I'm starting a new thread for vidcare's post:
Quote from: vidcare on February 27, 2013, 19:02:31
Quote from: 55david on January 29, 2013, 16:43:51
Received some encouraging news today from the CAB, they believe the eviction is illegal and are looking into it further
We've also got our MP involved, who's emailed the council requesting they show discretion, as they have done for the past 2 years (since moving) in allowing us to continue to rent the allotment :happy7:
interesting your case Im on the end of a Eviction Notice served by our Committee in my case i have been on my plot 45 years a few years back it won the best kept plot from the council My Eviction has been a Fast Track saying 75% has tobe cultivated its a joke and 80% of the members agree our present Committee are dictators every rule we have and the Council Guide Lines on Eviction have been bypassed I have my MP on the case it looks as if we will have to call an EGM to remove the committee interesting you mention CAB who are them ? pitty im not able to publish a couple of pics of our Sec Garden (Double Standards)
I'm sorry to hear about your problems Franky, after 45 years on your plot I'd have hoped you'd have earned some peace and quiet.
CAB are the Citizen's Advice Bureau (http://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/). Most towns have one and their advice is free. They offer some consumer advice so they might be able to help you, though sadly knowing your rights and getting your rights are two completely different things.
You'll not necessarily get much sympathy here for an eviction for poor cultivation as there are quite a number of committee here whose job is made difficult by just this problem, but it does sometimes happen that people are unfairly treated, and even when the cultivation has fallen below the required standard you still have minimum legal rights which the committee must respect.
Section 146 Law of Property 1925 says that if you're breaking a rule of your tenancy (such as poor cultivation) then you must be given written warning with reasonable time to put the matter right. Ultimately it's the courts that decide what "reasonable" means, but generally it means enough time for you to fix the problem if you apply yourself, taking into account the nature of the thing. If your tenancy agreement has a term about being given a certain period of notice then that is just a minimum, the tenancy agreement can't contract out of your statutory entitlement to "reasonable" time. Being required to dig over 75% of a plot in the middle of winter is not altogether reasonable - what did your notice say?
If you've been served with a notice of forfeiture for poor cultivation you can potentially apply to the court for relief, but it's potentially very expensive to do, and while it should be possible, it's not really something to do without legal help. For the couple of grand it could end up costing you it's not really a practical option.
I'm guessing you're not a member of the NSALG (or whatever they're calling themselves now? No matter if you're not, they're about as useful as a chocolate fireguard anyways.
Best of luck.
Quote from: Unwashed on February 28, 2013, 13:37:00
I'm starting a new thread for vidcare's post:
Quote from: vidcare on February 27, 2013, 19:02:31
Quote from: 55david on January 29, 2013, 16:43:51
Received some encouraging news today from the CAB, they believe the eviction is illegal and are looking into it further
We've also got our MP involved, who's emailed the council requesting they show discretion, as they have done for the past 2 years (since moving) in allowing us to continue to rent the allotment :happy7:
interesting your case Im on the end of a Eviction Notice served by our Committee in my case i have been on my plot 45 years a few years back it won the best kept plot from the council My Eviction has been a Fast Track saying 75% has tobe cultivated its a joke and 80% of the members agree our present Committee are dictators every rule we have and the Council Guide Lines on Eviction have been bypassed I have my MP on the case it looks as if we will have to call an EGM to remove the committee interesting you mention CAB who are them ? pitty im not able to publish a couple of pics of our Sec Garden (Double Standards)
I'm sorry to hear about your problems Franky, after 45 years on your plot I'd have hoped you'd have earned some peace and quiet.
CAB are the Citizen's Advice Bureau (http://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/). Most towns have one and their advice is free. They offer some consumer advice so they might be able to help you, though sadly knowing your rights and getting your rights are two completely different things.
You'll not necessarily get much sympathy here for an eviction for poor cultivation as there are quite a number of committee here whose job is made difficult by just this problem, but it does sometimes happen that people are unfairly treated, and even when the cultivation has fallen below the required standard you still have minimum legal rights which the committee must respect.
Section 146 Law of Property 1925 says that if you're breaking a rule of your tenancy (such as poor cultivation) then you must be given written warning with reasonable time to put the matter right. Ultimately it's the courts that decide what "reasonable" means, but generally it means enough time for you to fix the problem if you apply yourself, taking into account the nature of the thing. If your tenancy agreement has a term about being given a certain period of notice then that is just a minimum, the tenancy agreement can't contract out of your statutory entitlement to "reasonable" time. Being required to dig over 75% of a plot in the middle of winter is not altogether reasonable - what did your notice say?
If you've been served with a notice of forfeiture for poor cultivation you can potentially apply to the court for relief, but it's potentially very expensive to do, and while it should be possible, it's not really something to do without legal help. For the couple of grand it could end up costing you it's not really a practical option.
I'm guessing you're not a member of the NSALG (or whatever they're calling themselves now? No matter if you're not, they're about as useful as a chocolate fireguard anyways.
Best of luck.
I Totally agree about NSALG They are useless,as previously in my post earlier,and they are expensive,unlike theallotmentsandgardenscounciluk.org.uk these are proper people for allotment holders
theallotmentsandgardenscounciluk.org.uk .. website cannot be found?
Try
www.theallotmentsandgardenscounciluk.org.uk
Good luck to you.
I have telboy ... it may be offline temporarily. I will try again tomorrow.
Quote from: Unwashed on February 28, 2013, 13:37:00
I'm starting a new thread for vidcare's post:
Quote from: vidcare on February 27, 2013, 19:02:31
Quote from: 55david on January 29, 2013, 16:43:51
Received some encouraging news today from the CAB, they believe the eviction is illegal and are looking into it further
We've also got our MP involved, who's emailed the council requesting they show discretion, as they have done for the past 2 years (since moving) in allowing us to continue to rent the allotment :happy7:
interesting your case Im on the end of a Eviction Notice served by our Committee in my case i have been on my plot 45 years a few years back it won the best kept plot from the council My Eviction has been a Fast Track saying 75% has tobe cultivated its a joke and 80% of the members agree our present Committee are dictators every rule we have and the Council Guide Lines on Eviction have been bypassed I have my MP on the case it looks as if we will have to call an EGM to remove the committee interesting you mention CAB who are them ? pitty im not able to publish a couple of pics of our Sec Garden (Double Standards)
I'm sorry to hear about your problems Franky, after 45 years on your plot I'd have hoped you'd have earned some peace and quiet.
