Hi
I planted garlic last year and over wintered it. Some managed to survive even though lots were lost by all during the bad winter.
Just come to dig around and see how its doing. Gutted! Some of the larger garlics have started to split into separate cloves almost as if they have blown. Other garlics that look big and strong in leafage have a very small individual bulb almost like an onion.
What have I done wrong? What should I do with the blown and single bulb garlic?
I,ve been so excited about my first garlic crop and feel gutted. Especially after a friend realised I have saw fly on all my new fruit bushes. BAD DAY :'( :'(
Ripley
Oh don't get upset..its all learning curve.. ;)
Well..lets see..those that have split..just should have been harvested bit sooner..the outer case (paper) is just gone and exposed the cloves..they are still fine to use..nothing lost! ;D
As for those that are like 'onion'..most likely cause is that the clove you've originally planted simply wasn't large enought to produce a divinding bulb. Instead it has only grow into larger individual 'clove'. Even then..nothing lost.. ;D,,you can re-plant those this autumn..if you wish..and get proper bulbs next year..or just use them as they are.
For that reason it is always recommended to plant the largest and best cloves out of several bulbs for planting and use all the small ones for eating. Small cloves just need that bit longer to reach the size of the larger cloves and then they need to grow into bulbs..that will take couple of growth cycles.
As for sawfly...if you can get hold of rhubarb leaves..lay 'sheet' of leaves under those effected bushes and next year the problem doesn't repeat or is less.... ;)
Goodlife thankyou so much for your advice and support. I thought it was all a waste of time.
So I dry it all out side and then just replant the single bulbs in the autumn?
The advice about the saw fly was great as I still have rhubarb going in the garden so I will give that a go!
Thanks once again Ripley
Hey you were not the only one with bad garlic.all mine split(i have a thread on it)also pigeons have had loads of our red currants!
So I dry it all out side and then just replant the single bulbs in the autumn
Yep..outside or in..it doesn't matter, as long as they are kept from a rain and they go papery dry.
You can also use your 'split' garlic for growing too..just choose some of the fattest cloves for it.
I think the weather has caused the garlic to be much earlier this year..so it is so easy not to realize to lift them in time. But 'splitting' bulbs doesn't spoil the eating quality..they just don't look so pretty and perfect..there might be effect for the long term storage..but if your haven't grown field full of garlic it should not be issue.. ;)
Mine have split a bit as well - not all but some look a bit odd. I put it down to the warm dry spring..
I bought some garlic - to eat from Lidl, in a preety little basket- and they are one whole bulb. I thought they were some new variety! :-[
Any way they are brilliant so easy to chop and use!
Keep chin up Ripley!
I'm still using last years garlic. I've a little string bag with all the single solid 'onion' types and still another few bulbs of ordinary clove garlic. Both have kept fine for 12 months so you shouldn't have any problems with use.
I'm eyeing this years crop I planted in the autumn and wondering whether to leave it another couple of weeks. Its been pretty cold and dry here so it might not yet be ready. No rush so long as I catch them before the foliage dies down. BTW replant your own garlic on pretty rich soil as it gets adapted to your own conditions, better than keep buying in. :) Regards
Personally, I'm happy with the 'onion' ones provided they are as big as a standard clove - often they are bigger.
The only 'bad' garlic clove for me is the tiny one that Goodlife uses while planting the rest - it's too much trouble to peel and chop.
Not quite so bad to just peel the tinies and chuck straight into a slow stew, but still easier to plant them (at closer spacing reflecting the yield) and harvest a set of single larger 'onion' cloves.
It's true that the thing you really want to avoid is a small clove growing and splitting to 10 smaller cloves that are even more useless - but you can reduce the chances of this by feeding and watering well and planting the tinies very late, in March-April.
Cheers.
Hi
Just got back from Lottie. Covered soil around berry bushes with rhubarb leaves for the sawfly!
Dug up rest of garlic in that bed but left the other batch for a little longer.
Thanks for all your advice and next year I will keep an eye on the bulb not just the foliage.
Ripley
I've just picked some of my over wintering Garlic today, it might be a bit early but the wind had blown a few of them over so I picked them and a very nice size thet are too, thet are now strung up in the shed, :)
After writing a reply to this post yesterday..I decided to check my garlic too.. ;D
I didn't water my garlic at all this year, but left them to their own devices..and they are looking good.. ;)
I did dug some up and put them to dry on stacked up bread trays with sheet of glass on top to keep rain away.
