Topic: Allotment association and insurance

[pumkinlover]

We have been members of the NSALG for about 6 years and have insurance through them.
They have changed who provides the policy which means for what we require a hefty hike in premium.

I have been asked to look at other providers and one option is the Allotment and Gardens council uk.

I wonder if any of you have experience of this group. I have been looking at past posts about NSALG and note there is a wide variation in opinions about them. (As there are most things on this forum!) I have my own opinion and would not feel particularly upset to move to another association.

However I want to do what is right for our allotment members, some of whom have great reservations about parting with "brass".  But to me the main thing is that the committee and trustees are protected from liabilty claims.

I originally had reservations about going with this "breakaway" group, but have heard good reports locally.

Any help appreciated. :-\

Anne x

[saddad]

Unless they have stayed with "BlueFin" or whatever the NSALG insurers were called then they are likely to be exactly the same terms/premium's as the NSALG... they have been since they set up. I spent a lot of time looking for an alternative insurer but nobody... not even the NFU would take allotments... but that was about 5 years ago..  :-X

[pumkinlover]

Hi Saddad,
NSALG are still with Blufin but they are just the brokers and instead of using AXA they have moved to HISCOX.

The premium rates are now in option blocks which means in order to get the bits you want you have to pay for other bits you may not want or need.

Allotment and Garden council use Russel Scanlan amd I am awaiting info. from them but from what I hear you can just pick the bits you require. Will know more than when the info. comes.

Also membership for Allot and garden council is half price of NSALG. Personally I am happy to pay to ensure that we get the correct level of cover. but some people are not so keen.

Another thing is that NSALG say that you need Employer liability insurance if you do any work for the association, this bumps up the price, while I agree that is something we should have (but haven;t yet) The All. and garden guy says that you can just insure the people who actively work on behalf of the association. This would be a lot cheaper for us! ;)

If you want any other insurance such as for equipment or site buildings you HAVE to have the Employers's liabilty
then you are talking nearly £270.  Getting the"old timers" to agree to this would be difficult nigh impossible.

Hence I am looking for a cheaper option.

Hope this makes sense.
Anne

[saddad]

As I'm not the treasurer this year I haven't done our insurance... but NSALG were with Scanlan a few years ago  and I thought BlueFin had taken them over... if you aren't paying anyone you don't need Employer's Liability. The AGC is run by a man who used to be Treasurer(?) for the NSALG so got the same deal when he went independent. If they can do it cheaper now I'd like to know so we can cut the bill too.  :-\

[Trevor_D]

I spent a long time looking around for alternative insurance options a couple of years ago and couldn't find a better one. We introduced a supplement of £4 for each member, regardless of how much land they had, to cover NSALG affiliation and insurance. We have had no complaints from any of our 90-plus members. At the AGM we explained why this was necessary and gave members the option to simply incorporate it into the general rent, but the opinion was that it was a fair and transparent way of doing things.

Last summer, we received Lottery funding for a composting toilet. Part of the deal was that it had to be insured, so our premiums have gone up. This year we're increasing the supplement to £5 to cover this. But, in return, members are covered when they are doing working parties, all communal buildings & equipment are insured, and the Society has insurance when we attend outside events like school fairs and community Fun Days. And if members order from King's Seeds they can recoup the £5.

Don't try to grub around saving a few quid - that's just what the politicians are doing to the country - but get decent insurance.

[pumkinlover]

Thanks for the replies.

The first point I have to make is it is me acting as secretary who is trying to find a cheaper-but still good quote.  (There are still a number of the "old timers" who have been told in the past that  insurance is not necessary)

It is now impossible to have anything other than basic public liabilty insurance without having the Employer liablity from NSALG- that is how the new company works. That takes insurance up to £170.

If you want to insure a building or anything else you are in the next option block which is nearly £270.

Also from what I have read in NSALG mags and the insurance stuff in the past it appears (To me) that they are saying that you should have Employers liability even if it is a volunterr work party. That means anyone doing any work for the allotments should have this.

Along with the NSALG membership fees it puts the cost up.  As I say I (anne) am happy to pay what is needed for something so precious as my plot, and to protect other people from the fear of being sued. But as secretary I have been asked to look at other options, and like most secretarys I have to work with the rest of the committee and get everything past at the AGM.

Sorry I have rambled on and on. 

I have asked if anyone has experience of AGC, a big site near here is happy to use them and they use another insurance company who are sending me info. so I will be able tomake comparisons. Iwas not happy at first to go with a break away group-i've been asked to get cheaper insurance in the past.

Thanks for being my sounding board!

[tonybloke]

Hi Anne,
I'm the Secretary of our Allotment Association, and have been looking at this very issue for a while.
After a lot of research, our association has decided to join the RHS, and take advantage of their insurance scheme (saving over £150 per yr)

for details contact the RHS (affiliated societies)
http://www.rhs.org.uk/Gardening/Community-gardening/RHS-affiliated-societies/Benefits-of-RHS-affiliation

rgds, Tony

[Alpud]

I have just registered as a new user because of this correspondence - thanks for all the info.