CAB are the Citizen's Advice Bureau (http://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/). Most towns have one and their advice is free. They offer some consumer advice so they might be able to help you, though sadly knowing your rights and getting your rights are two completely different things.
You'll not necessarily get much sympathy here for an eviction for poor cultivation as there are quite a number of committee here whose job is made difficult by just this problem, but it does sometimes happen that people are unfairly treated, and even when the cultivation has fallen below the required standard you still have minimum legal rights which the committee must respect.
Section 146 Law of Property 1925 says that if you're breaking a rule of your tenancy (such as poor cultivation) then you must be given written warning with reasonable time to put the matter right. Ultimately it's the courts that decide what "reasonable" means, but generally it means enough time for you to fix the problem if you apply yourself, taking into account the nature of the thing. If your tenancy agreement has a term about being given a certain period of notice then that is just a minimum, the tenancy agreement can't contract out of your statutory entitlement to "reasonable" time. Being required to dig over 75% of a plot in the middle of winter is not altogether reasonable - what did your notice say?
If you've been served with a notice of forfeiture for poor cultivation you can potentially apply to the court for relief, but it's potentially very expensive to do, and while it should be possible, it's not really something to do without legal help. For the couple of grand it could end up costing you it's not really a practical option.
I'm guessing you're not a member of the NSALG (or whatever they're calling themselves now? No matter if you're not, they're about as useful as a chocolate fireguard anyways.
Best of luck.
cheers unwashed
just joined NSALG but as i said my plot agreed by the Council Allotment Officer is cultivated to the guide lines the problem i have is The Sec has a personnel vendetta against me as i reported him for verbal bullying me two years ago and the council passed it off as a personality clash its just mine boggling what he is getting away
What is your self-management arrangement? Is the council your landlord and the committee manages the site on behalf of the council, or are the committee actually your landlord? It's possible that the committee don't have the authority to evict. Ideally you need to see the management agreement or site lease - sometimes councils and committees don't actually understand what arrangements they have in place.
What did your notice of forfeiture say? I understood that you were being evicted for alleged poor cultivation. Is that right?
Quote from: Unwashed on February 28, 2013, 20:59:00
What is your self-management arrangement? Is the council your landlord and the committee manages the site on behalf of the council, or are the committee actually your landlord? It's possible that the committee don't have the authority to evict. Ideally you need to see the management agreement or site lease - sometimes councils and committees don't actually understand what arrangements they have in place.
What did your notice of forfeiture say? I understood that you were being evicted for alleged poor cultivation. Is that right?
the council your landlord and the committee manages the site on behalf of the council, Yes,
I was given notice to reduce my compost area by 66% and repair a shared /party Fence which my new joining plot holder agreed it was as a shared fence and was sound and satisfactory but the Sec put the problem in my court and give me three weeks to sort it out(in winter months) the committee decided to inspect a week early and give me a eviction notice and thirteen days to clear the plot and return the entrance gate key, a case of bypassing the Eviction Committee Guide Line Rules
We are a private site and I must of give out about ten Notices to Quit last year. In the letters i send one paragraph is headed," what you can do" and informs them that they can bring the allotment up to standard as in the association rules, and the right to appeal etc.
If people bring it up to standard then i am a happy chappie but before their rent is taken for the following year they must sign another notice to quit so they have to maintain the standard required.
What i don't like is people sending in their appeal with a load of excuses why it was not done or what they have done (which i know they have not) My answer to this is, i ask them to attend the association hut and produce photos of the plot which i have taken through out the year. They loose.
To add to Unwashed,s questions.
Do you have a constitution in place as on there should state how many signatories is required to call an Extra Ordinary Meeting you cant just say we want a meeting it has to be done properly
Cheers for your input
"Do you have a constitution in place as on there should how many signatories is required to call an Extra Ordinary Meeting you cant just say we want a meeting it has to be done properly"
thanks under stand that, I have at the moment 15 Signatories but having difficulty to obtain any info or a copy of the Constitution from the Sec I even asked in writing a copy of the minutes of the committee meeting of my eviction to enable me to put an appeal case together, that fell on deaf ears ? was i out of order asking or have i the right asking ?info of the minuets
They have no right to stop you from viewing the Constitution it should be on display for all to read.
All members are entitled to read the past minutes
All Member should be given a copy of the rules and they should be availible for all to read.
If you have two thirds of the membership that want an EOGM then the chairman has to accept it but all must sign the agenda proposed if only one fails to attend the meeting then the chair may refuse to go a head.
The committee can not give you just 13 days to get off and they cannot refuse you a right to appeal. they must give you a years notice to quit.
I would in your case put a letter in quoting the Allotments Act, point out what they have done wrong and they are being vindictive toward you for no reason.
send one to them and one to the council make sure you that you put on the. bottom of the page Copy to council copy to solicitor
If you are in the right then stand your ground, make it clear that the only way they will get you off is by eviction, this at least will buy you time.
Quote from: davyw1 on March 01, 2013, 09:14:30
They have no right to stop you from viewing the Constitution it should be on display for all to read.
All members are entitled to read the past minutes
All Member should be given a copy of the rules and they should be availible for all to read.
If you have two thirds of the membership that want an EOGM then the chairman has to accept it but all must sign the agenda proposed if only one fails to attend the meeting then the chair may refuse to go a head.
The committee can not give you just 13 days to get off and they cannot refuse you a right to appeal. they must give you a years notice to quit.
