I went out to lunch today, and on the bill was added £1 per person by the restaurant to donate to the homeless of Southend.
I have to say I was a little miffed at someone else deciding to whom I should donate money and assuming I would be happy to do so. I do this myself every year to my chosen charities.
I didn't query it as it was a birthday celebration and it would have been rude to do so.
I'm told that most restaurants do this now, has anybody else come across this?
I feel a bit 'bah humbug' as I can spare the £1, but it would have been nice to be asked.
Blimey what a nerve,like you I believe in giving but that's not giving that's taking. :o
Totally agree with you Emaggie, up to you when and how much you donate to a charity of your own chosing.
We do a standing order each month to a hospice, I get peeved at them wasting "our" money contacting us for more with raffle tickets and Christmas cards.
Let us not forget, charities are businesses too with the top guys and gals paid top pounds.
They do lots of good work but don't overmilk the cows already in their parlours.
Ninny
Surely the point of Charity is that it is a choice? If not - it is just another tax or charge.
I'd be put out as well but if they asked I may have given £2!!
I too agree this is wrong. Here in Canada we are being asked at some checkouts in stores if we wish to donate to the Canadian Olympics and I refuse, we were asked in the post office too if we wished to donate to a children's charity and again we refused. The reason I give is simple.. I believe we are rather put on a spot in a lineup and I feel sorry for the folks who may not have that $1 spare and I feel it would be embarrassing for them, so a great many folks are making a stand here and refusing and saying why. Personally we tithe the usual 10% in church and then we have an annual budget for other givings and we sponsor a foreign child. When in the UK there was not a church of our faith so we used our church tithe in the community as well as the other one. I feel this is plenty and collecting money in businesses is all wrong, I don't mind a box on the counter which we can drop into from our allocated budget but no one should be put on a spot like this..
XX Jeannine
Similarly I forget the number of times I have been pressured to buy Raffle Tickets for a "good cause". I do not do Raffles as it is a form of gambling but I quite prepared to give to charity. A frequent compromise is to get the seller to put their details on the stub... I once had the seller come round with "my prize" and she could not understand why I would not take it... ::)
Wonder how much of that £1 actually got to charity.
Emaggie,I have never know a charitable donation to be added to a bill.
I donate to what I feel I want to and means something to me.
I sponsor a dog who has a permanent home at the dogs trust.Animal welfare is high on my list and you only have to walk round one of there dogs homes to see where the money is spent.
My son has made me very proud,he runs his own HGV recovery business and is very busy but he always find time to go out every week to go out with his church on a soup run.He sits with young people who are on the street and talks to them about what has happened to them and how they can move forward.
Hoping we can all open our minds and our hearts to people who need us ...............Happy Christmas.
Sorry but I would have refused to pay the £1 , but made a point of putting £2 in any charity box lurking on the counter, just to make my point that I wil give to those I choose.
Wouldn't bother me in the slightest... If I can afford to eat out for a meal, I can afford £1 for someone that hasn't even got a house... Good on them for risking annoying the odd customer for a good cause - after all, the business doesn't gain anything from this.
It wouldn't bother me, but it would depend on how it was added to the bill. If I knew before the meal and it was well advertised that that was a charity the restaurant supported then I would be happy to donate. If it was just added to the bill and I found out at the end of the meal when I got the bill I would probably refuse.
Our new Waitrose have a good scheme, I don't know if they do it across the country. They give each shopper a token, which can be put into a bin near the exit which is separated into three local charities. The shop then makes a donation to each charity depending on the proportion of tokens for each charity. The customer always pays in the end, but it is a nice way of doing it and it gives all the local charities a chance.
Asbean, the first I knew of it was when the bill was presented. No indication or mention from the waitress at all.
We also have the excellent Waitrose scheme here.
It's not the supporting of that particular charity I object to Ollie, I've given bedding, clothes, etc. in the past, it's the way it was done, my money taken without my permission.
I think that it's wrong and would be rather annoyed if it happened to me! Whether I give to charity is for me to chose, not to have it foisted on me.
