Topic: potatoes: using supermarket spuds

[laurieuk]

When I was talking about disease I was talking of virus disease. Of course you can blight etc. on certified potatoes as they are fungal problems mainly airborne. If you cut every potato open you would not SEE a virus it effects the resulting crops.We are not here to disagree but to exchange ideas but your idea could be dangerous to others.

Phil Thats your pro-ogitive my friend and no offence taken.



I did not state my previous post was true, it is my opinion. What i based it on is, planting seed potato,s does not guarantee freedom from disease or disease causing agents or bacteria that is present or lying latent and can not be detected such as black leg or ring rot. Seed potatoes are examined for any outward signs of disease and a small persentage cut open for inward signs.
So the way i see it if i choose to buy some potatoes from a super market and check them for outward signs of decease i have much the same chance of getting a good crop as i would if i planted seed potato,s

[cornykev]

Conclusion to any that are unshore its better safe than SORRY. :'( ;D ;D ;D

[RobinOfTheHood]

I do wonder, though, how much of the worry about viruses is put out there by the seed companies, as they must make tens if not hundreds times more profit on seed potatoes than on eating spuds.

How did we get on before certified spuds were available? (hopefully someone out there is old enough to know this)   ;)

And I get blighted every season, seemingly. Do certified spuds help to stop this? Or is it just viruses that they help to avoid?

[glow777]

And I get blighted every season, seemingly. Do certified spuds help to stop this? Or is it just viruses that they help to avoid?

Some varieties are sold as blight resistant, eelworm resistant and scab resistant but Ive yet to come across one that has all three! Its a case of googling and reading the labels .... oh and picking one that tastes nice

[Trixiebelle]

Blimey! Until I joined this forum I never knew the humble potato could be so complicated :)

Useful info though. I will tell my Father-In-Law NOT to plant potatoes off Kwiksave 'cheap-shelf' for 10p this year. Had a good crop though ... feel guilty now  :-\

[RobinOfTheHood]

And I get blighted every season, seemingly. Do certified spuds help to stop this? Or is it just viruses that they help to avoid?

Some varieties are sold as blight resistant, eelworm resistant and scab resistant but Ive yet to come across one that has all three! Its a case of googling and reading the labels .... oh and picking one that tastes nice

Yes, but apart from them being a different variety, does it help? eg would a certified Arran Pilot be significantly less risky than an uncertified Arran Pilot?

Or is it all a bit of a con? Would certified spuds have helped the Irish potato blight?

[Robert_Brenchley]

No, because it was a new disease, introduced in the 1830's, and the Irish had becoe dependent on a single variety, Lumpers, which is extremely heavy cropping, but also extremely susceptible to blight.

Viruses are a longstanding problem with potatoes; they're passed from generation to generation via seed potatoes, which look perfectly OK. Historically, when a variety degenerated due to this problem, they'd save seed from the berries, which didn't carry the virus, and develop a new variety. The only way to be sure of producing seed potatoes without it is to grow them in an environment like that of Scotland, which is marginal for the aphids whicvh spread them.

[RobinOfTheHood]

So presumably supermarket spuds (UK ones) are second generation ie grown from certified potatoes?
Therefore using these would result in third generation potatoes for harvest....?

How long would it take for viruses to build up? And would this be resolved by using a 'fresh' batch of supermarket spuds the next year?

Just playing Devil's advocate.....

[Trixiebelle]

Now I'm even MORE confused  ???

Don't think I'll plant any this year ... just get packets of 'Smash' from Tescos  ;D

[laurieuk]

There are virus troubles with most plants and there is no control other than to obtain virus free stock and burn anything that is suspect. Some of my daffodil bulbs cost many pounds each but if I thought I had stripe virus I would burn them.It is not a way for the trade to make money, in a bad year a virus could infect a complete crop. When I give or sell bulbs I cannot guarantee that they are virus free because if aphid from another garden where there is stripe go on the foliage of my bulbs when the foliage dies the virus goes into the bulb and shows next year when the bulb grows again.

I do wonder, though, how much of the worry about viruses is put out there by the seed companies, as they must make tens if not hundreds times more profit on seed potatoes than on eating spuds.

How did we get on before certified spuds were available? (hopefully someone out there is old enough to know this)   ;)

And I get blighted every season, seemingly. Do certified spuds help to stop this? Or is it just viruses that they help to avoid?

[davy1]

When I was talking about disease I was talking of virus disease. Of course you can blight etc. on certified potatoes as they are fungal problems mainly airborne. If you cut every potato open you would not SEE a virus it effects the resulting crops.We are not here to disagree but to exchange ideas but your idea could be dangerous to others.

Phil Thats your pro-ogitive my friend and no offence taken.



I did not state my previous post was true, it is my opinion. What i based it on is, planting seed potato,s does not guarantee freedom from disease or disease causing agents or bacteria that is present or lying latent and can not be detected such as black leg or ring rot. Seed potatoes are examined for any outward signs of disease and a small persentage cut open for inward signs.
So the way i see it if i choose to buy some potatoes from a super market and check them for outward signs of decease i have much the same chance of getting a good crop as i would if i planted seed potato,s

First off let me state i did not bring it up as an idea, i was posting an opinion in reply to the first thread. If any one is under the impression that i an suggesting that any one   plants super market potato,s then i apologise i am not..