I would in your case put a letter in quoting the Allotments Act, point out what they have done wrong and they are being vindictive toward you for no reason.
send one to them and one to the council make sure you that you put on the. bottom of the page Copy to council copy to solicitor
If you are in the right then stand your ground, make it clear that the only way they will get you off is by eviction, this at least will buy you time.
Quote from: davyw1 on March 01, 2013, 09:14:30
They have no right to stop you from viewing the Constitution it should be on display for all to read.
All members are entitled to read the past minutes
All Member should be given a copy of the rules and they should be availible for all to read.
If you have two thirds of the membership that want an EOGM then the chairman has to accept it but all must sign the agenda proposed if only one fails to attend the meeting then the chair may refuse to go a head.
The committee can not give you just 13 days to get off and they cannot refuse you a right to appeal. they must give you a years notice to quit.
I would in your case put a letter in quoting the Allotments Act, point out what they have done wrong and they are being vindictive toward you for no reason.
send one to them and one to the council make sure you that you put on the. bottom of the page Copy to council copy to solicitor
If you are in the right then stand your ground, make it clear that the only way they will get you off is by eviction, this at least will buy you time.
Thanks Davyw 1
A lot to take in, I had my Appeal on thur well sort of, letter from committee stating i must attend at 12.00pm at 1pm i was still waiting in the cold out side the Portable office cabin then the Secretary came out and said we will have to hold an other meeting, Reason ONE Committee member did not attend so my appeal will have to heard some other time, peeeed off i am
Yes its a lot to take in but if you want to keep your allotment then you will have to take iy in.
I see your appeal being put back as time to try and turn the tables. If you are in the right then take some photo,s of your allotment, the secretaries and any committee members allotments that are in worse condition than yours, send them to the chairman and the council officer asking him why you are being evicted and not them, mention the story is going to the local paper.
You are allowed witnesses at your hearing, take them let the committee explain to them why you are being evicted.
Print out a copy of the Allotments Act send it to the chairman prior to the next hearing, by the way you have not mentioned having one and its his duty to ensure the committee work within the rules and the law.
It would also be nice to see a photo of your plot just ensure that we are not giving you all this support and you are in the wrong
Quote from: davyw1 on March 01, 2013, 20:53:38
Yes its a lot to take in but if you want to keep your allotment then you will have to take iy in.
I see your appeal being put back as time to try and turn the tables. If you are in the right then take some photo,s of your allotment, the secretaries and any committee members allotments that are in worse condition than yours, send them to the chairman and the council officer asking him why you are being evicted and not them, mention the story is going to the local paper.
You are allowed witnesses at your hearing, take them let the committee explain to them why you are being evicted.
Print out a copy of the Allotments Act send it to the chairman prior to the next hearing, by the way you have not mentioned having one and its his duty to ensure the committee work within the rules and the law.
It would also be nice to see a photo of your plot just ensure that we are not giving you all this support and you are in the wrong
cheers once again I was thinking of going to the local press as you say as for Allotment Act i would love to have one but where do i find one I would love to show photos of mine and his but i have been stopped by the forum Mod,when i posted a link, do i send them to your email address ? plenty available dating back to March 2011 The sec is bragging he sent a letter to his committee and its there for all to see he requested 18month to re organize his plot !! dated 2011 and since then nothing has been done other than more rubbish has accumulated its known on our Allotments as Steptoe's Yard and it is !! i have mentioned this to the Council Allotment Officer and forward photos to him Spoke to him on the site and got very little response from him I even challenge him if he was doing his job inspecting gardens as this is part of his duty he must have picked it up over the last 24 months the response was unless he has written evidence that the Secretary's plot was in that state back in 2011 nothing can be done ?( I sent him this photo) A photo of the Secretary's yard with the camera time/date imprinted on it March 2011 Good Story for the local press i would think? But very poor response from the Officer, we have had two cases of Bullying on our plot from this Committee but once again nothing has been done Council wise
Removal of reference to war criminal.
Just to clarify the above Vidcare is welcome to post photos of his/her own plot: :happy7: but not to post photos of anyone elses without their consent.
Quote from: pumpkinlover on March 02, 2013, 07:33:20
Just to clarify the above Vidcare is welcome to post photos of his/her own plot: :happy7: but not to post photos of anyone Else's without their consent.
I Agree with that 100%
Davyw1 with ref to we have one and i have not mentioned one, No we don't have a chairperson this committee believe there is no need for one and have checked it out and say the committee can operate without one (dictatorship)
Quote from: pumpkinlover on March 02, 2013, 07:33:20
Just to clarify the above Vidcare is welcome to post photos of his/her own plot: :happy7: but not to post photos of anyone elses without their consent.
Please advise on how can i insert (post)a photo of my plot ?
cheers
QuotePlease advise on how can i insert (post)a photo of my plot ?
cheers
Upload your photo to a image hosting site like photobucket.com (http://photobucket.com) or imageshack.us (http://imageshack.us), register for a free account and after you have uploaded a picture you can use ready made URL's to post image in a forum.
Format would be something like this:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v708/YOUR%20ACCOUNT%20NAME/YOUR%20IMAGE%20NAME.jpg)
[IMG]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v708/YOUR ACCOUNT NAME/YOUR IMAGE NAME.jpg[/IMG](http://imageshack.us/a/img94/7910/image006jx.th.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/94/image006jx.jpg/)
[URL=http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/94/image006jx.jpg/][IMG]http://imageshack.us/a/img94/7910/image006jx.th.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
Quote from: BritBrat on March 02, 2013, 09:43:55
QuotePlease advise on how can i insert (post)a photo of my plot ?
cheers
Upload your photo to a image hosting site like photobucket.com (http://photobucket.com) or imageshack.us (http://imageshack.us), register for a free account and after you have uploaded a picture you can use ready made URL's to post image in a forum.
