My nieghbour has a window overlooking my garden. They have unfortuneately chosen this room to be their bedroom so have taken to complaining if I do gardening early in the morning. The previous occupants of the house did not use the bedroom overlooking my garden very much, and I did not do early gardening on those occassions when I knew it was in use.
I did wait until 6.30 this morning!!! I have always done gardening very early I tend to get up at 5 or 6 am in the summer.
They do not like me digging and now they do not like me watering. Nowadays I tend to go the allotment so it is perhaps only once a week. They are lucky since when I was working I always did a couple of hours before breakfast and started work at 8 am. I did not have an allotment to go to.
But now due to their choice of room I now seem to be expected to give up my use of my vegetable garden. They knew it was a veg garden when they bought the house.
Meanwhile I am thinking of erecting a large greenhouse which is rather visible to them though it is a pleasant green colour. Though it is not directly in the line of vision from any of their windows.
Should I
1. Ignore them altogether and hope they move bedrroms/house.
2. Stop early morning gardening and erect the greenhouse.
3. Let them totally dictate what I do in my garden
Other suggestions and solutions would be most welcome.
Wait until he gets really upset with your anti social behavior. Then he will come around and whack you with a pickaxe handle. You can then get him sent down for a few months and you can get on with your urgent gardening.
Loss of sleep can make sane people unable to control their actions.
Give me his address and I will send him a well used pick handle. It saved me hours arguing with unreasonable neighbours. I don't need it anymore, now they can see my side of any problems.
I take it you think I am being unreasonable. But they have chosen to use that room as their bedroom. They have at least two others one of which is bigger. If I garden in the evening I am distuerbed by his music.
Their house has not only windows front and back but this one at the side overlooking land that does not belong to them. It is not my fault that we own the land directly under their window.
What time is it reasonable to garden? Seems nighttime noise is defined as 11pm to 7am. It must be below the permitted level. Though I do not understand how 7 am is defined as the end of the night when it is light soon after 5.
I may be being incredibly dense here, but I cannot see how watering, digging etc can cause a disturbance to someone, unless you are extremely and abnormally noisy in the process! Now, if you decided to strim the lawn or use a mini digger at 6am - that would be an issue.
They might be in their bedroom - with the window open - ok. You are below that level by several feet (unless it is bungalows with no fencing etc) so you are not intruding on their privacy in their bedroom. I am currently speaking from the position of having a neighbour's relative's dog in residence for the last few days.nights - barking beyond 10pm and earlier than 6am - but still struggling to see what the grounds for complaint they have are...
I've never thought of gardening as a noisy activity! Do you have very stony ground so that your spade clanks loudly against the stones every time? I bet you don't !!! Sounds they are being somewhat unreasonable to me, but it can be difficult when really one wants to live as peacably as possible with one's neighbours. Tricky one.
Hmmm difficult, but I am with you Digeroo in that I do my gardening early in the morning too. If you had a dog it would want to be let out early in the morning and could well bark and wake them up, so your gardening can't be as noisy as that, and watering hardly makes any noise, could they buy some earplugs?
As as rule of thumb I tend to feel that before 8.00am or after 8.00pm it's reasonable to expect uninterupted peace and quiet and I woulnd't really be out in the garden then, not even for a bit of quiet pottering. With something like a greenhouse I'd certainly mention it to my neighbours out of courtesy.
I would continue to do my gardening just as before, presuming you are not using any moterised stuff. They are being unreasonable not you. While I can understand there need to sleep it doesn't matter. If you had small children would they expect you to keep them in till they got up.Kids would be playing out just as kids do and they would have to expect that.
There are rules about noise, I doubt if this one is part of them.
Re the greenhouse, if you get planning permission to put it there thats that!! I don't think I would just put put there though, they are likely to complain so better get yourself sorted before you do all the work.
They have options.. close the window, use ear plugs(I did when on night duty) sleep in another room, go to bed earlie or just accept it..all their own choices. Your garden has no options..it is there. If you have chosen to not do this as early as you used to or not every day, you have compromised..what more can you do...
Enjoy yor garden
XX Jeannine
if the neighbour can hear you watering and digging in the garden, perhaps you should ask them to close their bedroom window, 'cause if they can hear you.......................... ;) :D
I think it is unreasonable of them to complain based on what you've said. They shouldn't expect you to change your habits, assuming you're not taking a loud radio out there.....
People who live in flats or terraces don't expect neighbours to keep the same hours as them, this seems the same case.
My neighbour used to garden just near our window from 5am in the morning in just a pair of shorts, till he was 90 - I envied his stamina and wouldn't have dreamed of wanting him to stop. Smile sweetly and give them some produce is my advice.