As secretary of our new association just outside Plymouth, I too have been going through this headache, and am also waiting a response from Scanlon. I had worked out a rough premium from their proposal form some time ago and it worked out more expensive than the new Hiscox policy for less cover. We were therefore happy to go with the revised Hiscox policy until I received the proposal yesterday. Our new community shed will not be covered for storm damage as it is wooden - a serious exclusion I feel, and one that I want to try and address.

I agree with Pumpkinlover - it is very wise to have employers liability even if you just 'organise' a working party.

I have just tried to find out about the RHS scheme (tonybloke) but got lost trying to work our what was required! I did ask the local NFU bloke to quote. Very pleasant but after investigating the answer was no.


Please let me know if any of you get any more info., advice, or results. Thanks

[pumkinlover]

Thanks for reply TonyBloke I will tel. RHS tomorrow.

Alpud -good to see you joined having seen this thread, lots of helpful people on here.

I will keep posting as I get more info.
One of the things I suspect is that because we are a relatively small association  that the insurance is disproportionally a large sum of money, as it is spread between less members.

Anne

[Sinbad7]

We've been with the RHS for years now.  This year we paid £91 for £2 million cover including Employer's Liability.  You have to join the RHS and become affiliated to them.

You do get a few perks for your members i.e. a free day at Wisley for 50 members or if you have any queries/problems with soil/ pests and diseases they are really very helpful.  Choices of heritage seeds, cheaper tickets for Chelsea Flower Show etc.

Sinbad

[kNOTWEED]

Hi this is my first post on this forum and I would like to thank everybody  for their input on this topic

My society is in the same positions as pumpkinlovers. I  have just received the latest proposal form for our insurance from blue fin only to find out that  just to keep the same level of insurance as last year our insurance will rise from about £130 to just under £270.

To make this worse our trading hut is of wooden construction so would not be covered. ours is a small society of less than 30 members. I will look into  joining the RHS to use their scheme

I don't at present want to leave NSALG as Our society may be needing their legal guidance This is because Barnet council are looking into handing all control  and responsibilities of its 51 allotment sites over to the individual societies so it looks like the next 18 months are going to be interesting 

Thanks again for a great forum.     

[Susiebelle]

We also moved to the RHS 18mths ago, couldn't find any cover as comprehensive at the price any where else and as Sinbad7 says 'nice perks'

[saddad]

Welcome to A4A kNOTWEED... hope you stick around like your namesake!
You don't have to take the insurance and can still be in the NSALG...  :)

[tonybloke]

Welcome to A4A kNOTWEED... hope you stick around like your namesake!
You don't have to take the insurance and can still be in the NSALG...  :)

welcome to a4a from me as well!

as David says,you can be members of NSALG and the RHS at same time!! (our association is) rgds, Tony

[kt.]

Interesting thread.  Just passed this to our treasurer.   ;)

[pumkinlover]

The research has been done and I now have compared all three posible choices and how it works for our associaton
32 plots but 40 members. I've sent  copy to each member of the committee so they can see the pros and cons.  there are advantages and disadvantages which ever way.
If any one wants a copy send me a PM., but obviously the costings for membership depends on the no. of members at least for NSALG and the AGC, but not for RHS.

Anne x

[pumkinlover]

Well I sent all the information to the comittee members and the majority choice was the AGC uk, and their insurers Russell Scanlan.  Time will tell if we have made the right choice.  As it is we are paying less than we did last year with NSALG and got more insurance for our money. The problem is you only know if you have made a good choice when you need to claim or have problems! and you hope that does not happen!
When I first posted it was in the hope that someone would have had direct experience of AGCuk and give me some feedback, but it seems not.  So I will let you know my impressions later on.
Anne

[Nigel B]

Thanks for the information Anne. I have passed it on to our treasurer and he's now looking into it.
Good and useful thread!

[Andrew J]

I would like clarify a few inaccuracies within this thread.
Russell Scanlan are an independent insurance broker based in Nottingham and have had a long association with the Allotment and Gardens Council and the provision of insurance cover for allotment holders through out the UK.
We have never had an involvement with the NSALG.
Our premiums start at £55 + Insurance Premium Tax for Public and Products Liability cover with a £5 million limit, cover automatically includes legal expenses cover.
We can provide cover for sheds and other similar structures of timber construction and other than Public / Products Liability cover we do not insist on any other covers beng purchased allowing clients and potential clients to select the cover that they require.
More information can be found at :
http://www.rsib.co.uk/The-Allotments-Insurance-Scheme_3_0_15_23_info.html

[Unwashed]

I am not sure of all the ins and outs, but I see SWCAA offer allotment insurance for public and product liability along with employer's liability for named voluntary work-gang leaders, all thrown in for their £3-00 annual membership, though there may be a registration charge for the employer's liability certificate.
For groups of 61 members or more this reduces to to £2-50 per person, and for groups over 250 there may be further reductions as well.  As I say the details can I think be got from their web site swcaa.com.uk. where you can e-mail or phone them.

Senex, what's your connection with SWCAA?  Not that it's anything to do with me, but if this is an infomercial then 1. I hope you're paying Dan a fee, and 2.  it's a bit underhand isn't it?

Sorry and welcome and everything if it just happens that your first two posts (in the boards I see) happen to promote SWCAA.   :)