I'll keep others still going a week or two and then they all come up..must remember to sow kale on their place.. ;)
well at least you dont have white rot, all my autumn red onions and garlic have it... :'(.......gutted..
I planted Garlic on the shortest day of last year in a raised bed 2ft, over wintered and the last couple of weeks its seemd to go over, but to my delight i pulled it today and considering i wasnt expecting to crop until the longest day, i found a bumper crop of sweet medium sized garlic. platted and hung in the kitchen on the herb rack, (which is also full of the finest this year), hard and weird season so far, but as to yet the best ive had. Cucs are outstanding, cabbage awsome, corn superb. cant moan.
ATB D (WEST MIDS)
After reading the Dogs message I once again have a very basic question!! ???
At the moment my garlic is drying in large wooden open sided crates in the sun. I thought that I would braid the good ones in a couple of weeks when they have dried. How long do you leave it until you braid yours?
sorry for such a basic question thanks Ripley
It is not about how long they dry..but you have to feel when they are ready. All the top growth have to be throughly dry..'crispy'..
If there is moisture in the stems..by braiding it, you will 'seal' the moisture in and they will go mouldy.
AND..don't apologize about your questions..if you don't ask..you will not learn... ;)
Often all these 'small' little details are left out of books/answers..may not be important for the writer..but vital for somebody else.
I had a bit of a strange thing happen to the earliest garlic planted (december). It has produced several bulbs with no cloves, just a big garlicky ball! But I used it and taste is same as standard garlic. The rest seems to be developing normally, that was planted more late January (Jan 17 in fact). I know it is very sensitive to temperature, can only think that our odd conditions this year affected it in some way.
Quote from: antipodes on June 14, 2011, 13:46:39
I had a bit of a strange thing happen to the earliest garlic planted (december). It has produced several bulbs with no cloves, just a big garlicky ball! But I used it and taste is same as standard garlic. The rest seems to be developing normally, that was planted more late January (Jan 17 in fact). I know it is very sensitive to temperature, can only think that our odd conditions this year affected it in some way.
Antipodes,
All garlic develops a 'round' a bit like a tabletennis ball, before individual cloves split off. Maybe you harvested just a bit early? Or the garlic foliage dried down early because it has been so dry (not sure whether you had the same drought in France).
My suggestion would be to plant all garlic in late October. Especially hardneck (flowering) garlic which needs a good dose of winter cold. And if it does not get that, it will only produce rounds. By planting earlier, you get all the winter cold and hopefully better clove development. It isn't so critical with non-flowering softneck garlic varieties. They usually split even planted in late winter/early spring. Maybe your garlic was just borderline for winter cold exposure or then again, perhaps it was just the weather.
Quote from: PeterVV on June 12, 2011, 20:17:23
well at least you dont have white rot, all my autumn red onions and garlic have it... :'(.......gutted..
Sorry to hear that. Do you have deep window boxes that you can grow garlic in? Or make a trench and line with thick black plastic with a few drainage holes. You'd have to fill with bought compost, but that should still make growing garlic and onion possible.
Galina,
Quote
Antipodes,
All garlic develops a 'round' a bit like a tabletennis ball, before individual cloves split off. Maybe you harvested just a bit early? Or the garlic foliage dried down early because it has been so dry (not sure whether you had the same drought in France).
Yes there was something amiss, the stems had completely died off, in fact I had to dig down in the ground to get them, i was a bit worried about them rotting. The others, not planted at the same time look OK, well, normal for this time of year, starting to yellow off, looking a bit floppy. I usually wait till they die right back.
Yes we have had drought, it rained once in April and May :o and usually here it is quite rainy. We are just in a rainy patch now, but the plants have already mostly developed through teh worst of it. Funnily enough my onions are excellent so far, which is surprising considering the severe lack of rain.
Quote from: galina on June 14, 2011, 16:31:42
Quote from: PeterVV on June 12, 2011, 20:17:23
well at least you dont have white rot, all my autumn red onions and garlic have it... :'(.......gutted..
Sorry to hear that. Do you have deep window boxes that you can grow garlic in? Or make a trench and line with thick black plastic with a few drainage holes. You'd have to fill with bought compost, but that should still make growing garlic and onion possible.
Sounds like a good idea to me, one of my beds now has it, just trying to keep it off the others. So digging / lining a trench might be a possibility for me. I've been wondering what approach to take, so time to put my thinking cap on !
