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General => The Shed => Topic started by: macmac on January 11, 2011, 22:08:43

Title: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: macmac on January 11, 2011, 22:08:43
I've just watched H.F.W. s Fish Fight.
Just when you thought things couldn't get anymore ridiculous >:( >:( >:(
Fishermen "discarding"dead fish netted over their quota in the name of conservation.Surely common sense should be applied, dumping dead fish is hardly conservation.
Any suggestions folk ? :o
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: BarriedaleNick on January 12, 2011, 07:30:20
I knew that discard was an issue but that really bought it home.
Suggestions - give them limited days to fish in certain areas and let them land it all.  Thats what they seem to want..
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: galina on January 12, 2011, 12:30:52
Quote from: BarriedaleNick on January 12, 2011, 07:30:20
I knew that discard was an issue but that really bought it home.
Suggestions - give them limited days to fish in certain areas and let them land it all.  Thats what they seem to want..

Yes, this sounds the most cost efficient and environmentally friendly way.  Or find a way of trading surplus unused allocation against fish actually caught.  Do all fishermen have surplusses of the same fish types? I had heard of discarding unwanted fish, but not the scale of it.  Such waste!

What I also wondered, especially after they threw back one endangered fish alive, was whether they could land the nets into a water tank and throw more live discards into the water?
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: Bill Door on January 12, 2011, 18:53:35
I agree that it is a waste and something should be done.  However, this situation needs careful consideration as I don't see that there is any easy way out of it yet.

Bill
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: rugbypost on January 12, 2011, 19:16:18
The law makers in brussels were worried about stocks Ithink it was cod first you can only catch so many ton per fish hold, but if your hold is three quater full and on your last haul its over full i agree with you all what is the point in throwing dead fish over board . To me do we need another parliment that is claiming more in expensess   than the ones at home  and it seems its only a place for mps to retire with a golden hand shake Close it down save  6 billion a year keep services, schools,  universities , hospitals, here free for our own who have payed there dues over the years. Rugbypost
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: sunloving on January 12, 2011, 20:00:03
It just so happens i am a marine biologist and the problem of over fishing is the biggest loss of wildlife that the UK has faced. Fishermen already massively under report thier activities and push the boundaries of the the quotas, if you allow them to land over the quota then they will massively and every time the fisheries officers catch them doing it they will say that its conserving fish becuase they arent being thrown back dead. the fact is if you have a permit to harvest a fixed amount and you keep on dropping your nets despite approaching this amount and you willfully throw back shed loads of dmaged wildlife then you are not sticking to the rules and you should stop,or try to find ways of keeping the catch alive to be thrown back not try to blackmail us into changing a regulation that cannot even begin to address the collapse of the stocks that your activities caused.

Common property means that unlike farming where the person making the profit owns the land ,every person who uses it will hammer it to get hte maximum profit an accept no responsiblity for the future of the resourse, unless they are stopped.  dont be fooled by the small improvement in some stocks, if youve fished out 99% of the fish so you are down to 1% and then the stocks double youve still only got 2% of the original stock this is not a complete recovery.

Fortunately the marine bill is creating marine conservation zones that will exclude comercial fishermen and thier equipment that destroys vast swathes of our living ocean floor only thier exclusion will make any difference at all but dont be fooled, just becuase its traditional to rape the sea floor and exact massive carnage on our unloved marine life doesnt mean it is right. 

sorry rant over its just makes my blood boil over , if you could see the damage done every day just like if your local forests grasslands and marshes were ploughed up by profiteers then youd feel the same.