Format would be something like this:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v708/YOUR%20ACCOUNT%20NAME/YOUR%20IMAGE%20NAME.jpg)
[IMG]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v708/YOUR ACCOUNT NAME/YOUR IMAGE NAME.jpg[/IMG]
(http://imageshack.us/a/img94/7910/image006jx.th.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/94/image006jx.jpg/)
[URL=http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/94/image006jx.jpg/][IMG]http://imageshack.us/a/img94/7910/image006jx.th.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
the link to photo of my plot
http://i1287.photobucket.com/albums/a639/vidcare1/IMAG0044_zpsbf264c06.jpg
Quote from: vidcare on March 03, 2013, 10:46:19
the link to photo of my plot
http://i1287.photobucket.com/albums/a639/vidcare1/IMAG0044_zpsbf264c06.jpg
(http://i1287.photobucket.com/albums/a639/vidcare1/IMAG0044_zpsbf264c06.jpg)
Quote from: vidcare on February 28, 2013, 21:34:48
the council your landlord and the committee manages the site on behalf of the council, Yes,
I was given notice to reduce my compost area by 66% and repair a shared /party Fence which my new joining plot holder agreed it was as a shared fence and was sound and satisfactory but the Sec put the problem in my court and give me three weeks to sort it out(in winter months) the committee decided to inspect a week early and give me a eviction notice and thirteen days to clear the plot and return the entrance gate key, a case of bypassing the Eviction Committee Guide Line Rules
Sorry I didn't see the post vidcare, thanks for your PM.
If the council is your landlord than I'd be surprised if the committee has the authority to evict. The council may possibly have delegated that authority, but I'm not absolutely sure that can - they can appoint managers to do the administration and maintenance for them, and they can lease out the whole site to an allotment association, but only the landlord can evict and I'm not convinced the committee has any standing, though I could be mistaken.
But in any case, if you've got your cultivation in hand then the committee can't evict.
Hi Guys
what happened to day our Sec of our Allotments Physically assaulted me in-front of two witnesses so i went to the police to report it ouch to being a Allotment holder :BangHead:
Sounds as though you've got them on the run, Vidcare!
Quote from: Robert_Brenchley on March 07, 2013, 20:42:08
Sounds as though you've got them on the run, Vidcare!
But it's a disgrace this kind of thing keeps happening - for every allotmenteer who ships up here with a story of vindictive and oppressive site management I bet there's hundreds who suffer in silence, and for each one of them I bet there's hundreds who keep their heads down to avoid the attention of their site bullies. There really doesn't seem to be any organisation these people can turn to for help because allotments just don't rank important enough, but to many of us our allotments are terribly important.
Quote from: Robert_Brenchley on March 07, 2013, 20:42:08
Sounds as though you've got them on the run, Vidcare!
Ouch i wished i had run, kidding aside I predicted this two years ago it would happen to some one and it happened to me( Speak out and your Crushed) Its first class bullying in my case a 73 old OAP on the wrong end of it mind you i have had Victim support on the phone
Good for you getting the police ,some people think they can do what they like a power rush to there head ,good luck Vidcare don't let them get away with these bully boy tactics you must be getting to them, when one of them got viollent!
Make sure the two witnesss stay witnesss and don't get talked round. Lets see the council fob this one off. :wave:
Quote from: cornykev on March 09, 2013, 09:41:10
Make sure the two witnesss stay witnesss and don't get talked round. Lets see the council fob this one off. :wave:
well there is a Funny Thing this big intimidating Sec has already spoke to one of my witness ask him what he saw !this is after the police had taken a statement from the Sec :BangHead:
Quote from: vidcare on March 09, 2013, 13:27:26
Quote from: cornykev on March 09, 2013, 09:41:10
Make sure the two witnesss stay witnesss and don't get talked round. Lets see the council fob this one off. :wave:
well there is a Funny Thing this big intimidating Sec has already spoke to one of my witness ask him what he saw !this is after the police had taken a statement from the Sec :BangHead:
The Council FOB this one off ! what do you think ? I have tried to contact the Council Allotment Officer and all you get is a auto reply from your emails saying He is out of Office for a few days,, could be a policy to keep a Low key on the matter and see what Blows over
Put in a formal complaint about the creep. If that doesn't work, contact a local councillor with a copy of the letter.
Quote from: Robert_Brenchley on March 09, 2013, 20:12:06
Put in a formal complaint about the creep. If that doesn't work, contact a local councillor with a copy of the letter.
I Dont think it will get me any further All i have been getting is Fob Off Fob Off I have been asking for justice since 31st Jan and the replies im getting is (I am on a course next Mon /Tuesday and have back to back meetings until Friday. I can assure you however , that I will find time to look into this and respond no later than a week on Monday.(thats 1 Feb)(I have asked the committee to delay any
action until the 25th February as I have been called for jury service and this is my expected day back.
I can
assure you I will deal with this matter on my return. /(thats 9th Feb, 17th Feb I am served with an Eviction notice) now the 9th March and i have been on the end of a physical assault and i am Still waiting for him to DEAL With the matter, Council Neglect and not noticing the sign's of the dangerous situation sort of, wonder if it come under Criminal injuries compensation due to Council Neglect and lack of urgency theres a thought ?
This Council Guy seems to think he is some sort of philosopher he puts the problem down to a clash of personality's !!!would you believe it,Clash alright i find myself on my back hitting the concrete car park
It's probably time to go you a councillor. If that doesn't work, try either your MP or the local press. Having been on the recieving end of an assault will put people on your side.
The allotments are not council-managed, they are self-managed on a three-year lease. The council certainly could intervene, but councils don't like to address injustice in their own services, so I think it very unlikely they'll want to get involved in something that isn't directly their affair. It's the old problem of holding a committee to account - some of the site will side with the bullies, and the rest won't want to get involved.
Vidcare, is the association a member of a wider federation? If they are you might possibly get some support there, though don't hold your breath, these can sometimes be managed by the same clique.