I stay up late, love my tea in bed about 9 am and read book until 10 am. If people want to get up at 5 am, I have no problem with that. The Council have been cutting down our trees and the noise of the machine that makes bark is not so good, but I just shut the windows. I don't really mind any noise, gardening, children playing, dust carts, traffic. The only noise that really disturbs and upsets me is a car crash outside my house or a fight when the pubs have closed. Perhaps you should tell your neighbours to the call the 'gardening police', only joking. Tell them to live next to me with the double glazing firm next door and the Chinese restaurant and the ducks in the back yard, and the dogs barking and the drug addicts in the flats that have fights once a week. Oh happy days, I would love to live next door to a gardener.
When we stay at our caravan our Sunday morning doze is often ruined by people cutting their grass with petrol mowers at about 9am.
Some are not happy unless the lawn is shaved and turning Brown. ;D
Having spent many years living in a city the noise is no big deal but I would not like it if people started suggesting to me what bedroom I should sleep in...sorry Dig but that is a little too intrusive to my mind.
We have a communal courtyard at the back of the property and the one thing that has irritated me is the two brown bins,you know food and garden waste live opposite my living room window and are even closer when I sit outside my window,after smelling the stench and watchingthe maggots crawl over it I finally decided to suggest we find another home for them to my neighbours,all I got was they have been here ten years and me ten minutes and why did I want to change everything :o :o :o
Er I would have thought it pretty obvious really...........
Sorry deviating but to me it is unreasonable...to them reasonable.......I am pretty sure they put them there when my property was empty.
Neighbours.....who needs em ?
I think I managed to hit the fence with the water from the hose pipe so it was a bit louder than normal. I also think I did a bit a scrapping off the weeds from the top of the soil. Perhaps you have it Tonybloke perhaps is it more of a matter of what I might hear.
I certaimly do not bark. ;D I do occassionally talk to the robin and call it when I find a wireworm. Poor thing is getting hungry. No radio. No stimmer. Lawn mower not used at this time. No machinery though someone has a machine of some kind which starts at 4am. Think it is USAF.
The bedroon is upstairs there is a window downstairs but there is a fence in front of it. I have promised not to grow anything large in front of it.
Actually the guy also objects to a lady from up the road parking her car in front of his house. Even though the place in question is actually in front of my garden and not his. There is nothing either of us can do anyway. It was a turning place when the road ended there but it is no longer needed since there are now three further building phases beyond.
I have been gardeming there for 25 years much of it between 5 and 7 in the morning I used to leave for work at 7.30. The previous occupant of the house complained about all sorts mostly about bindweed and moles. He said our rabbit was taking him to an early grave. But he never complained about the early morning gardening.
I am not suggesting what bedroom they should use, but they are dictating what I can do in my garden because of their choice of room. The two things are connected. If they choose that room they will have to face up to the fact that I own the land underneath the window. If they want to control what happens under the window they will have to use a different room.
My next door neighbours in my apartment are new, about three months. I have had notes about wind chimes,my TV on after 11 pm, something rattling on my balcony in a wind. They bang doors which has resulted in china falling down in my cabinet. I have lost 4 Spode Italian plates and I cup to the banging.
Their bedroom is the other side of my living room and their bathroom the other side of my dining room..after numerous notes which I ignored as they were not signed she and her husband knocked on my door one evening beacuse she could hear my TV.
I invited them in, they heard the amount of sound coming from the box, she said the walls must be very thin as she could hear every word from the TV when she was in bed. I agreed completely and said, yes I can hear every word you say in your bed too. They left. We have not had I complaint since.
It was on the tip of my tongue to compliment them on doubling up in the shower, great way to conserve water.... but I thought better of it. I will save that one for another time if I need to. I could then complain about excessive laughter and squealing.
Just do your gardening.. sometimes in life we just have to put up with things.
Don't think Betula should have to put up with the stinky bins though.
XX Jeannine
7am to 7pm seem to be the guidelines set out by the noise police. They may even be law, that I do not know. But they seem reasonable to me. 5 am is just being inconsiderate. Just because you were there first is not a good argument. I have been a noisy neighbour when I done up an old house. But I would never start until a reasonable time and always finished about 6.30pm. I did warn them if it was going to be a really noisy day and one day they said they had relatives visiting, so I put the job off until another day.
I would not put up with your behavior, I might even call environmental services to put an abatement order on you.