x sunloving
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: 1066 on January 12, 2011, 20:33:33
I've just heard about this - was this the one that was filmed in Hastings?
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: daitheplant on January 12, 2011, 20:46:44
No offence intended sunloving, but for an academic your spelling and grammar are crap. ;D
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: sunloving on January 13, 2011, 09:08:24
i know, its rant mode ! feeling calmer this morning so spelling is better :)
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: macmac on January 13, 2011, 10:26:29
Thanks sunloving it's always good to hear more sides of an argument,particularly when the the comments are so clearly well informed.
As for ranting it's a "sport"I enjoy on a regular basis.I can't understand folk who don't get excited about stuff.
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: ACE on January 13, 2011, 18:21:09
As a sea angler, I take home what I catch if it is edible. We sometimes get checked by the fisheries blokes if we are out in the boat to see if any fish we have caught is undersize, I can if possible put any undersize fish back but sometimes the fish have put up such a fight (and I don't blame them) the fish is not viable to throw back in the water. It gets used as bait for bigger fish but it is against the law and I would be fined if the fisheries came by at that time. I do not use a gaff anymore if the fish is too large to haul in the boat as that is certain death so I will lean over and unhook it if it is something that I would not eat like shark, big rays,  large congers etc. This can be extremely dangerous at times.

I know where they are coming from with these programmes but just because you are a cook does not give you the right to preach to me. They should all get back below stairs where they belong and get off the telly all together. Hugh Fearnley Eatitall  is such an irritating tw@t with his personal vendetta against Tesco, somebody with a more scientific background should host the programme, people would take more notice.
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: sunloving on January 13, 2011, 19:29:01

As for ranting it's a "sport"I enjoy on a regular basis.I can't understand folk who don't get excited about stuff.
[/quote

;D
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: tonybloke on January 13, 2011, 20:26:30
Quote from: sunloving on January 13, 2011, 19:29:01

As for ranting it's a "sport"I enjoy on a regular basis.I can't understand folk who don't get excited about stuff.
[/quote

;D

I agree!!
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: dtw on January 13, 2011, 21:31:05
I'm an occasional sea angler, and haven't caught anything of edible size in recent years.
All of the tiddlers I have caught have been thrown back alive.

Why are mackerel a sustainable fish?
Surely if we all change from eating cod to mackerel then they will become very scarce.

I'm sure somebody will think of a way to farm sea fish eventually.
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: OllieC on January 13, 2011, 21:42:14
Quote from: dtw on January 13, 2011, 21:31:05
I'm sure somebody will think of a way to farm sea fish eventually.

You mean like Salmon?
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: valmarg on January 13, 2011, 22:13:28
Yes I did, and I'm going to have an enormous rant.

What you saw in Hugh's progamme was the result of grocer Heath's insistence that we join the then 'Common Market'.  He sold our fishing industry down the swanee, particularly to the Spanish.

We are now sufferng the consequences - Common Market/EU the UK are the losers.

I hope he's rotting in purgatory for the next million years, before going to hell. ;D

valmarg
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: cambourne7 on January 13, 2011, 22:19:26
watching the salmon thing now scary

I only eat Hake, salmon, skate and grouper i hate cod and sorry i tried fishing once saw the worm and did a runner :)

- Salmon i eat about once in a blue moon
- Hake i have about every 2 weeks if i can and it comes from sustainable source in SA (waitrose)
- Skate i dont like the farmed stuff so dont get to eat this often
- Grouper is a cod replacement i fell in love with in NZ its a wonderful fish but sadly not available in the UK although you can get there smaller cousin strawberry grouper sometimes which is ok but not a great deal of meat on it..

Cam
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: Froglegs on January 13, 2011, 22:23:11
Quote from: OllieC on January 13, 2011, 21:42:14
Quote from: dtw on January 13, 2011, 21:31:05
I'm sure somebody will think of a way to farm sea fish eventually.

You mean like Salmon?
Why not?
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: Borlotti on January 13, 2011, 23:24:41
Yes, but I don't like fish to eat, I mean I do like fish, but not in a goldfish bowl or on the table with their eyes looking at me.  Poor fish, let them have a life.  My son and I went fishing and were quite happy for months until we caught a fish, then screamed (well I did) and a nice man came and took it off the hook and threw it back.  Never went fishing again, OK when you don't catch anything.
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: tonybloke on January 13, 2011, 23:30:12
Quote from: valmarg on January 13, 2011, 22:13:28
Yes I did, and I'm going to have an enormous rant.