In a way, I'm glad that I've been forced out of Garlic growing by White Rot. This year's reports seem to show something strange?
I have one little caveat - if you intend to plait, I believe that you should leave a touch of flexibility in the stems - not brittle dry.
And YES to raised beds etc if you have the rot.Some of our best has been in them - see pic. BUT - do NOT use the same bed or the next ?9 years. And DO sterilise your tools in between jobs. And what about your FEET??
Do EVERYTHING you can to minimise the risk of future failure. Life's not the same without the plaits hanging in the kitchen.
Which brings me onto keeping quality. And green lily's comment. Professional advice suggests that early Spring is good - but some say May. So June is exceptional - & not to be taken as the norm. And although we used to keep our Solent Wight into May, it was a shadow of its former self by then. Which suggests freezing - for cooking, not for fresh. Works fine.
= Tim
Quote from: tim on June 14, 2011, 18:41:00
And YES to raised beds etc if you have the rot.Some of our best has been in them - see pic. BUT - do NOT use the same bed or the next ?9 years. And DO sterilise your tools in between jobs. And what about your FEET??
What do you sterilise tools with? I remember watching a program about a kitchen garden, and remember the gardener stating how important cleanliness was to them. Picking up all leaves, scraping boots, sweeping paths etc; it stuck in my head.
At the moment I've left the garlic bed as it is, until I get round to working on it. I've been very wary of going anywhere near it, until I can figure out what to do. I was planning on using it for brasicas and winter salads. So the next garlic bed (I rotate) I need to look at raising.
Quote from: tim on June 14, 2011, 18:41:00
Life's not the same without the plaits hanging in the kitchen.
My sentiments entirely! I couldn't agree more, and as to the flavour, well it stands far above shop bought
I'm wondering if i am the only one who has leek miner in their garlic? :-\
Some of the stalks had that twisted effect, that i'd seen in last years leeks - so i looked for and squashed the little pupae, but some were just doing so badly that I dug them up - and found the little maggoty things down below too. yuck. Not sure now whether to lift them all now - it seems cruel to take them out when the rain has only just arrived to give them a fighting chance.
Either way, at least i've had a few (also unsplit) garlic - my shallots have been totalled by the d**n things.
I've recently noticed (after recent change in the weather) that some of my garlic plants were dying off and looking a bit 'mouldy'. Not every plant but it had become about 1 in 3, the rest look OK. Thought it was natural die off come early (normaly not ready to lift until July). i decided to dig one up and see what was going on and the plant appeared to be rotting, at least the topgrowth was as it came away from the bulb in my hands. On further investigation it appeared the cloves inside were fine once the outer skin was removed, I normally lift and store the whole plant, which then keeps a long time hung up in the garage. Now the cloves of the affected plants might be Ok now but i am guessing they will not store well. We dont use garlic that often in cooking, so how can i make the most of the crop?
I am guessing its the weather thats caused the rotting and not white rot.
I've dug most of mine for the same reason.
Not all are affected but the ones that are seem to be going soft and mouldy from the roots.
We gave up trying to grow onions with similar problems so perhaps I was expecting too much to get away with garlic :(
I was just about to ask about when to harvest garlic when I saw this thread. I too have been stricken by the white rot and I am hoping the garlic has not been affected - so when should I pull them up anyone? Should I wait for the leaves to turn or something, this is the first year of garlic for me.
Sickening, isn't it!
The cloves could well be OK - I would clean & freeze individually.
I would take up the immediately surrounding soil with the bulbs & bin it to try to limit the spread.
Clean your tools& shoes & keep Alliums away from that patch for the recommended time.
My garlic has been looking like rows of healthy leeks most of the winter and spring, but suddenly quite a large percentage sickened and rotted. I'm really sad about it. I've dug about half of them and will do the rest this week.
I have been able to use some by scraping off the blackish rotting outside layers and finding small white clean cloves, but it is very discouraging.
The ones that were starting to develop a whiter rot have been trimmed, cleaned and dried, and I know from earlier years that they will harden and keep quite well.
Garlic is one of the crops most worth growing because of being expensive to buy, so it's a shame.
The only bit of White Rot I have had is from the Garlic I grew of my raised beds but only a couple of bulbs which must say something about raised bed growing for Garlic, but I'm already planning for next year crop to go in later this year, I will be adding top soil to the raised beds to give it a 50/50 compost/soil content, :)
Rotting seems to have ocuurred pretty quickly considering that not too long ago we would have been worried about the garlic not getting enough water. then a relatively short wet spell and they are gone. Very odd. My garlic are planted in raised beds too, so can't have got too waterlogged. Nothing like this has ever happened to my garlic before. always had a good crop.
