I use a lot of mulch and actively encourage certain weeds for mulching and composting and have lot of phacelia. Do you think this encourages slugs and snails?
Is this the reason for all the bare soil?
I hope not, we mulch as much as we can, everyone on our site has slug probs , even the people with no weeds, :)
;D Ohh..Digeroo..I think you 'opened can of worms' and a good debate..
Well I suppose mulch will provide damp hidind places for the slugs..but then again...it encourages birds to come and scratch for tasty treats and other predators too.
Personally I find more benefits from mulching than not doing it. And haven't had any moore or less slug trouble then before my mulching days.
And as for 'encouraging weeds'..absolutely beneficial..but very selective 'encouragement'..
Without 'weeds' and mulches I could not grow my veg the way I do now..my plot might not be for everybody's taste and certainly bare soil is not what I'm aiming for...but I only need to look over the hedge to otherside and see how things are grown 'properly' and how much trouble they and their plants are getting with pests and excess work involved keeping things 'so tidy'... ::) err..more like keeping things growing/alive..
I'm still amused about other year when their brassicas were like lace work after cabbage butterflies had their 'dinner' and I hadly had a visitor on mine...I stopped counting how many bottles of 'spray' they got through with little effect... ::)
At the begining you may have some slug trouble but soon the nature balances the pest and predator situation.
Quote from: goodlife on May 28, 2011, 09:39:18
;D Ohh..Digeroo..I think you 'opened can of worms' and a good debate..
Well I suppose mulch will provide damp hidind places for the slugs..but then again...it encourages birds to come and scratch for tasty treats and other predators too.
Personally I find more benefits from mulching than not doing it. And haven't had any moore or less slug trouble then before my mulching days.
And as for 'encouraging weeds'..absolutely beneficial..but very selective 'encouragement'..
Without 'weeds' and mulches I could not grow my veg the way I do now..my plot might not be for everybody's taste and certainly bare soil is not what I'm aiming for...but I only need to look over the hedge to otherside and see how things are grown 'properly' and how much trouble they and their plants are getting with pests and excess work involved keeping things 'so tidy'... ::) err..more like keeping things growing/alive..
I'm still amused about other year when their brassicas were like lace work after cabbage butterflies had their 'dinner' and I hadly had a visitor on mine...I stopped counting how many bottles of 'spray' they got through with little effect... ::)
At the begining you may have some slug trouble but soon the nature balances the pest and predator situation.
I have to say I have been organic/naturally growing for about 25 years now at the same house, and although some pests/predators have found their natural balance I still suffer badly with those little white ground living slugs.
In the past I used nematodes, but 4 years ago I decided to give up those in the hope that nature would balance itself as it has in some of the other problem areas. I have to report now there is still some bad damage, to the extent I have just ordered nematodes again
My garden is toad/frog friendly. I have hedgehogs, and let my ducks in when I can, but yet again they are DESTROYING the asparagus, to the extent they kill the plants, and any new replacements are eaten in the first year. Out of 3 large 25x4ft beds I have had about 5 meals, and they were started 2 years after the garden, so over 20 years now.
Also my greens last year where not like lacework with cabbage whites they where just veins and stumps.
Yours (in sadness)
Sue
PS I forgot to add all my beds are mulched and my meadows are unsprayed and generally left for hay.
The only things I know that eats slugs is Hedgehogs and possibly Thrushes...
Quote from: picman on May 29, 2011, 09:23:04
The only things I know that eats slugs is Hedgehogs and possibly Thrushes...
I read somewhere that hedgehogs will eat slugs, but they prefer most other things first.
Toads definitely eat slugs - one year with a particularly bad "big" slug problem I lifted a stone to find an enormous toad looking particularly bloated and with no intention of moving sitting next to a half eaten slug (! I couldn't eat another mouthful if I tried!!)
Ducks positively adore slugs, I have a small flock of the cutest pom-pom ducks, but I am not sure how to post photos on this site. And apparently those big ground beetles eat slugs, and I think newts.