I think your redress is through the site association, but they may well fob you off unless you can find someone to advocate for you - a local council might, or someone from Citizens Advice.
Quote from: Robert_Brenchley on March 10, 2013, 18:39:03
It's probably time to go you a councillor. If that doesn't work, try either your MP or the local press. Having been on the recieving end of an assault will put people on your side.
Right from the off 31st Jan i contacted my MP i just had a feeling things would go pear shape, I had a nice letter heading" House of Parliament" Reply From my MP stating she has asked the Head of leisure at the Council for a report, Guess She is still waiting knowing how fast our Council act's, I have also forward copy's of all my correspondence's to the local Press as well as photo,s so watch this space :coffee2:
Quote from: Unwashed on March 10, 2013, 19:09:26
The allotments are not council-managed, they are self-managed on a three-year lease. The council certainly could intervene, but councils don't like to address injustice in their own services, so I think it very unlikely they'll want to get involved in something that isn't directly their affair. It's the old problem of holding a committee to account - some of the site will side with the bullies, and the rest won't want to get involved.
Vidcare, is the association a member of a wider federation? If they are you might possibly get some support there, though don't hold your breath, these can sometimes be managed by the same clique.
I think your redress is through the site association, but they may well fob you off unless you can find someone to advocate for you - a local council might, or someone from Citizens Advice.
Hi unwashed
think the only federation its a member of is the NAWG and our Sec is a Area Representative
http://www.newcastleallotments.co.uk/nawg.htm
Does your MP not hold regular surgery's where you can go along and speak to them in person without all that letter writing/emailing. :BangHead:
Quote from: cornykev on March 10, 2013, 19:34:31
Does your MP not hold regular surgery's where you can go along and speak to them in person without all that letter writing/emailing. :BangHead:
Guess all MP's have regular surgery s will look into that cheers
unwashed:- the NAWG website has just added the last two links to Guidance re disciplinary action/Guidance re eviction
Quote from: claybasket on March 09, 2013, 09:36:09
Good for you getting the police ,some people think they can do what they like a power rush to there head ,good luck Vidcare don't let them get away with these bully boy tactics you must be getting to them, when one of them got viollent!
Received a letter from the committee today saying the committee have agreed to withdraw the notice of Eviction (unsigned), The Sec who assaulted me has been arrested and is out on bail !many thanks to the Forum for advise and your time :icon_cheers:
Well done vidcare, you stood up well. Put it to bed now, and be generous in victory. Peaceful gardening.
Well done Vidcare. Good man.
Well done to everyone else that pitched in to help Vidcare too!
Full marks all round....
And as Unwashed (Top bloke) said, be generous in victory... and I'll add, but wear the smile of a winner. ;-)
Happy gardening.
Quote from: Nigel B on March 12, 2013, 21:42:30
Well done Vidcare. Good man.
Well done to everyone else that pitched in to help Vidcare too!
Full marks all round....
And as Unwashed (Top bloke) said, be generous in victory... and I'll add, but wear the smile of a winner. ;-)
Happy gardening.
Cheers Nigel B
I will enjoy the BIG smile of a winner as i limp around the allotments :happy7:
Well done Vidcare, a great result. :blob7:
These threads so often end in disappointment, it is so nice to hear of someone winning.
Good for you. I thought you'd won when I saw that he'd assaulted you.
Quote from: Robert_Brenchley on March 13, 2013, 20:25:07
Good for you. I thought you'd won when I saw that he'd assaulted you.
18 month ago same guy give me a right verbal bullying and inches from physical assault(reason i sent a email to the council Allotment officer asking for the guide lines of erecting a fence) I reported it to the council what did they do nothing ! put it down to a personality clash easy way out for them, wish now i contacted the police :blob7:
Hi again Vidcare,
If you wrote to the council they should have a record of it. You might want to drop them an email, (I always use the FOIA when dealing with my council, they tend to ignore anything else), asking for a copy of any correspondence between you and them so you can pass it on as proof you had already been threatened. They really should have taken some sort of action when you complained.
Good luck. Happy gardening. :-)
How's it going Vidcare? Any progress?
Quote from: Nigel B on April 18, 2013, 00:41:52
How's it going Vidcare? Any progress?
Hi Guys and Girls
update, I am receiving psychiatric counseling over the traumatic experience, the Guy has had his bail extended to 17th June but an interesting thing happened at the Allotments today my Witness was accused of telling the police a load of lies and given a threat of eviction when his bail is finished on the 17th June (by the accused The Secretary) reason, he give a statement to the police ! how about that, intimidation of a witness i would have thought ? thanks for your interest (The Police have been informed) I Just want the Council to intervene to remove my witness eviction threat little hope of that ?but we will see
I hope the police are taking the report seriously, since interfering with a witness is a criminal offence.
Quote from: Robert_Brenchley on April 30, 2013, 18:34:31
I hope the police are taking the report seriously, since interfering with a witness is a criminal offence.
fingers crossed i will know more on Wednesday as the PC who is in charge of my case was on a day off today but it will be very interesting on what will happen to this bully
Quote from: vidcare on April 30, 2013, 22:09:24
Quote from: Robert_Brenchley on April 30, 2013, 18:34:31
I hope the police are taking the report seriously, since interfering with a witness is a criminal offence.
fingers crossed i will know more on Wednesday as the PC who is in charge of my case was on a day off today but it will be very interesting on what will happen to this bully
Thursday still no reply from the PC Who is in charge of my case ! unbelievable, I Have left umpteen messages :BangHead:
Quote from: Robert_Brenchley on April 30, 2013, 18:34:31
I hope the police are taking the report seriously, since interfering with a witness is a criminal offence.
I dont believe it been informed by the police, interfering with a witness nothing can be done as the alleged offender is on unconditional bail ? and he has a past police record !!!!
Quote from: Nigel B on April 18, 2013, 00:41:52
How's it going Vidcare? Any progress?