What you saw in Hugh's progamme was the result of grocer Heath's insistence that we join the then 'Common Market'.  He sold our fishing industry down the swanee, particularly to the Spanish.

We are now sufferng the consequences - Common Market/EU the UK are the losers.

I hope he's rotting in purgatory for the next million years, before going to hell. ;D

valmarg

erm, I thought we are running out of fish stocks due to man's insistence on raping the sea for all it's got?
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: gordonsveg on January 14, 2011, 08:55:06
Well said ace.
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: sunloving on January 14, 2011, 09:12:56
Quote from: tonybloke on January 13, 2011, 23:30:12
Quote from: valmarg on January 13, 2011, 22:13:28
Yes I did, and I'm going to have an enormous rant.

What you saw in Hugh's progamme was the result of grocer Heath's insistence that we join the then 'Common Market'.  He sold our fishing industry down the swanee, particularly to the Spanish.

We are now sufferng the consequences - Common Market/EU the UK are the losers.

I hope he's rotting in purgatory for the next million years, before going to hell. ;D

valmarg

erm, I thought we are running out of fish stocks due to man's insistence on raping the sea for all it's got?

They are linked in that before it was only uk fishermen doing the competing to take all the fish they could, but then european fishermen were allowed to take fish in certain waters and this increased the competition for a declining resource and stimulated a kind of fishing gear arms race to be the ones to catch every fish in the waters so that those foreigners couldnt take them. so the level of damage skyrocketed.

:) x sunloving
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: OllieC on January 14, 2011, 09:50:10
Quote from: Froglegs on January 13, 2011, 22:23:11
Quote from: OllieC on January 13, 2011, 21:42:14
Quote from: dtw on January 13, 2011, 21:31:05
I'm sure somebody will think of a way to farm sea fish eventually.

You mean like Salmon?
Why not?

Hmmm, it might catch on...  ::)
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: macmac on January 14, 2011, 14:45:17
http://www.fishfight.net/
This is a link to sign the petition if anyone's interested.
While solutions to the problem may not be evident I think SOMETHING should be done.
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: gp.girl on January 14, 2011, 16:17:25
Quote from: dtw on January 13, 2011, 21:31:05
I'm an occasional sea angler, and haven't caught anything of edible size in recent years.
All of the tiddlers I have caught have been thrown back alive.

Why are mackerel a sustainable fish?
Surely if we all change from eating cod to mackerel then they will become very scarce.

I'm sure somebody will think of a way to farm sea fish eventually.

Cod was tried and failed  :( :(

Their point was to eat the fish used for salmon farming instant tripling of the amount of fish availiable and to eat fish such as dab which are routinly discarded and would be better much eaten.

Throwing edible fish back dead will never conserve fish stocks. Personally all fish caught/killed would have to be landed but only sold if a fisherman had quota. The rest would be given away to be processed and sold by other people. Cruel I know but fishermen would learn to catch fish selectively very quickly.
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: telboy on January 14, 2011, 20:53:44
This debate throws up a real bag of worms.

'One idea' was to reduce the fishing time & allow the fishermen to catch all & bring the catch back to port.
Another debate.

In all industries the objective is profit. In the above 'One idea' would be the temptation to dump at sea less profitable fish for the best return. HFW in his programmes has tried to persuade the sceptical public to eat (and enjoy) lesser known species of fish - in the long term I don't think so!
In time the public will return to cod & salmon :P. It's the way of the world, like his chicken campaign.
Remember that????

I worked on deep sea trawlers in the mid sixties & didn't eat fish for five years after that. Sea sickness you ask? NO.

Just remember there are no bogs in the fish hold!!!!!!!