Do mice eat slugs? And what about grass snakes and slow-worms Anyone know?
I think lot of birds eat small slugs..I've certainly seen robins and sparrow taking some..sometimes I put some on bird table with few worms and other things when I come across them...its nice to sit down and see birds coming for them.
It is those really BIG ones that are not eaten by many..but then again..those are not really problem for plants anyway. Majority of them are feeding on dead plant matter anyway.
Yep mouse and shrews eat insects, slugs and snails.
Good list of slug and snail eating predators..
http://www.haywardm.supanet.com/predators.html (http://www.haywardm.supanet.com/predators.html)
Pigs seem to eat slugs and do a very good job. But unfortunately they eat everything else as well.
I am trying to understand why people do not mulch, why they pour on loads of water but do nothing to minimise evaporation.
I am trying to understand why people do not mulch Ahh..that's why the question.
Well..some are simply not bothered, too much work.. ::) , ingnorance, lack of knowlelge or not able to acess to muching material easily enough (or that's what they think).
I think with lot people it comes down to getting them to try first..trying, seeing and believing is the order.
I am starting to win with a few. But I keep being told about the slugs. But actually the advantages for feeding hedgehogs might pursuade a few to come round.
Quote from: Digeroo on May 29, 2011, 11:36:55
Pigs seem to eat slugs and do a very good job. But unfortunately they eat everything else as well.
I am trying to understand why people do not mulch, why they pour on loads of water but do nothing to minimise evaporation.
Interestingly one year I collected a lot of those very large wall snails and put them in the pigs pen, and they gobbled them up greedily, next day I did the same, and they wouldn't touch them, so I presume there was something in them that disagreed.
Again one year I collected all the green caterpillars from the cabbage whites on my plants, and threw them to the hens who gobbled them up. Next day wouldn't look at them, plus I had come out in a nasty rash on my hands!
All the best
Sue
I think the snails make a frothy discharge when threatened and I have found it affects my skin, maybe the pigs found them unpleasant and learned from that. I squash snails before giving them to the chooks and they seem to like them. but Chickens are dim compared to pigs.! :-\
In my garden I throw the slugs I find to the chickens who love them! Don't have them wandering free in the garden as, although they would find the slugs, they would also eat everything else too! I don't know about mulching increasing slug damage. I suppose in theory it is a nice moist environment, but I haven't noticed that much a difference on the plot where we mulch quite a bit.
Snails get a quick crack and a toss over the fence to the chickens..... They seem to enjoy them, even to the point of playing rugby with the bigger ones.... sometimes for ages! 8)
Digeroo/Goodlife said:
QuoteI am trying to understand why people do not mulch
Ahh..that's why the question.
Well..some are simply not bothered, too much work.. , ingnorance, lack of knowlelge or not able to acess to muching material easily enough (or that's what they think).
Yes I think not being aware is probably the biggest thing. I only really started mulching veg this year, apart from top-dressing with manure or compost in the past. And it's only because of reading recommendations on this forum.
The slug question... I don't know :-\. (Like everyone else!) But I do find that if I leave a lot of weeds, then I get more slug damage, and when that happens I usually weed, and find the attacks ease off. However I haven't noticed this is an issue with mulching so far. :)
I was terrified to see how few people on my site mulch. They prefer to hoe and weed 24/7. I have mulched and through the drought, which is very severe here, 2 months without rain practically, I still have good crops and only watering once a week. We don't seem to get slugs ??? But it does provide a hiding place for lizards, mice, beetles etc., but damage seems negligible compared to the benefits.
We get grass cuttings delivered by the ton, and I use the lion's share. I don't understand it either.
Quote from: Digeroo on May 28, 2011, 08:47:00
I use a lot of mulch and actively encourage certain weeds for mulching and composting and have lot of phacelia. Do you think this encourages slugs and snails?
Is this the reason for all the bare soil?
I wonder if some people like the look of bare soil, to go with the immaculate rows of veg? :o
Our site seems split, some mulch some don't.