[/quote
Well Guys/Girls
Up to the point of going into court this Allotment Secretary changed his plea to Guilty ! so over 6 month of hassle has a ending ? lets HOPE SO, will be interesting to see if the Council remove him? :blob7:
So what happened?
Quote from: Naboth on November 14, 2013, 18:54:47
So what happened?
The Sec pleaded guilty and had to pay the CPS Costs and the Assault by Bashing was recorded against him plus I would imagine the cost for his solicitor (as todate he is still acting Allotment Sec and the Council it would appear to have turn a deaf ear to it All!)
Quote from: vidcare on February 02, 2014, 10:54:29
Quote from: Naboth on November 14, 2013, 18:54:47
So what happened?
The Sec pleaded guilty and had to pay the CPS Costs and the Assault by Bashing was recorded against him plus I would imagine the cost for his solicitor (as todate he is still acting Allotment Sec and the Council it would appear to have turn a deaf ear to it All!)
Well you know when you get that feeling you cannot Win well to day I have had a visit from our Sec shouting and bullying me again on the Allotments stating I told a load of liars of the assault way back in March last year and he is quit adamant he Won the Case figure that one out ? has any one any idea of my next step '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''
Quote from: vidcare on February 02, 2014, 16:55:17
Quote from: vidcare on February 02, 2014, 10:54:29
Quote from: Naboth on November 14, 2013, 18:54:47
So what happened?
The Sec pleaded guilty and had to pay the CPS Costs and the Assault by Bashing was recorded against him plus I would imagine the cost for his solicitor (as todate he is still acting Allotment Sec and the Council it would appear to have turn a deaf ear to it All!)
Well you know when you get that feeling you cannot Win well to day I have had a visit from our Sec shouting and bullying me again on the Allotments stating I told a load of liars of the assault way back in March last year and he is quit adamant he Won the Case figure that one out ? has any one any idea of my next step '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''
Well the latest update this Sec pleaded Guilty of Assault by Bashing in court it looks as if the CPS solicitor Has sold my case short as i have received a eviction order from the committee saying as the Sec won the case (after pleading Guilty)!! i falsely accused him of assault and he was cleared and discharged by the courts ?? the letter unsigned from the Allotment committee states my sub-tenancy will not be renewed and i have to be OFF my allotment by the 31st March 2014 any justice in this country can any tell me ??? :BangHead:
I've just read this thread and admit I am somewhat shocked.
Witness intimidation is a criminal offence, as has been pointed out already. The person who assaulted you had already been charged with the offence and it matters not a jot whether he was on unconditional bail or not and the police should have at the very least had words with him.
The eviction notice, you say is not signed. Therefore, it is NOT legally binding.
This committee have allotments, therefore they are tenants of the council, who are the overall landlords. The council have a duty towards their tenants.
There is a little known law which (and I paraphrase here) means that the council are responsible for the actions and behaviour of their tenants and if they allow tenants to get away with bad behaviour, anti-social behaviour etc., then the victim of said behaviour can sue the council.
I found that one out some years ago when my elderly neighbour and others in our street were being harrassed, threatened, our property vandalised by the family from hell. Just so happened that my neighbour's son was a Barrister. We organised a meeting for the whole street in our local hall. My neighbour's son kept quiet until almost the end of the meeting, then he spoke. Ever seen council officials, councillors and the police squirm, because they did.
A few months later, the family from hell were gone. The threat of the whole street suing was enough to fire the council into action.
I would think the same law applies here as well. Council's don't like people knowing about that law.
Might we worth getting other allotment holders who have been bullied by this lot to stand together. One voice is weak. Many voices are strong.
I wish you luck.
Quotethe family from hell were gone
Not sure this cures the problem, presume it just moves somewhere else.
YOur council must have an allotments officer - ask to speak to them, this man needs removing from his position on the allotments - he is using his "power" to throw his weight around!
Any threats of eviction from him would be un-enforceable - I would by pass him and go straight to the Allotments officer!
The court who heard the case will have published a record of the proceedings of the case. I would obtain a copy of the judgement, because it would seem that he has lied to his fellow plot holders about "winning" his case! He is not a fit person to hold office, so you could call an Extraordinary General Meeting of the allotments society. He needs removing from his post and surely once the true outcome of this case is known - the other plot holders would not want him representing them!
Good luck!
The alternative for your sanity is to see if there is a plot on an alternative site nearby you! It should not come to that - but some fights are just not worth the anguish!
Quote from: Digeroo on March 13, 2014, 08:05:30
Quotethe family from hell were gone
Not sure this cures the problem, presume it just moves somewhere else.
Yes, it does move the problem elsewhere but when you have elderly people being terrorised, unable to go outside without being stoned, indeed one elderly lady gave up her house and moved to a care home. She has since passed away.
People going about their normal business like the postman frequently suffered verbal abuse had stones thrown at them - it really was awful.
One of my neighbours had his greenhouse smashed several times. I had my car scratched by these thugs and they were forever setting the woodland behind our houses on fire killing many slow worms and other small creatures. The Fire Brigade were called out 3 times one Sunday yet the authorities were reluctant to do anything about it - until we formed a residents association and forced them to.
Now we have no more fires, no more vandalism and our street is peaceful only because we joined together and stayed together.
As for the family from hell, these weren't young children. All were teenagers, the oldest being 17 and the youngest 14. Ineffectual mother, father disappeared off the scene years back.
There are ways of dealing with bullies and intimidation. It's just knowing how to deal with it and having the determination not to give in to these cowards.
Quote from: Golach on March 13, 2014, 01:12:16
I've just read this thread and admit I am somewhat shocked.
Witness intimidation is a criminal offence, as has been pointed out already. The person who assaulted you had already been charged with the offence and it matters not a jot whether he was on unconditional bail or not and the police should have at the very least had words with him.
The eviction notice, you say is not signed. Therefore, it is NOT legally binding.
This committee have allotments, therefore they are tenants of the council, who are the overall landlords. The council have a duty towards their tenants.