[ina]

Well, that is set straight then and I'm glad to hear it.
Novice potato growers could have gotten the wrong impression from what you wrote earlier, I hope they read this thread down to your most recent post.
Sometimes the written word can come across awkward.

[philcooper]

Dan assured me that Davy's letter would promote discussion.

I can't argue with that, the good news (IMHO) is that most posters recognise the dangers of planting non-certified seed, not just to themselves - that would be a personal matter - but to others including those who rely on growing potatoes for a living.  And thanks to Davy for stating that his original post was only an opinion.

The business of certification and the various levels of certification is complex and, in all countries of the EU, governed by law (see http://www.hmso.gov.uk/legislation/scotland/ssi2000/20000201.htm for the Scottish version). Certification is at the grower's expense.
The DEFRA checks include multiple visits to the fields where the crops are growing and laboratory examinations of tissue samples of the seed. What the inspectors do is ensure that the law is being complied with, the crops are growing healthily, the grower's paperwork is in order and finally that the levels of the diseases do not exceed those in the lists see http://www.hmso.gov.uk/legislation/scotland/ssi2000/20000201.htm#sch2pI. The checks include multiple visits to the fields where the crops are growing and laboratory examinations of tissue samples of the seed - at the growers expense. - Just a little bit more than "examined for any outward signs of disease and a small persentage cut open for inward signs"

For imported seed, not only does the producing country do the equivalent checks, but DEFRA then takes samples (at the importer's expense) and runs its own laboratory checks for the diseases.

And should anyone like to meet some farmers who "make tens if not hundreds times more profit on seed potatoes than on eating spuds", I can arrange it. BTW current ware (eating) prices ~£200/tonne,  seed ~£500/tonne

Note,
the cost of seed to produce seed potatoes is very much higher than the seed we buy - see the grades in the sites listed above
the yields are lower
there are certification charges plus
the cost of maintenance of the extensive paperwork required by DEFRA

Phil

[keef]

No, because it was a new disease, introduced in the 1830's, and the Irish had becoe dependent on a single variety, Lumpers, which is extremely heavy cropping, but also extremely susceptible to blight.

Viruses are a longstanding problem with potatoes; they're passed from generation to generation via seed potatoes, which look perfectly OK. Historically, when a variety degenerated due to this problem, they'd save seed from the berries, which didn't carry the virus, and develop a new variety. The only way to be sure of producing seed potatoes without it is to grow them in an environment like that of Scotland, which is marginal for the aphids whicvh spread them.

Seeing as everyone is being so cautious, its probably worth pointing out that you should not grow spuds from the berries yourself... Correct me if i'm wrong - but you'll basically be growing a new variety which is could be a cross of the variety's you've grown the year before, and can result in a poisinous crop.

[cornykev]

How do we stand with supermarket sweet potatoes then.  ??? ??? :-\ :-\ ;D ;D ;D

[keef]

Well there not related to spuds, actually related to bindweed. But never grown them myself so would'nt like to say - i'd guess they would be OK, but not sure we have the climate ???

[philcooper]

..... you should not grow spuds from the berries yourself... Correct me if I'm wrong - but you'll basically be growing a new variety which is could be a cross of the variety's you've grown the year before, and can result in a poisinous crop.

The true potato seeds are those found in the potato "apples" and will be a cross between the potato on which they are growing and the potato from which the pollen came (which may be the same plant).

Because of the complex gene mix in potatoes, even if the seeds are produced as a result of fertilisation by the plant itself, each individual seed will be a new variety. There is no problem in growing these on to see what the result is. You may discover a new super variety and make your fortune, but as professionals do this with the thousands of seeds they create each year from the controlled crossing of 2 varieties (and may find a good variety every few years), don't give up your day job.

As the raiser of Smile and some other varieties grown around the world told me - Trying to find a new variety is like looking for a needle in a haystack, but when you find one it is like finding the farmer's daughter instead!  :D

The tubers are not poisonous from any cross - the seeds are

Phil

Potatoes being grown in the Netherlands to produce new crosses

[laurieuk]

Phil is right, no way will you produce a poisinus potato, the potato apple  (seed pod) is dangerous to eat. Any new plant produced from seed from a hybrid (cultivar) is different from the parent and each seed in the pod produces a different variety. To breed Ann's Blush, Ann's White and Ann's Cream my three daffodils took many crosses and meant growing many many bulbs. The same would apply to new potatoes.

[davy1]

How do we stand with supermarket sweet potatoes then.  ??? ??? :-\ :-\ ;D ;D ;D

Would that be first generation or second     OK..OK i will shut up HeHeHeHe.

[angle shades]

:)

crikey, I grew Romano (seed pots from morrisons reduced range)    they grew very well, (under sunflowers ;D) and were very tasty, I would do it again, sorry/ shades x