Topic: Aminopyralloid 1 year on

[sunloving]

Hi All ,
Well springs here and everywhere we look new things are comming up and into bloom lovely. But for all those who are looking out on bare beds after the gift from dow (aminopyraloid) I m wondering if anyone has new signs of recovery. At our house we've just started a little experiment with runner bean seeds comparing how they grow on soil for affected and unaffected soil. Is anyone else doing anything simular.
It would be really great to find out how fast things get back to normal.
Ill let you know when the results are in!
best wishes
Sunloving

[telboy]

????
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[sunloving]

Well we sort of forgot about these beans and they got a bit negelcted, however the negelect is the same accross treatments.

Our manure was already 6 months old when it went on. when the first symptoms hit we dug the beds over and since then it has been 12 months and about five dig overs. There isnt any sign of straw bits and the beans showed no difference in growth between soil from the infected and not infected.

However we are being very cautious and only planting out things that are already strong growers and have not proved previously susceptable like sweetcorn raspberries and rudbekia.

Another note of caution, the makers are watching these threads and any evidence to show that last years impacts are over will be used against us.
Also the pesticides agency say that there is no conclusive tests and the growth of broad beans is the standard test we should use to prove aminopyriloid damage. So take pictures of any suspect growth and send it in to them. becuase if you dont report a problem then one doesnt exist as far as they are concerned. 
Happy growing and fingers crossed
x sunloving

[Eristic]

Raspberries are severely stunted by the poison and it is only their inbuilt aggression that keeps them alive. Most areas of infected soil only recover quickly because the toxins are washed away into someone elses field or as in my case, the local reservoir. Where runoff is hindered due to geological or other conditions the toxins remain trapped.

I think that if the poison were to be brought back Dow may well find themselves being sued by neighbouring farmers as Smiths lovely hayfield could end up killing off Jones potato crop.

[sunloving]

in our garden as i said we lost beans potatoes and dahlias, the raspberries , begonias and rudbekias were as i said not susceptable.

[asbean]

Don't worry - they keep an eye on us - or rather their "agents" do:  They are
http://www.markmonitor.com/.

Take a look at their site - this is how big business crushes the little guys

[bigshod]

Sorry to hear about your problem. See my post on the potato query.

The stuff is still about and those not in the know from last year will be buying it in ignorance.

See item 5 on this link http://www.pesticides.gov.uk/acp.asp?id=2677 and worry! It may be back.

[staris]

surely they can't bring this back onto the market again  :(

[littlebabybird]

surely they can't bring this back onto the market again  :(

they can and they will
you have a voice, if you have been effected you need to report it
if people dont report then 'they' will continue to say not many people are effected
lbb

[staris]

i fully intend to report and complain about it i just want to be sure that what i've got is contaminated, i'm not at all happy about it i've got about 8 tons of it, which isn't going to easy to get rid of.

[Robert_Brenchley]

Write to your MP if they're not on the way out. They've got an incentive to listen at the moment!

[littlebabybird]

Minutes of the 337th meeting of the Advisory Committee on Pesticides (ACP) held on 12 May 2009





5. Agenda Item 5: Applications for the use of ‘Forefront’ and ‘Runway’ (now known as ‘Mileway’) water in oil emulsion formulations containing 30 g/l aminopyralid and 100 g/l fluroxypyr, as an agricultural herbicide and horticultural/industrial herbicide on grassland and amenity grassland [ACP 7 (337/2009)]
5.1 Members considered the applications for the re-instatement of approvals for products containing aminopyralid.

5.2 Members agreed that the applicant had taken all reasonable steps to manage manure contaminated with residues, through the proposed stewardship campaign, training and monitoring. However, there was some concern about the practicalities of the programme which would need to be addressed and closely monitored as part of the stewardship programme.

5.3 Members noted that aminopyralid was persistent in ground water, and that further confirmation of the effect of irrigating vulnerable crops from ground water sources was required.

5.4 Members were also concerned that approval in Europe could result in UK stewardship measures being by-passed. Further information was requested from the applicant about the level of approval and stewardship requirements across the EU

5.5 Subject to satisfactory resolution of these outstanding questions, members were minded to advise Ministers to re-instate approvals.