What are the main indicators of white rot over other kinds of rot/disease. How can i know i have definately got it? If i have it it is a big problem. I grow lots of the allium family (onions, shallots and leeks as well as garlic).
http://apps.rhs.org.uk/advicesearch/profile.aspx?pid=226
Can't mistake it!
What about growing garlic in sterile soil in a container such as a long window box?
Yes indeed,No7!
But you need a new box every year!!
We rotated 7 raised beds until it caught up with us again.
Rather than start another thread but my garlic has 'Rust' on the leaves, anyone suffered this fate before?, looking at info on this disease it seems that the Garlic is still ok to harvest, :)
Aww looks like i have 'The Rot' then. Typical. grown onion family crops for years no problem. Then one year after a long dry spell followed by wet i get it an i am knackered. Argh! Still on the upside its only one bed (only built this spring, - double Argh!), the rest of my alliums are fine, onions and shallots doing well - so far.
If it is only one bed affected, would it be worth changing the soil or some of the soil in the affected bed? How much should I remove to get rid of the worst of the white rot spores? How should i deal with the soil. can i loose it in a non cultivated part of garden or should it be taken away from the garden completely? I could 'lose' it in my front garden, which is down hill from the veg plot in the back and not dug that often.
I am also guessing that i shouldnt save any otherwise healthy looking garlic bulbs to replant next year?
What causes White Rot? anyone know? How might it have got into the garden?
Re: Rust on garlic, had this in past wet summers to no detriment and in fact this year it seems the garlic that isnt showing signs of white rot seems to have some rust on it.
1. No expert, but I say NO to trying to change the soil.
2. As above, but I would play safe & but new garlic. It's just not worth the gamble.
The rot is probably the expensive & widespread enemy of farmers - hence the very long rotation period.
Plenty about it on Google.
been reading this thread, couldthe soil be sterilized by jeys fluid or wouldn't that work( or is it a banned substance) :-X mind the wouldn't be able to be used for a while :-\
Even Armillatox is no guarantee. It's just not worth the agony.
And I imagine that one has take care not to spread the rot to other beds.
My only resort was raised bed & I had the best crop ever from the first one!!
Armatillox might help, watering with onion water the year before you planted a bed might help. I manage to keep ahead of it by rotating, but I always lose a few.
Quote from: tim on June 26, 2011, 15:58:31
1. No expert, but I say NO to trying to change the soil.
2. As above, but I would play safe & but new garlic. It's just not worth the gamble.
The rot is probably the expensive & widespread enemy of farmers - hence the very long rotation period.
Plenty about it on Google.
Why do you say no to changing the soil? Is the risk of spreadiing the disease around the garden too great? Surely if carefull you can remove the problem soil and most of the risk of another dose of White rot. Onions dont root that deeply after all so not much needed to be removed. My affected bed is a raised one so a self contained area.
Because I do not believe that you can clear ALL the infection. Then it only needs a bit to get going again.
I had faith in Armillatox - applied diligently - exact application - turn in - another exact application - oh, dear!
Rotating doesn't really help against white rot..it can stay inactive in soil for 20 yrs..and just waiting onion or garlic to arrive and kick into action again.
What causes White Rot? anyone know? How might it have got into the garden?
It is fungal disease and can come into your garden via infected soil, plant material...or eventually spreading from neighbouring plots if they have it.
Rust' on the leaves, anyone suffered this fate before?, yep..its quite common thingy..but often shows its 'ugly head' when somebody has been bit too liberal with fertilizer and created soft, lush growth that is easily infected by it.. ;)
Rotation? That's a bit unfair an assessment?
Yes - it can stay in the soil for yonks, but do not the professional growers rely on an 8 year rotation? They are struggling on that & a 20 year plan would be impossible?
One can grow a lot of Garlic in a raised bed & we now have 8. I'm afraid my hygiene was at fault in allowing reinfection.
Armatillox and Jayes fluid are not licensed for use as a soil sterilising treatment. An alternative organic treatment is detailed here :- http://www.growyourown.info/page173.html
Armillatox? No, but long used as such, & 'friendly'?
Alternative? Yes - much quoted here, but that's a good resumé.