Here's a bit of copy and paste=
It is a criminal offence for people to cause noise and nuisance which results in people being unable to relax and enjoy their home and community life
From what youve written theyre not dictating what you can do in your garden and not asking you to give up gardening. Theyre just asking for peace and quiet at a time when most people expect to have peace and quiet. Im with unwashed about 8pm to 8am. There are contract gardeners here who arent allowed to start beofre 8am. In the summertime when people have windows open sound travels and the clank of a hoe might not sound much to you but might be waking them up. How you deal with it depends on what kind of relationship you want to have with them if any.
Quote from: ACE on July 29, 2010, 22:10:14
7am to 7pm seem to be the guidelines set out by the noise police. They may even be law, that I do not know.
I would not put up with your behavior, I might even call environmental services to put an abatement order on you.
Here's a bit of copy and paste=
It is a criminal offence for people to cause noise and nuisance which results in people being unable to relax and enjoy their home and community life
mikmen deliver down our street at 4.30 a.m., the bin's are emptied at 7.a.m. (must be earlier at the end of the street), paperboys deliver papers at early-o-clock, all without complaint!!
glad we don't live over the water where all the old farts live, where folk can't start work 'til half-way through the morning!!
Sorry to sound smug but we've got lovely neighbours :)
and I think they like us too-we give em lots of stuff from the lottie ;)
That said I do sympathise :(
It would seem that people work in different time zones. My OH goes to bed about 1 am and gets up late and I got to bed about 10 and get up at 5. It depends on which time zone you live in whether you mind a noise at a particular time.
QuoteNight time noise
The Anti-social Behaviour Act 2003 amended the Noise Act 1996 and enables local authorities in England and Wales to tackle night time noise emitted from dwellings and gardens between the hours of 11.00 pm and 7.00 am. To enforce these powers local authorities must ensure that an environmental health officer takes reasonable steps to investigate complaints about noise emitted from dwellings. If the officer is satisfied that noise exceeds the permitted level, a warning notice may be served on the person responsible. If the warning is ignored, the officer may issue a fixed penalty notice of £100, enter the dwelling and confiscate the noise making equipment (obstructing confiscation carries a fine of up to £1000), or prosecute (fine up to £1000). In Scotland similar action can be taken under the Anti-Social Behaviour (Noise Control) (Scotland) Regulations 2005.An extension of the Noise Act came into force in February 2008, enabling local authorities in England and Wales to tackle night time noise from licensed premises.
I still have not found the permitted level. But seems I can make quite a noise after 7am.
Basically the guy is a control freak and I am not willing to be controlled.
I used to have awful neighbours both sides. It came as quite a shock because we had such nice neighbours at our previous house. I thought this one was nicer but now I am not convinced. The people the other side are BBQ fanatics so we used to be unable to use our garden at all one nicer weekends.
if the neighbours are 'smoking you out' with their BBQ's, you can complain to the local environmental health dept. smoke can be more of a nuisance than noise.
I do not think I am ever going to get those bins moved Jeannine,not without a big row and I don't think I could deal with it at the moment. :(
Keep going with your gardening - we don't have many weeks of early days. You can't be any louder than road noise. When they complain just smile sweetly & explain that watering has to be done early or late & that it is more comfortable to do it early. Just don't get into a slanging match - noone wins those.
Just out of curiosity why do you have to work in that area so early? Household chores come to mind or would that disturb hubby..
OK to 8am to 8 pm but surely that refers to really "hearable" noise, like mowing lawns, music, using tools, banging and crashing etc?? It seems to me that they are objecting to this guy just going about his business!! What if he wanted to have breakfast outside in HIS garden at 6.30? That doesn't seem to be an unreasonable thing to do and I don't see how it would really make more noise than watering plants?
My guess is that it's summer, they have the windows open and they are light sleepers. Maybe the digging would be noisy, but watering? That just seems ridiculous to me.
Face it, some people are just anally retentive :( the car parking example seems to give fuel to that theory.
Maybe at least be aware that they are noise sensitive and take extra care about activities that might be noisy but to be honest I would not think they could stir up trouble by you hand watering a garden early in the morning!
How sad this thread is! I think that your home is your castle and that if you want to potter round your garden at whatever time day or night it is your right to do just that!
I obviously understand the noise angle if you were using any equipment - but pottering etc is your right as far as I am concerned. I would smile sweetly and say that I will be as quiet as possible! End of - no discussion! How dare anyone try to stop you using your property for your own enjoyment - providing - of course - that you are not making unnecessary noise!
The number of people here also agreeing that they wouldn't "do it". I find this very surprising as to how many of you feel like this. If you were having wild parties for days on end etc yes I would agree with them but to have your life "structured" by your neighbours "whims" Blow that for a game of soldiers!
