Just interested to hear how anyone else might deal with the same situation, so I can come up with reserve plans if this one goes wrong.
One corner of one plot has been swamped this year by a really vigorous strain of bindweed with mile upon mile of thick roots. My raspberries vanished under it,and the runners had a bit of a struggle. Over the last couple of weekends I've dug and dug again the area, removing every mite of root that I can find, dug out the rasps and the redcurrant, taking the opportunity to split them and to generally tidy them up, and re-planted in two rows relatively wide apart. The plan is to be able to dig any sprouting remnants out without disturbing the fruit, and to put canes up the middle of the two rows. The reserve plan then is to train any bindweed that looks as though it's getting going or that I can't dig out up the canes. Once it's big enough, I'll strip it off the cane, bundle it up in a placcy bag to prevent the stuff touching anything else, and splat with glyphosate*.
What would you do?
Cheers,
Adrian
*Your views may vary with mine on glyphosate but as far as I'm concerned I do my damnedest to use as little 'icide as possible on anything else. However, bindweed (particularly this stuff, I've never known anything like it, it's like Russian Vine!) and couch grass are the spawn of Satan, and I reserve the right to nuke the *edited for considerable quantities of obscenities* stuff.
It sounds like a preety good plan, but I would suggest if you can planting the fruit somewhere else so that you can concentrate on getting rid of the bind weed. It can get into the roots so easily.
I've had just the same problem this year with my raspberries, only I've got couch grass as well....I've tried to dig it all out, even to the extent of removing and replanting, but I'm well aware that the smallest remnant will regrow. I'm going to try and keep on top of it by checking weekly and rigorously removing any green shoots, I really don't want to use chemicals if I can avoid it, but I don't blame anyone who needs to. This is bindweed on speed we're talking about this year.
I think you are fighting a loosing battle if you dont use chemicals. I've had my plot 2 years now and find BW will re-grow from a piece 2mm long!! So I'm using chemicals whenever I can and it seems to have reduced but by no means gone yet. The couch gets hit easily and has not come back.
I use chemical pesticides, weed killers and fertilisers as little as possible but for bindweed there's really no alternative. The first treatment really sets it back, the further growth is much weaker and another treatment pretty well finishes it off. So your plan looks good to me. It may not be "organic" but as I understand it, glyphosphate breaks down into its constituent molecules on contact with the soil, so I reckon it's environmentally better than copper sulphate which I think is still allowed for organic growers as a fungicide on vegetables!
Well, I'm glad to hear that most people agree that bindweed deserves the nuke! I have to be a little bit careful about the stuff as we have tree hugging landlords (worrying about their piece of land not being organic because some of the cattle running on it are not from organic herds.. but forgetting the fact that it's watered by all the agricultural run-off from Gloucestershire to Oxford!) but this calls for the big stick.
I had considered moving them, but decided against it as they stand on the highest point in that plot, which floods last in a wet winter, and I'm not sure how they respond to standing in water. Six of one and half a dozen of the other, I guess. Several other chunks will get the same treatment this winter, only for couch rather than bindweed, if it stays dry enough to dig! I'm not looking forward to doing it to the iris, though...
Small, I reckon you've got the same stuff. Isn't it infernal? I could have filled a decent sized bin liner with roots from a patch about eight feet by eight! Ordinary bindweed is PITA enough, but this is insane.
Thanks, folks!
Adrian
Well...if it makes you feel any better...I've got the mother of all bindweeds and although I've dug to end of the earth over the years, you just don't get rid of it.
If you have any permanent 'fixtures' nearby..like I have hedges...the source for new growth will always have somewhere to lurk.
BUT...I've learned to live with mine. No more raised beds and paths...bindweed loves those hiding places..but just one open piece of land. Little bit will still pop up every now and then but it is easily dug up. Anything coming up at the hedge bottom is allowed to come up as the flowers, particularly the big sort, seem to attract lot of insects, any other growth from them gets 'nucked'/dug up/what ever it takes.
I've got room for some growth for it but once it starts bothering the crops it will get attack from me...
Used to have this problem but got away ! Moved fifty miles, left it all behind. Lucky Sussex !
In my experience you just have to keep at it. Normally it's growing cycle is May to end September. Once you start to see it spring up, hoe, hoe and hoe and pull it up wherever possible. This does weaken it. I do not use chemicals. Any bindweed pulled is put into a black bag to rot to mush before going on the compost.
Some tips that worked for me on my plot. First up - dig, dig, dig! Might seem to be getting you no-where - but eventually, you will get on top of it.
Second tip - Push some uprights into the ground. Say, canes or twigs. The bindweed will naturally climb up it. Might sound a bit daft - but bear with me!! If you are not adverse to sparse / selective use of chemicals, mix some weed killer with wallpaper paste or flour and water. Aim to produce a gloop that you keep in a jar. Paint the gloop on the bindweed leaves that are growing on your plot or climbing up the uprights that you put into the ground. The gloop will stick to the leaves and get absorbed into the plants - including the roots. Bindweed has glossy leaves that help stop weed killer sticking to them. The gloop idea means that you are using chemicals in a more selective manner and you don't have weed killer running off the leaves onto your plot.