And if you think sea lice are unpleasant when you buy your dyed salmon, what about the worms in cod? Probably not so bad these days, the fish are never big enough to be infested. As I recall a cod breeds after 5 years of age. Seeing the specimens on fish slabs - no wonder the stocks are low.

Get some mackerel or sardines IF, as I cannot find, you can get fish that isn't a week old.
Always remember - REALLY FRESH FISH DOESN'T SMELL!!!!


Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: daitheplant on January 14, 2011, 20:55:03
Glad to hear it sunloving, though sentences should still start with a capital. ;D ;D ;D As for fishing. tried it once as a boy, but could never see the point in drowning worms. It appears to me though, that we are the only nation that sticks to our quotas, just show how soft we`ve become over the years.
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: Mr Smith on January 14, 2011, 21:14:21
 

      I think you will find that the only people raping our waters of fish(sorry European waters) are countries such as the like of Spain who are using  boats registered in the UK to get away with catching extra quotas and landing fish the size of tadpoles, the first industry to be hit by of our membership in to the Commom Market(sorry European union) all those years ago was the fishing industry, our kid was on the trawlers at the time and lost his job,
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: macmac on January 16, 2011, 17:40:26
Did anyone see the programme last night ?
If you think you're buying FRESH fish that isn't always the case.
I found it very unsettling as we used to have a couple of independant fishmongers in our town ,now sadly closed we're at the mercy of the supermarkets with their "inventive"labelling :(
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: Borlotti on January 16, 2011, 18:58:09
After seeing the programme, no more prawn cocktail for us.  :( :( :(
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: galina on January 16, 2011, 22:09:38
Quote from: Mr Smith on January 14, 2011, 21:14:21


      I think you will find that the only people raping our waters of fish(sorry European waters) are countries such as the like of Spain who are using  boats registered in the UK to get away with catching extra quotas and landing fish the size of tadpoles, the first industry to be hit by of our membership in to the Commom Market(sorry European union) all those years ago was the fishing industry, our kid was on the trawlers at the time and lost his job,

Yes, I have never understood why British fishermen can quite legally sell their fishing boats and, more importantly, their fishing quota, to non-Brits - it may be profitable for the individual fisherman but it means that the overall British fishing allocation is shrinking. 
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: greenthing on January 16, 2011, 23:27:50
I think a combination of 
bigger holes in the nets will allow smaller fish to escape
impose a total weight limit of ALL fish caught per month
limit the number of days you can fish
introduce conservation no fish zones
introduce a fish breading and release program
but who would want to throw there money into the ocean with no guarantee of a return

having a quota per fish species will not work as they will keep
catching and dumping until they fulfill there quota of the most valuable fish

if the fishermen had any scruples they would not keep catching and dumping
until there quota are reached

the problem is we are all too greedy and the world is over populated

big multinational companies  are now fishing to extinction blue fin tuna and stock piling and freezing to trade in the future when the stocks are exhausted




Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: valmarg on January 17, 2011, 22:19:16
Quote from: tonybloke on January 13, 2011, 23:30:12
Quote from: valmarg on January 13, 2011, 22:13:28
valmarg
erm, I thought we are running out of fish stocks due to man's insistence on raping the sea for all it's got?

Well we wern't until grocer Heath sold our fishing industry down the swanee.  The UK fishing industry was responsibly maintained, but then grocer Heath sold it in the cause of european peace.  It let in the Spanish, etc with their dredgers which scooped up the fish, hence the shorttages of previously sustainable stocks,

valmarg
Title: Re: Did you see Hugh ?
Post by: sunloving on January 18, 2011, 08:13:20

Fish stocks were in decline once steam power came in in the early 1900s, it was british fishermen who fished out the majority of our large fish.

Only man power and sail power fisheries were sustainable and the advent of steam and petrol power wiped out most of our stocks. Its not european fishermen that cuased the problem its overfishing and a failure to properly regulate fishing activity.

x sunloving