There is a little known law which (and I paraphrase here) means that the council are responsible for the actions and behaviour of their tenants and if they allow tenants to get away with bad behaviour, anti-social behaviour etc., then the victim of said behaviour can sue the council.
I found that one out some years ago when my elderly neighbour and others in our street were being harrassed, threatened, our property vandalised by the family from hell. Just so happened that my neighbour's son was a Barrister. We organised a meeting for the whole street in our local hall. My neighbour's son kept quiet until almost the end of the meeting, then he spoke. Ever seen council officials, councillors and the police squirm, because they did.
A few months later, the family from hell were gone. The threat of the whole street suing was enough to fire the council into action.
I would think the same law applies here as well. Council's don't like people knowing about that law.
Might we worth getting other allotment holders who have been bullied by this lot to stand together. One voice is weak. Many voices are strong.
I wish you luck.
Very interesting that little law possibly do a google search to see if I can find it any idea what it would be called ? liked to seen this (Ever seen council officials, councillors and the police squirm, because they did.) :blob7:
Way back, I had a friend who repeatedly had nuts shoved through the letterbox by a racist neighbour. The council's response was to try to move her, but she stood firm, got a solicitor involved, and they used this law to get the Council policy changed and the racist evicted.
It will be very interesting to see if the Council can find my Lease dating back to 1968 as I have not signed any lease since ? has the rules or goal posts changed since ? YES THE RENT HAS GONE UP from 2/6pence to the present £50 :angry2:
Quote from: vidcare on March 16, 2014, 14:23:36
It will be very interesting to see if the Council can find my Lease dating back to 1968 as I have not signed any lease since ? has the rules or goal posts changed since ? YES THE RENT HAS GONE UP from 2/6pence to the present £50 :angry2:
Well bad news from the Council today after a 1 hour meeting putting my point of view a email received states( The Council is not a member of any Allotment Association and is not responsible for the decisions made by it. The Council has no power to make decisions on behalf of the Association or overturn decisions made by it) so if your assaulted on their land and your innocent the bad guy gets off and the eviction notice accusing you of telling lies Of the assault although the courts find the bad guy Guilty and is given a criminal record the Council don't want to know !!! :BangHead: :BangHead: :BangHead: MOB RULE GETS AWAY WITH IT
Quote from: vidcare on March 17, 2014, 22:56:57
Quote from: vidcare on March 16, 2014, 14:23:36
It will be very interesting to see if the Council can find my Lease dating back to 1968 as I have not signed any lease since ? has the rules or goal posts changed since ? YES THE RENT HAS GONE UP from 2/6pence to the present £50 :angry2:
Well bad news from the Council today after a 1 hour meeting putting my point of view a email received states( The Council is not a member of any Allotment Association and is not responsible for the decisions made by it. The Council has no power to make decisions on behalf of the Association or overturn decisions made by it) so if your assaulted on their land and your innocent the bad guy gets off and the eviction notice accusing you of telling lies Of the assault although the courts find the bad guy Guilty and is given a criminal record the Council don't want to know !!! :BangHead: :BangHead: :BangHead: MOB RULE GETS AWAY WITH IT
They are just passing the buck. THEY ARE responsible for what their tenants, which include secretaries of associations get up to so what they're saying is a load of old horse manure! This secretary is a tenant of theirs and you should not have to be subjected to assaults, either physical or verbal from this person.
Maybe it is time you went to the papers with this.
Quote from: Golach on March 17, 2014, 23:29:03
Quote from: vidcare on March 17, 2014, 22:56:57
Quote from: vidcare on March 16, 2014, 14:23:36
It will be very interesting to see if the Council can find my Lease dating back to 1968 as I have not signed any lease since ? has the rules or goal posts changed since ? YES THE RENT HAS GONE UP from 2/6pence to the present £50 :angry2:
Well bad news from the Council today after a 1 hour meeting putting my point of view a email received states( The Council is not a member of any Allotment Association and is not responsible for the decisions made by it. The Council has no power to make decisions on behalf of the Association or overturn decisions made by it) so if your assaulted on their land and your innocent the bad guy gets off and the eviction notice accusing you of telling lies Of the assault although the courts find the bad guy Guilty and is given a criminal record the Council don't want to know !!! :BangHead: :BangHead: :BangHead: MOB RULE GETS AWAY WITH IT
They are just passing the buck. THEY ARE responsible for what their tenants, which include secretaries of associations get up to so what they're saying is a load of old horse manure! This secretary is a tenant of theirs and you should not have to be subjected to assaults, either physical or verbal from this person.
Maybe it is time you went to the papers with this.
good idea going to the papers will give it some thought ,the following is also advice included in the Council email (If you feel that you have been wrongly evicted or that the management committee had acted contrary to the rules under which the Association operates, then it would have been open to you to try to resolve matters by raising an internal complaint/appeal in accordance with association rules or, failing that, by taking legal action against committee members based on breach of contract) I might take legal action ?, how about this its noted in my latest eviction letter(unsigned) 3 separated reasons of eviction first charge was about my party fence and my compost area is too long its not any way nothing in the rules to say how long it has to be , last year March I received a letter from the committee (this is after the Sec had been arrested ) the party fence and compost area is ok now and the eviction has been lifted:::now the same complaint is on my present notice ?? the other two reasons - I told lies in court about him But he was one of the four (4-3)who voted for the present eviction notice, that is not right is it ?participating when it included him :brave:
Legal action could be costly and I'm not sure if you would qualify for Legal Aid on something like this since they changed the Legal Aid rules fairly recently.
I will say again, that to be legally binding a document has to have a written signature. Typed words like "The Committee" or "The Secretary" etc. are not signatures.
I wonder what they will do if you ignore their "eviction notice" - physically eject you from your allotment, destroy/damage your property? If they do, they will be in serious trouble.
I think you need to talk to the other committee members.
I the facts about the conviction and that the eviction notice is not signed.
Appeal again the eviction.