Third tip - accept that you are in for a long haul - you might not be entirely 100% free - but you can certainly contain it and keep well on top of it.
Good luck.
I find it like to curl its roots under slabs of wood. So I put some down to attract it to the surface. I hate cides too but wished I had nuked the bindweed while it was still only in one corner of the garden.
It seems to get quite deep into the soil, so even if you think you get every spot there is some lurking in the subsoil.
I agree about the uprights. Then you can bag and spray without disturbing your plants.
One reason for the allotment was escaping from the bindweed.
It does not seem to like pumpkins, squashes etc. So I have been growing them all over my garden. I had about 1/3 of my growing area covered in them, so next year hope to do even more. We are enjoying the squashes as well. I plan to cover my entire front garden. The neighbours will be ecstatic. :tongue3:
I think rye in another one. Though that dooms carrots as well. I think the work is aelopathic. Mexican Marigolds tagetes minuta might also do the bizz so the neighbours might be getting a show after all.
Just been for an exploratory dig. I rather consider my garden to be the national collection of bindweed and can normally reckon to dig out more than a bucket full of roots per square yard.
Where the roots of the squashes have been there is no bindweed at all. There is the odd root between plants, so it seems they need to be less than 15-18 inches apart. Where the leaves were but no roots there are still some roots, but only about 15 pieces of roots in 2 square meters.
Basically it is working well, certainly as well as roundup. For the price of a bottle of roundup I can buy enough courgettes to cover the entire street. After all the variety is not important it is the roots that matter. I have several oversized courgettes to harvest free seeds.
The correct spelling seems to be ALLOPATHIC
I now have a strip which had a row of assorted courgettes and squashes and was planning runner beans next year and there is not a bindweed root in sight. A great result.
I have some gooseberry bushes smothered in bindweed. With the prickles it is very difficult to clear the **** bindweed so next year they will each get a friend and lots of compost to ensure that the gooseberry is not starved by the squash as will my baby apple trees.
That is the maddest thing I've heard today... and I must try it!
Slightly more seriously, I've heard of similar things before, but never for controlling bindweed. The rasps will make it awkward, but I reckon a couple of courgettes next to them would be a good trial. That's one corner's planting sorted. Thanks for sharing!
Adrian
Maybe its allelopathy.
allelopathy
/ˌaliːˈlɒpəθi/
noun
Ecology
noun: allelopathy
the chemical inhibition of one plant (or other organism) by another, due to the release into the environment of substances acting as germination or growth inhibitors.
Lets hope I have got it right now.
Yes, allelopathy. Not allopathy, which is a form of alternative medicine.
For bindweed in raspberry canes, mulch with woodchip at least a foot deep, and keep topping it up during the year. The bindweed roots tend to run in it, and are easy to pull out. Any remaining have a foot of growth before reaching light. Keep pulling, and eventually they run out of steam. Works for couch grass too.
Another tip is to only dig with a fork, not a spade - which is basically just a way of making bindweed cuttings!
I am not sure I would recommend the squash next to the raspberries. They are just as likely to get rid of the canes. There is not much left under the squash except the odd nettle.
Quote from: Ian Pearson on December 14, 2013, 18:09:52
Yes, allelopathy. Not allopathy, which is a form of alternative medicine.
For bindweed in raspberry canes, mulch with woodchip at least a foot deep, and keep topping it up during the year. The bindweed roots tend to run in it, and are easy to pull out. Any remaining have a foot of growth before reaching light. Keep pulling, and eventually they run out of steam. Works for couch grass too.
Another tip is to only dig with a fork, not a spade - which is basically just a way of making bindweed cuttings!
All good advice...
I would add that putting your bindweed in a bag is a bit slow and very smelly - it also works best if the stuff is 'clean' with little soil on it - but there is a better method that works much, much quicker with clean bindweed and still works well on bindweed in clods (I'm on clay):
Make a strong 'hammock' on 4 posts from very strong net or chicken wire or old chainlink fencing hanging at least 30cm or more above the ground (allowing for sag) and just chuck it all in. The rain will wash the soil off the roots and this speeds up the baking in dry weather.
When the roots go brown and crunchy they are dead (I've tested this extensively) and you can compost the lot - no need to burn. It can take as little as two weeks.
If dry roots are sticking out of clods then smash the clods with a lump hammer - they will be quite brittle and you'll probably find crunchy roots inside. If you find white roots just give it a bit more time.
Cheers.
PS. The campaign against copper is making the 'icide companies very happy indeed because they want to sell you something far worse. Copper is an essential trace element for mammalian health (ie. yours). It is also incredibly bitter - the quantities you encounter from normal gardening use can't be tasted (assuming you polish anything visible off your tomatoes) and move through your metabolism fairly briskly - it may even be helping you.
NB. the cheapest source of high quality copper sulphate is from farming shops - it is sold by the kilo, tens of kilos, hundreds of kilos as a food supplement for animal husbandry.