[thifasmom]

5.2 Members agreed that the applicant had taken all reasonable steps to manage manure contaminated with residues, through the proposed stewardship campaign, training and monitoring. However, there was some concern about the practicalities of the programme which would need to be addressed and closely monitored as part of the stewardship programme.

5.3 Members noted that aminopyralid was persistent in ground water, and that further confirmation of the effect of irrigating vulnerable crops from ground water sources was required.

5.4 Members were also concerned that approval in Europe could result in UK stewardship measures being by-passed. Further information was requested from the applicant about the level of approval and stewardship requirements across the EU

5.5 Subject to satisfactory resolution of these outstanding questions, members were minded to advise Ministers to re-instate approvals.

right so even after all their concerns they still are going to advise re-instatement..........what the F...... >:(

[sunloving]

This is really terrible news  >:(
Im going to write to my mp again.  ???
Makes me angry but also i fear that not many people reported thier damage so dow was right in saying it had very little impact on a few people.

Its a shock to find out about the contamination of water.
Did you all get the email from greenlane about possible damage from ground water on potato varieties?

For the future always test any manure you get with runner or broad beans before you put it on.becuase once its on your ground is contaminated for at least 12 months if not longer.

[timnsal]

Does this mean I won't be able to put guinea pig poo in the compost heap? They eat hay and if it comes from the petshop, it's not really possible to find out what's been done to it.

Sally

[glallotments]

Just to clarify the conundrum here on Green Lane.

We have one plot holder who has potatoes showing signs of herbicide poisoning as confirmed by the RHS.
The conundrum is that he hasn't used any manure or herbicide for that matter and just watered his plants. I'm not suggesting that the water is contaminated. If this was the case his other plants would be suffering too.

Just one of his two potato varieties are showing symptoms - Picasso.

Earlier on our plot we had potato shoots sprouting in last year's affected area (the inevitable missed potatoes) which showed symptoms of the contamination and I was worried that the ground may still be affected. However a DOW spokesperson said that it was likely that the daughter tubers had absorbed the residue and that was the cause of the problem. That seems likely as dahlias planted alongside these plants are fine. (at the moment).

Applying this information to my neighbour's problem I wondered if there was a chance that the seed potatoes that my neighbour bought were affected maybe at some stage in their growth cycle.

The RHS told me that they thought this was unlikely as the crop would have been discarded if that were the case and not certified. They went on to say that any potatoes stored or chitted in areas where a herbicide was stored may absorb vapours being given off by the herbicide.

My neighbour's plot has been fallow for a few years and he has only used Weedol on his plot. I don't really know what to make of all this to be honest and wonder if anyone else has potatoes that seem to have been affected by a hormonal herbicide but the source appears to be undetectable.

By the way I have had emails to my website from people who have been affected again this year and used contaminated manure.

http://www.glallotments.btik.com/p_Victims_2009.ikml
There are still gardeners, farmers and stable owners out there acquiring and supplying manure oblivious to the need for caution.

[chriscross1966]

5.2 Members agreed that the applicant had taken all reasonable steps to manage manure contaminated with residues, through the proposed stewardship campaign, training and monitoring. However, there was some concern about the practicalities of the programme which would need to be addressed and closely monitored as part of the stewardship programme.

5.3 Members noted that aminopyralid was persistent in ground water, and that further confirmation of the effect of irrigating vulnerable crops from ground water sources was required.

5.4 Members were also concerned that approval in Europe could result in UK stewardship measures being by-passed. Further information was requested from the applicant about the level of approval and stewardship requirements across the EU

5.5 Subject to satisfactory resolution of these outstanding questions, members were minded to advise Ministers to re-instate approvals.

right so even after all their concerns they still are going to advise re-instatement..........what the F...... >:(

I've just written to my MP, thankfully Dr Evan Harris is one of the few trained/qualified scientists in the Commons so I can use words longer than two syllables when trying to convey the issue.....

chrisc

[sunloving]

I just wrote to my MP Ben Wallace (Wyre) about this approval.
Ill let you know if anything happens.
x sunloving

[glallotments]

Latest information regarding ACP recommendation to reinstate the licence and also prosposed improved stewardship are posted on my website here http://www.glallotments.btik.com/p_herbicide_latest.ikml

[ceres]

Already posted here thanks.