I'm a self confessed mulcher ;D and ultimately I don't think it does necessarily encourage slugs, and as others have said it also provides a habitat for other more beneficial creatures. and maybe weeds are worse for providing placefor or encuraging slugs and snails?
I'd always assumed that they come for all the lush weeds, and while they're there they indescriminately also eat your crops. So mulch might just not be attractive, as it's all dead or dying.
You're lucky to have stuff delivered, Robert. Do you think everyone on site knows what it's for?
Our site is also full of bare soil (or completely overgrown!). Though I've seen someone recently laying newspaper round courgette plants.
A lot of people dig grass cuttings and dead leaves in during the winter, but I'm the only one who uses fresh stuff as mulch in serious quantities. I think a lot of it's force of tradition. Changing gardening methods seems to be rather hard!
Like you Robert I am the only one on site who uses grass clippings. The paths were mown and there was a huge pile and I had a lot of it. Three days later I had the rest. I hate seeing bare soil. Once it has heated up in the dalek most things are pretty dead.
After yesterdays rain any bare soil is already bone dry.
Saw some grass clippings on a compost heap yesterday and it was covered in amazing stripped snails including green ones. Never seen so many stripped snails.
I use fresh clippings too.. ;D I actually have couple of little lawn areas in lottie..around 2 very big apple trees. I could not grow much else there so why not grass..after all, it is a crop for me. We also mow the grass on avenues around our plots and I get more of the good stuff.. ;)
That's great to know. I was a little cautious because I don't see it done round this way, and I had heard that it would take nitrates when it breaks down before giving them back or some such thing... However if you lot are doing it, I will keep going! :)
I had heard that it would take nitrates when it breaks down Err..nitrogen.. ;) You get round this by putting some chicken pellets or other form of fertilizer on top of soil first..then the grass..and as you top up with grass the previous layer will release the nitrogen for the new stuff.
But saying that I've ofter forgotten to do fertilize first..and haven't had any problems with nitrogen robbing.
Usually it is more associated with more woody stuff. Grass do 'rot' that quickly that you are topping it up quite often anyway.
I use the fresh stuff as well Pigeonseed - no probs so far :) The only problem is getting enough of it !
Thanks for info.
I added loads of fresh and partially composted stuff again today, just enough for a collar around the squash, beans and cucs atm. But it helps protect them from the wind as well as keeping moisture in I hope.
I have used fresh lawn mowing (straight from the box) for around 10 years now, and all seems ok. To be honest there is no way I could garden without doing this.
This year 2 of the onion beds got left (not enough mowings) and the weeds got higher than the onions. Now I have started weeding the weeds are FULL of great big fat juicy slugs, so I reckon lawnmowings are better than weeds.
All the best
Sue
I let mine heat up for three days before I use them when I know there is a lot of weed in them. I am always amazed at how hot they get and how quickly it happens.
I have been using phacelia and fat hen as well as recylced compost and straw, as you say there are just not enough grass clippings. Tried shredded paper but it blew all over the place.
Actually, most slugs arent damaged by mulch, and the ones that are heal quickly in hospital ::) :P
Would be interested in what everyone uses to mulch. I use compost/manure when I have it but never have enough. Have tried newspaper (flat around plants) and also shredded but as Digeroo said - it doesnt stay put.
I also water and then put dry earth on top to stop evaporation. Would love to hear what others do - do you buy in stuff?
Yesterday I spent an hour for mulching. I managed to get good amount of various green stuff together by cutting soft growth from hedges, grass clipping, strimming all kind of weeds around my plot boundaries..I ran the mower over it all and had several barrow fulls of the stuff..lovely.. ;D
And because it had bit of woody stuff mixed in as well, I gave my plants bit of commercial farm yard manure ;)
Paper is fine but you do need to dip it bucket of water before putting in on and perharps weight it down with some other stuff as well.
I don't buy any mulch stuff in at all..though I've got chickens as well, so I get 'stuff' from their bedding as well and I do buy that stuff.
I used to buy some straw..but now that there is not many farmers around here who would bale their straw into small bales, I've not bothered anymore..