardening forum if you want, I'm not going to!

[Chrispy]

I don't understand the funeral arrangements either.
I thought politicians do not get state funerals, and her own wishes were not to have a state funeral.

Why they are giving her a funeral that is like a state funeral in all but name, I have no idea.

She has a statue, that is enough, we don't need a load of pomp.

[Nigel B]

I'm old enough to remember the 70's Obelix, but I'm not able to recall it through the same political filter as you seem to.
I remember jobs aplenty. Being able to leave one job on a Friday and find another by the following Monday was something we joked about. Skilled labour was something we were particularly good at. We led the world in engineering, marine and aeronautical skills. Thanks to the unions, we no longer had to tug the forelock to the works owner to beg permission to work for a pittance and without a thought for your safety or old age.

Then what happened, wasn't anything to do with your petty inter-party politics. In fact, it was the opposite.
It was the rise of the most vile creature yet. The modern career politician.
When business adds money to politics, that's when it all goes to hell in a hand-basket.

Where we are now is not due to one party or another, its due to career politicians simply taking their turn to make themselves rich under the guise of politicking. They lie, cheat, steal, make war, all for profit. The result is that's wrong with this country is rampant, unchecked Capitalism, or 'greed' as it used to be called. There isn't even a f*g-paper's width between the so-called parties.
The whole system is broken, and no amount of voting, be it for Labour, Tory, Lib-Dem or the bloody Popcorn Party is going to help.
Voting is something I have done at every opportunity since 1974. Not now though. I can no longer, in all good conscience, take part in what has become a circus.
To watch a prime minister standing up in the House of Commons knowingly lying to the house so as not to admit his/party's failings, is beyond a joke. Way beyond.
The next voting I'll do is with my feet. I'll gladly march to join others to bring down and replace this current state of affairs to a close. I'll do what I can to bring the real culprits to justice.
I'll do what I can to help replace failed capitalism with something a lot closer to a participatory democracy. But vote? Naah!

Viva la revolution!

[caroline7758]

Let me know where and when, Nigel!

[Borlotti]

I agree with Chrispy, fed up with hearing about it.  It should be a private funeral, and no statue. Anyone with any brain/common sense will expect trouble on Wednesday.  She was old, she died, don't agree with all this big funeral.  Only another 6 days to get through with all the radio/TV/paper coverage.  Hopefully next week, if the weather is good, can go to the allotment and not listen to any of it.  As my old gran used to say, give me flowers when I am alive, I will not appreciate them when I am dead, and we always gave her flowers. Maggie is dead, so what a load of fuss and waste of money.

[Chrispy]

I've got to watch the funeral, the chance to see Jeremy Clarkson in something other than jeans is too good an opportunity to miss.