Go to the local paper. I am not sure that the secretary really wants his conviction all over the local press.
Quote from: Digeroo on March 18, 2014, 20:20:50
I think you need to talk to the other committee members.
I the facts about the conviction and that the eviction notice is not signed.
Appeal again the eviction.
Go to the local paper. I am not sure that the secretary really wants his conviction all over the local press.
Thanks every one I have been given a extra month to vacate my plot from the Council, one minute they are saying (Council) cannot change decisions of the Allotment Committee and in there kindness I now have till the end of April to find a alternative Allotment and vacate, still waiting a reply to my appeal from the committee, Legal advise I sort confirms as the eviction letter has neither Date or Signature its not worth the paper its printed on (not Legal)but you get to the stage would I enjoy that plot any more (The alternative for your sanity is to see if there is a plot on an alternative site nearby you! It should not come to that - but some fights are just not worth the anguish!) as posted by louise stella Thanks
Quote from: vidcare on March 20, 2014, 09:49:53
Quote from: Digeroo on March 18, 2014, 20:20:50
I think you need to talk to the other committee members.
I the facts about the conviction and that the eviction notice is not signed.
Appeal again the eviction.
Go to the local paper. I am not sure that the secretary really wants his conviction all over the local press.
Thanks every one I have been given a extra month to vacate my plot from the Council, one minute they are saying (Council) cannot change decisions of the Allotment Committee and in there kindness I now have till the end of April to find a alternative Allotment and vacate, still waiting a reply to my appeal from the committee, Legal advise I sort confirms as the eviction letter has neither Date or Signature its not worth the paper its printed on (not Legal)but you get to the stage would I enjoy that plot any more (The alternative for your sanity is to see if there is a plot on an alternative site nearby you! It should not come to that - but some fights are just not worth the anguish!) as posted by louise stella Thanks
Well I have just received a letter from the committee refusing me a appeal and it looks as if the council promise of end of April is not on as the letter says The Committee reiterates the original decision to evict by 31st March :BangHead:
It goes from bad to worse.
Surely the Council copied their letter to the Secretary and Chair of the committee. Have the committee given any reason for why they have refused an appeal?
Perhaps you should write to the committee (enclosing a copy of the Council's letter) asking why they are not adhering to the Council's request and also copy your letter to the Council.
It would seem that the Council's letter is only a 'stay of execution' and not an attempt to arbitrate over the matter. Perhaps in a separate letter you could ask the Council to call a meeting between yourself and two(?) committee members to see whether a satisfactory solution can be achieved as reluctantly you will have no other recourse other than to involve the local press and MP.
Bluecar
Well I been to a Coffee morning," Meet your local MP " and had a interesting meeting a little light at the end of the tunnel maybe? I will have to wait and see ??? I still think the Council reply will be we don't have the power to interfere with elected Committees even if one of them has a criminal record :toothy10:
Surely you have a right of appeal especially as the eviction is on grounds which are untrue.
What does it say about the eviction procedure in your agreement?
Are you sure these letters are coming from the whole committee or just from the secretary? What do the other members of the committee say. Have you pointed out to them the fact the eviction is not signed?
Turn up at the next committee meeting.
Quote from: Digeroo on March 22, 2014, 13:45:24
Surely you have a right of appeal especially as the eviction is on grounds which are untrue.
What does it say about the eviction procedure in your agreement?
Are you sure these letters are coming from the whole committee or just from the secretary? What do the other members of the committee say. Have you pointed out to them the fact the eviction is not signed?
Turn up at the next committee meeting.
The knives are out for me, I sold one of my greenhouses and give permission for them to help themselves to my some of my leek trench soil which is two foot high and is held in with two foot high flag stones it has been built up over many years of soil conditioner, compost, manure, course sand etc. all that I purchased, this soil is been taken to a plot on the same allotments I had a visit from one of the committee informing me that is not allowed! I LOST MY RAG so I told him to pee off ! so I will be reported!!! OMG ( I do believe my plot is lined up for the present Bulling Secretary ) :blob7: :blob7:
Quote from: vidcare on March 23, 2014, 17:14:06
Quote from: Digeroo on March 22, 2014, 13:45:24
Surely you have a right of appeal especially as the eviction is on grounds which are untrue.
What does it say about the eviction procedure in your agreement?
Are you sure these letters are coming from the whole committee or just from the secretary? What do the other members of the committee say. Have you pointed out to them the fact the eviction is not signed?
Turn up at the next committee meeting.
The knives are out for me, I sold one of my greenhouses and give permission for them to help themselves to my some of my leek trench soil which is two foot high and is held in with two foot high flag stones it has been built up over many years of soil conditioner, compost, manure, course sand etc. all that I purchased, this soil is been taken to a plot on the same allotments I had a visit from one of the committee informing me that is not allowed! I LOST MY RAG so I told him to pee off ! so I will be reported!!! OMG ( I do believe my plot is lined up for the present Bulling Secretary ) :blob7: :blob7:
Crunch day tomorrow(I have a vision Psycho blocking me access to my plot ) the Council given me till 22nd April to leave( unconfirmed from them I have requested confirmation nothing forthwith ) then eventually a response from the committee given me 14 days to responded to my appeal and agree to a date of a hearing I intend to call the police if I am blocked as the Eviction Letter has no date or Signature on it,,, its a Mickey mouse setup ! its no disrespect to Mickey Mouse as he has more common sense :blob7:
Well is there any Justice,, I put my case to http://www.newcastleallotments.co.uk/nawg.htm and the reply was from the Chairman the Committee decided that there is sufficient doubt about the accuracy of my comments supported by information from the Court proceedings that we are not in a position to interfere.... my accuracy of my comments state the offender Plea was GUILTY Of Assault by Bashing As was the CPS Letter,, And he is a area Rep for the NAWG !!!!!!Who have rules about The Committee's behaviour must be exemplary and above reproach. :BangHead: :BangHead: :BangHead: