Topic: Banned from allotment

[flytrapman]

A few months ago the local council said I was acting illegally by composting without a licence
Following a inspection by the environment agency and postings on this forum the council admitted I was not breaking any laws and did not need any composting licences

I made complaints that the council had failed to apply for licences for their own allotments which they admitted
The council have now complained to the local church who own the allotments

I have now received a letter from the church stating I am banned from the allotments and I have to leave by the 16th February
The letter states I am being banned because I have failed to sign new rules the church warden implemented without any consultation's - It also states there is no appeal to this decision

The letter fails to state what rules I have broken or what the complaints where
They have never wrote to me before and the vicar or church warden have refused to discuss the matter

I have sent an email to the NALSG as I am a member

Any advice or comments would be appreciated

[lewic]

Do you have a letter stating you are composting without a licence? If it was me I'd take it to the local paper. Sounds like the idiots in charge have made their decision, but at least you would be publicly shaming them.

[cambourne7]

nothing to add really only to say how sad for you and how wrong and unfair this is?

Have other allotment holders signed up to these new rules? Was there a warning?

Why is there no appeal?

Where was this decsion taking have you requested minutes of the meeting where this happened?

[pumkinlover]

I do not understand this at all, I know there was something about manure movement a few years ago which seems to have died the death, but doesn't everyone compost. don't the councils encourage it by providing cheap "daleks" like ours did a few years ago. Isn't it supposed to reduce greenhouse gases and landfill ???
good luck Anne

[flytrapman]

Hi
Thanks for your responses
I had a meeting with the council around 10 days ago with their environmental team and the legal department - The environment agency attended as well
I had made FOI requests to the council but they are refusing to release any data
I then made a Data Protection Subject Access request which they eventually released info after kicking and screaming

I found some data which concerned me including a email from the council and the church warden admitted the new rules could not be enforced as he had implemented them on his own back
The council conceded that I had broke no laws and thy had broke them on there own allotments
I asked the council to inform the church that I had not breached any laws because I was concerned that they where not telling the church the truth

I have asked the main vicar for information about complaints but he refused
I am a member of the church and have moved all the grass clippings from the church to compost for the last 2 years
I also dismantled a old rotten greenhouse from the vicarage and tidied up without any thanks
Some of the other plot holders have not grown anything for years, others have large numbers of poultry which are against the rules yet the main vicar refused to discuss this with me
Another vicar who used to have a plot stopped me yesterday and said he was concerned at how they where treating one of the church members and said the rules should of been debated before they where implemented and appears to want to help
I have no intention of giving up the allotment

[goodlife]

Could the be any chance that the main vicar has relation who is after a allotment?
How about making some 'noise' about the vicar...or even complain to his superiors..(I'm not talking about praying..don't go to the ultimate boss yet :-X)he is not behaving like man in his position should >:(

[Robert_Brenchley]

If he's a C of E vicar, complain to the bishop. Banning you amounts to an eviction - maybe you could use the courts? Why did they think you needed a license to make compost on an allotment?

[flytrapman]

Hi
The local paper had already contacted me regarding the local council
I had arranged to see my local MP today regarding the council and she has agreed to write to the church
To clarify the licence issue it is around exemption certificates for composting - The local council (Wigan) deliver me and other plot holders leaves we also get grass clippings from the Wigan Leisure & Culture Trust who carry out all the grass cutting for the council they have also been delivering woodchip as well
The council stopped the delivery from WLCT but have been delivering leaves all the time probably because they do not have composting facilities and have to pay land fill fees
I get leaves, woodchip and grass clippings delivered to another plot on a different site which is owned by the Council and although the council have no exemption certificate they have not said anything about this
It is a C of E church and I have been advised to contact the Arch Deacon
The problems with the church started when the new warden increased the rents by 300% without any consultation

[chriscross1966]

Poultry is not against the rules, you have a statutory right to keep hens on an allotment and there's little anyone can do about it, doesn't matter what they want to write down in the tenancy it's in the allotments legislation..... Cockerels on the other hand they can get a noise complaint against.

[cornykev]

Maybe the vicar's on the nelson and your spoiling his bunce making.   :-X :-X :-X

[flytrapman]

The new rules dont ban poultry they say enough to feed a family of four and give a guideline of 4 birds
Some of the plot holders have up to 30
Some keep pigeons and whilst I am not keen on them I am aware they have been kept on the plots for over fifty years
I always thought I got on with the vicar but believe he is backing his new warden
I have the backing of a previous warden

[Fork]

Poultry is not against the rules, you have a statutory right to keep hens on an allotment and there's little anyone can do about it, doesn't matter what they want to write down in the tenancy it's in the allotments legislation..... Cockerels on the other hand they can get a noise complaint against.

This is very interesting to read......and if I can I will be getting a few hens myself I think...well I would like too!

[Unwashed]

Very well done flytrapman for using the FOI and asserting your rights - if everyone did this the tyrants wouldn't even try!

Can you post the letter that purports to ban you please?

Basically the situation is this:

You can't be banned from your allotment.  Your landlord has an implicit obligation to give you access.  It's important that you ignore any ban and continue to use your allotment just as you always do because you don't want to do anything that might look like you have surrenderd your tenancy - so for example, never, ever give the site keys back however much your landlord blusters.

Your landlord is only able to change the site rules within very narrow margins, and only if the tenancy agreement makes very specific allowances for just those changes.  So if for example the tenancy agreement says that the landlord is able to change the rules to comply with new environmental legislation then it would be legitimate to make a new rule about bringing onto site material to compost, but the rule would still have to be introduced with enough notie for you to quit your plot in good order (which is probably a minimum of 12 months notice), and it wouldn't be retrospective.  But if the tenancy agreement contains a general provision for the landlord to change the rules the term is unfair under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 and any new rule is unenforceable. 

If the agreement doesn't say anything about making new rules then any new rule is also unenforceable.

A landlord is always able to give notice to terminate your tenancy (a minimum of 12 months notice expiring on the last day of the tenancy year) and then offer you a new tenancy on new terms with new rules.

To evict you for breaking a rule the landlord must comply with S.146 Law of Property 1925 which says you have to be given written notice of exactly what rule you're breaking and given enough time to put the matter right, and if you put it right in a reasonable time you can't be evicted.

None of that stops ignorant and/or tyranical landlords trying it on, and if they wan't listen to reason (and tyrants seldom do) then your choice is either to stand your ground or capitulate and leave - which you chose is always up to you because no one will fight your battle for you.  But it helps to know your rights.

[PeterVV]

Well this does sound downright un christian to me, and very underhanded, like there is a hidden agenda here...
I hope you suceed , and common sense prevails through these bully boy tactics.

[Robert_Brenchley]

Some of the most unchristian behaviour I've ever seen has been in churches! They're like any other voluntary group, they're vulnerable to inadequate little so-and-so's who want to build little empires for themselves, and award themselves a bit of petty power.

[grannyjanny]

Sunday Christians?

[Unwashed]

In fairness I think you'll find the church has something of a tradition of kicking people out of their gardens for breaking the rules whereof they were told not to break.

[flytrapman]

I will try and get the letter scanned and uploaded but it will take a few days
I did point out to the vicar how during the service he tells the congregation to shake each others hand and offer the hand of friendship. His reply was this conversation is going know where and he terminated the phone call
I have no intention of vacating the plots, once you see the letter you will realise that they did not take legal advice
My friend who is 79 and has had a plot on the site for over 20 years has been sent the same letter
I am still struggling with the council trying to get them disclose information from my subject access request

[tonybloke]

In fairness I think you'll find the church has something of a tradition of kicking people out of their gardens for breaking the rules whereof they were told not to break.

rofl!!

[sunloving]

Hi Sorry to hear that you have had such unfair and unreasonable treatment from your allotment goveners.

Hopefully the letter they recived from your MP and the environment agency will alter thier attitude.

But it sounds like these people are more concerned about you obeying thier power than running the allotments fairly and all to often in situations like this where ignorant people have power , fighting their judgement will make them act even more despotic and even if you win the day they will find every opportunity to harrange you in the future. So consider your future  really well have a look around at other sites and have a plan b. Not all allotment sites are run by power mad emotional morons and maybe finding a new site would make your time on the plot much less stressful.

fight a good fight but protect yourself to.
good luck
x sunloving