The number of people that are surprised that you are in your garden at that time also surprises me - I think that I must be very "odd" if I do as I like without any thought for my neighbours sleep!!
And Jeannine I don't think you need planning permission for a greenhouse - just put it where you want it and enjoy it. Blow whether your neighbours like where you have put it. It is YOUR house and garden to enjoy 24 hours a day.
Phew - that has got me quite heated!
Ann
They sound absolutely horrible! No doubt they moved to the back room because they thought it was too noisy at the front, and they have probably fallen out with most of your other neighbours too. Pottering in the garden isnt a noisy activity - it isnt as if you are using a strimmer or chopping down trees. They are lucky they aren't living next door to a barking dog or first year students.
Some people unreasonably expect total silence, and get wound up at the slightest rustle, lying there gritting their teeth. It is their anger keeping them awake, not the actual noise. I wouldnt give them an inch, as they will only find something else to annoy them. Offer them some veg, smile sweetly and suggest earplugs or a move to the country.
Quote from: betula on July 29, 2010, 21:15:00
We have a communal courtyard at the back of the property and the one thing that has irritated me is the two brown bins,you know food and garden waste live opposite my living room window and are even closer when I sit outside my window,after smelling the stench and watchingthe maggots crawl over it I finally decided to suggest we find another home for them to my neighbours,all I got was they have been here ten years and me ten minutes and why did I want to change everything :o :o :o
Er I would have thought it pretty obvious really...........
Sorry deviating but to me it is unreasonable...to them reasonable.......I am pretty sure they put them there when my property was empty.
Neighbours.....who needs em ?
HI Betula
I would have moved them by now. You have a right even in a communal garden to not have everyone's bins under your window. Surely there is another space somewhere!
Quote from: Old bird on July 30, 2010, 12:11:05
How sad this thread is! I think that your home is your castle and that if you want to potter round your garden at whatever time day or night it is your right to do just that!
I obviously understand the noise angle if you were using any equipment - but pottering etc is your right as far as I am concerned. I would smile sweetly and say that I will be as quiet as possible! End of - no discussion! How dare anyone try to stop you using your property for your own enjoyment - providing - of course - that you are not making unnecessary noise!
The number of people here also agreeing that they wouldn't "do it". I find this very surprising as to how many of you feel like this. If you were having wild parties for days on end etc yes I would agree with them but to have your life "structured" by your neighbours "whims" Blow that for a game of soldiers!
The number of people that are surprised that you are in your garden at that time also surprises me - I think that I must be very "odd" if I do as I like without any thought for my neighbours sleep!!
And Jeannine I don't think you need planning permission for a greenhouse - just put it where you want it and enjoy it. Blow whether your neighbours like where you have put it. It is YOUR house and garden to enjoy 24 hours a day.
Phew - that has got me quite heated!
Ann
Well said Old Bird!
Quote from: Digeroo on July 29, 2010, 23:42:00
Quote
I still have not found the permitted level. But seems I can make quite a noise after 7am.
With that sort of attitude I can see why you have trouble with neighbours
Quote
I used to have awful neighbours both sides. I thought this one was nicer but now I am not convinced. The people the other side are BBQ fanatics so we used to be unable to use our garden at all one nicer weekends.
Makes me wonder if it aint the neighbours in the middle who are the trouble makers. After all you dont seem to give a d&mn about them, so why should they give a flying f#*k about you.
Digeroo I think for what it's worth & with all that life has & continues to throw at you you must enjoy your garden. Sanity is important to us all & you deserve & need to keep yours ;).
Many thanks for all your comments. I have been thinking about it and I think that it is not the fact that they want the morning silence but the manner of the complaint. It was a demand rather than a quiet discussion about the problem.
I have always watered in the early morning because in the evening it encourages the slugs. The pressure is good early too. Later in the day it is just too hot for watering and I suffer from sun burn. I always gardened at that time before work since it fitted in with the children.
Our road is fairly quiet but the milkman sometimes parks outside and rearranges his bottles very early which niggles me since we do not take his milk. I did have a quiet word with them about it and they now vary the position of there activities to spread the disturbance about.
Certainly the official night for noise ends 7am, so the nasty side of me is all for starting working very regularly bang on the hour. The nice side says go round the front instead, but the back is becoming a mess. While the rational one says trade off not complaining about the greenhouse for a lack of noise.
But you are right grannyjanny, I have enough problems already without someone creating more unnecessarily.
I'm with old bird on this one. Good job they don't live by me as I leave for work between 3.30 to 4.30am each morning. They sound like the sort of people that have to have something to complain about to keep them happy. One would have thought that before they bought the house that they should have taken into account the closeness of your garden. Smile sweetly and KEEP ON GARDENING. BIG HUGGS.
Regards Taurus
QuoteThey sound like the sort of people that have to have something to complain about to keep them happy
Funny you should say that. I worked at a place with everyone continually moaned. In the end I made a list of all the moans and set about solving as many of the issues as possible. When I had sorted about 75%. They started moaning that there was nothing to complain about any more.
Hi Digeroo,
I cannot really see what the problem is ??? It's not like you are banging nails in or digging with a mechanical rotivator .... Digging and watering plants are not noisy, in my book. These neighbours of yours seem to be obnoxious and obviously have a problem with someone who is enjoying their garden. I would carry on doing what you do now and ignore them. Wear a large hat so that you cannot even see their window.... Enjoy your gardening ! ;D ;D ;) 8)
Quote from: Digeroo on July 29, 2010, 21:34:02
I think I managed to hit the fence with the water from the hose pipe so it was a bit louder than normal.
Hitting a wooden fence with water from a hose pipe can make a lot of noise and this may be when it all started. Did you have the water on a jet setting? Having woken them then, they will now be listening to see if you are making a noise. Normal watering on a shower setting should not be noisy even if you did wet the fence with it.
If you are quiet I don't think it would matter what time you do your gardening but if you are strimming or mowing then best to wait until after 9am. Not everyone is an early bird! That reminds me ....I bet the thrushes wake them up hitting their snails on a stone. ;D
There is nothing more annoying than when we are away in our caravan and the warden gets on his mower and starts cutting the grass. It is always dead on 9am though and never before. Now that we are retired (OH semi-retired), we love to sleep in, especially when away. ;D
Quote from: Digeroo on July 29, 2010, 21:34:02.
.... but they are dictating what I can do in my garden because of their choice of room.
Digeroo, I would tell them firmly, and hopefully (in my case ;D) politely that the day they own your property, and pay all the outgoings, is the day they can tell you what you can and cannot do on your property. Until such time they can go tickle up their kilts.
Carry on doing your own thing. It's harmless, it's a danger to nobody, and it gives you pleasure. Don't let them spoil your enjoyment of your property.
valmarg
This sort of thing is just so pathetic, I can't complain about the bl**dy planes even though I don't fly for this reason among others so why should you be dictated to? If you can drive and make far more noise at anytime I doubt they have a leg to stand on...
About 6 months after we moved in one of the neighbours twigged that it was my car that occasionally left at 5.30 in the morning with a very noisy exhaust (silencer with the back ripped out) for a short time. Mostly I got a lift from OH but somethimes things didn't work out. I did apologise!
On the other hand one neighbour came round to ask about taking 3 foot off the 10 foot monster leylandii hedge only for OH to tell him we were taking it down completely over Easter weekend. The neighbours at the bottom commented that they hadn't realised just how much light it kept out of the conservatory. Although it might have ruined the neighbourhood a bit when the large shredder got fired up......
Get some legal advise just so you know exactly where you stand.
Didge, this is what you do... now listen to Grandma ;D
You ain't doing nothing wrong, so stop worrying about it, stop thinking about it and go and do what you always have done..
You will drive yourself nuts worrying about two bodies comfortably curled up in a cosy place.. I ask you. Do you truly think they would worry about yo
Now I know you are in bed as I write this, so when you wake and read it, go and water your blooming plants and stop it.You could turn yourself inside out and they would complain your bones creaked as you did it.
I promise you they will find something else to comlpain about given time.. like bees buzzing perhaps.
Nuff said.
XX Jeannine
Just tell them to SOD OFF i have never heard anything so daft telling you when you can and cannot do your garden who do they think they are, don't some people make ya blood boil, i bet they moan about the dawn chorus.
Quote from: lewic on July 30, 2010, 12:49:35
They sound absolutely horrible! No doubt they moved to the back room because they thought it was too noisy at the front, and they have probably fallen out with most of your other neighbours too. Pottering in the garden isnt a noisy activity - it isnt as if you are using a strimmer or chopping down trees. They are lucky they aren't living next door to a barking dog or first year students.
Some people unreasonably expect total silence, and get wound up at the slightest rustle, lying there gritting their teeth. It is their anger keeping them awake, not the actual noise. I wouldnt give them an inch, as they will only find something else to annoy them. Offer them some veg, smile sweetly and suggest earplugs or a move to the country.
Please don't send them to the country - we have enough townies moving here & complaining about the noise of the owls, foxes, chickens etc. if they want silence tell them to live on the moon