In PR terms I don't think that it does the restaurant much good to do that, and it doesn't really help the charity either.
even ebay asks if you want to donate ::)
I would most definitely refuse to pay if the 'donation' was added stealthily, tagged to the end of the bill without prior notification; I'd also quietly advise the management of my feelings. I understand why many establishments don't want to have collection boxes on the premises, but it doesn't take much effort to make a sign or slot a leaflet into the menu explaining that they are collecting for charity. If they were transparent in their approach they'd probably get much more than a £1 donation per table.
Mind you, I'm the sort that boycotts restaurants that automatically add a service charge to the bill...
Blimey, season of goodwill to one & all!
If I was sitting back in my chair having had a hearty meal (costing what, £50 each inc drinks?), the afterglow of Brandy warming me for the imminent journey home, having just had a great celebration with others who could afford to do so, & saw that the proprietor had taken a quid extra off me to help someone who will be sleeping out in the cold tonight, I'd feel pretty good about it.
I find the thought that in a civilised society we can let people sleep on the street far more offensive than someone taking a quid without asking.
Where is this place? I'd like to write a letter thanking them.
Ollie
Did you not know that some people choose to live on the street. It is not the fact that we are a civilised society (though I often wonder if we are!) but it is circumstance and choices that puts people on the street, and I thank God that I am not one of them - but had I chosen different routes - I too could be one of them, we all could - but we were lucky.
I am not saying that it is a fun choice - but it very definitely is a choice either they choose to drink themselves into oblivion instead of paying for a roof over their heads, or they are, mentally unfit to accept normal lifestyles and some just choose to leave home for the "golden streets of London". There are a multitude of reasons why people are on the street. But I think that you are being santimonious about people choosing where their money can be used in the charitable giving type scenario. There are far worse things that happen in the world than living on the streets of England.
There are far poorer countries where to be on the streets, possibly aged only 10 or 11 and trying to survive, to find enough to eat, to keep clear of the bent coppers that round up the children and have them killed or dumped in a place where they will starve. People living on the streets of London Glasgow or whereever are fed by charities there are alternatives to living on the street - and - to be frank - what will a couple of quid donation per couple of diners get them? It certainly won't pay to get them homes.
I have sympathy with homeless people but would not be happy for someone to help themselves to my money without asking!
Ollie - there are certain practical ways you could help these people without giving them money - time - being one of them!
Old Bird
It was £1 per head and we were a party of 10. There were quite a few diners apart from us, and if they do this every breakfast, lunch and evening, apart from the people who just have coffee or tea (I'm assuming they get charged too, but I don't know for sure), the homeless of our area will do very nicely especially if other restaurants are doing the same as I have been told they are.
Ollie I wish I could have had a hearty meal, but couldn't afford the biggie, and I was driving so no booze either. ;D ::)
Maggie was it for a named charity or quote just for homeless people. I'm not sure that a legitimate charity would agree to such tactics and if it wasn't for one then the restaurant could find itself in trouble for a number of reasons.
Its not that people dont want to give but its down to each of us to whom we give and even if its 'only' £1 we have earnt that money and its our choice !!!
I am sure trading standards would like to hear about it !
And before you jump on me i give plenty to my chosen charitys and foster rescue dogs !
Legally they must display a charity number !
It would have been nice to asked first don't ya think. I wonder how many were to embarrassed or had a nice (pi$$ed in Nottingham) afterglow to refuse.
Personaly I would refuse the bill and ask for a new one without any donation to a `charity` Dont get me wrong I donate to certain charities of my choice
ie breast cancer ( because my wife died from it)
also I give tins of food to help those who find themsleves live rough
and various others. I deem it my choice and dont like the way some people try to dictate to whom and what I give my money
Don't know about the legal side of things, and don't feel inclined to go back to find out, but I will ask any of the others if they know about it. For all I know they may have just handed over their share of the bill without even being aware. I sat next to the person who was given the bill.
My point exactly Powerspade.
The scheme is run by a charity called STREETSMART, the scheme has been running throughout England, Scotland & a couple of towns in Wales for 4 years now. In Southend specifically the money raised goes to a charity called Homeless Action Resource Project.
It is supposed to be voluntary contributions & all participating restaurants are supposed to make it very clear what they are trying to raise money for then give diners the option of contributing or not either by putting details on a tablecard or making a clear reference to the scheme on the menu. It is supposed to be a £1 donation per table not per diner & people are supposed to be given the option of contributing more if they choose to do so when they pay the bill.
There is a newspaper article on it here:
http://www.southendstandard.co.uk/news/southend/4776025.Low_budget_nutrition/
The STREETSMART site is here:
http://www.streetsmart.org.uk
Southends Homeless Action Resource Project website is here:
http://www.harpsouthend.co.uk/
Given that the restaurant in question clearly broke the rules set by the charity namely by adding £1 per diner rather than per table & by adding the donation without making people fully aware of it then I would be inclined to contact the charity & let them know which restaurant is doing this as it reflects badly on the charity as well as the restaurant.
Surely when presented with the bill you can just say no. :-\
Does it really matter??
Trading standards...... ::) ::) ::)I doubt they are collecting without some sort of permission.
Worse things than being homeless??Sure ........would not like to try it for myself.
We all have our faves when it comes to charity but that does not mean others are not deserving.
Baccy Man many thanks for that!
Yes lets get em into big trouble...........I give up >:(
Quote from: betula on December 10, 2009, 17:55:54
Yes lets get em into big trouble...........I give up >:(
It has nothing to do with getting the restaurant in trouble it is about making sure the money raised is collected in a way that the charity is happy with, they can speak to the restaurant & clarify how they expect money to be collected.
If anyone uses underhanded methods to collect money for any charity it reflects very badly on that charity & people may choose not to support them in the future. Putting a bit of literature on display & asking people if they want to donate is not exactly hard & would draw more positive attention to the charity, most people would probably still contribute if they were aware they were doing so.
Well I don't know about other people but I check my restaurant bill.
If I disagree with something I query it.
It is probably a misunderstanding of how the charity wants things done.
I just gave a man in the street £2, he asked for a £1, for a meal. Then he said could I give £5 or £10. Meet him again on the way back from tennis and he was quite threatening, asked for a £1 and I said I had already given him £2. Went into a shop to get away from him and then saw him approaching everyone at the bus stop. Then my daughter came in and said she had been approached by him and was a bit worried. Didn't admit that I gave him money the first time. He had very red blood shot eyes, not sure if it was drink or mental problems. I would gladly give in a restaurant £1 a table, but they should ask you first and tell you the charity it is going to.
The worrying part about this is there was no notices about the charity ect, is the restaurant giving this money to the charity ????? There are many that use tips to pay the staffs wages and i would just be worried that the money collected is going to the people who need it ???
If the restaurant isn't playing by the Charity rules, how does anyone know if they send the £1 per head that they collect to the Charity ???
Having been homeless once myself and worked at the Big Issue for a while, I think it is very deserving cause, and I wouldnt mind paying a quid extra on a meal. Yes they should state it upfront though and not embarass people into paying up.
I sometimes give beggars money or food, but not ones who pester or work in gangs and shove their (or someone elses) baby in your face to get sympathy. These are far and few between though, most beggars are very timid and have just fallen on hard times, are addicts or have mental problems.
There by the grace of God etc..
I don't think anyone here is objecting to giving to the homeless just the way it was done by this restaurant.
As I said I think we should have the choice be it 10p or a £1 which Charity we give it to.
Thanks for the info Baccyman. I certainly wont be reporting anyone at all. I wouldn't dream of causing trouble over something like this as I don't think for one minute the restaurant is dishonest, but they certainly made no mention of it until the final bill.
Daughter said she was billed £2 extra for the same charity at a Jamie Oliver restaurant a while back, and as there were only two of them I assume that's £1 a head.
Thanks, Baccyman, I'd read about this scheme in Leeds but couldn't remember what it was called.
Having worked on a project helping homeless people, some of them choose to be on the street, but most don't.
I accept that some, probably most, of the homeless people do not choose to be homeless but they have made choices in their life that causes them to be homeless.
I do not have any problem with anyone collecting money for them but do when it is, like you have said, added it to a bill or whatever. A lot of people are not very brave and would have difficulty in saying - actually no I don't want to donate this money to homeless people. I know I certainly am not likely to be embarrassed or you Betula into saying something - but as you well know there are many that wouldn't dare say anything.
O B
Quote from: flowerofshona2007 on December 10, 2009, 18:54:49
The worrying part about this is there was no notices about the charity ect, is the restaurant giving this money to the charity ????? There are many that use tips to pay the staffs wages and i would just be worried that the money collected is going to the people who need it ???
Indeed. In fact restaurants should look after their staff first-the last place I worked had nearly £1000 in credit card tips ready to be shared out between the staff. Needless to say we never saw it. If you want to tip, do it discreetly in cash. ;D
I work for a large charity in Leeds and we certainly would not use the same tactics as the restaurant or knowing be involved as this would reflect badly.
I work in Leeds city centre and it can be quite a pain in the bum as you are constantly been harassed while walking down the street by people trying to get you sign up and donate.
I once came across quite an aggressive young man who kept blocking my path and tried to bully me into signing up. Just to add insult to injury the charity he was working for was to help battered women!
I have also stood and watch one of the Charity's for the blind hassle a pensioner to donate who obviously had a sight problem due to his white stick.
What is the world coming too?
Ah, I'm with you on Charity Muggers (or chuggers as they're known) - not least because of the amount of money that goes to the collectors instead of the cause. I also think they intimidate a lot of people & are a nuisance. Why do charities use them? Because they work.
WWF is just down the road from here & interestingly don't get chuggers to work on their behalf nearby (I have an allotment neighbour who works there & told me this). They do use them elsewhere in the UK though... So they know what a pain they are!
I first thought that copying out the relevant part(s) of Baccyman's post & going back quietly to speak to the manager of your restaurant asking if, perhaps, a laminated notice could be put on every table, along with the Menu, for the clients to choose, would suffice....BUT...now that I've read that this is also happening at a separate establishment (The J.O. one), I'd be writing to the Charity concerned, quoting their words back at them and asking them to see that participating establishements comply. :-\
It would probably be better to quote their exact words rather than the summary I made earlier.
Contact details for the charity can be found here:
http://www.streetsmart.org.uk/contact.php
Their info for customers of participating restaurants:
http://www.streetsmart.org.uk/how-it-works.php
Quotecustomers
The restaurants are the main channel for the StreetSmart campaign, but you, the customer are the real contributor.
At the end of your meal, a voluntary charge of £1 per table is added to the bill after service and VAT. Dinner for four would amount to each person contributing 25p. You of course, can choose not to participate, simply by telling the staff who can easily remove it from the bill.
It's a simple way to help the homeless in your local city get back to being a vital, contributing member of society.
This customer info is all printed in the tablecards that are supposed to be on display which are provided to the restaurant free of charge by streetsmart along with posters, leaflets etc... which are also supposed to be on display. The wording may vary in different parts of the UK as the proceeds may be going to local homelessness charities rather than streetsmart in which case this is made clear in the literature on display.
(http://www.streetsmart.org.uk/images/side-tablecard.jpg) (http://www.streetsmart.org.uk/images/press/press-logo-bronze.gif) (http://www.streetsmart.org.uk/images/press/assets/streetsmart_ident_hi_res.jpg)
Their info for participating restaurants:
http://www.streetsmart.org.uk/how-it-works-full-details.php
QuoteFull restaurant details
Customer awareness
A small, elegant table card is placed on each table during November and December. The card explains the StreetSmart idea, and states that during those months, a voluntary £1 will be added by the restaurant to the table's bill at the end of the meal. It also states that the customer may, of course, decline to participate.
Administration
The use of electronic tills makes the administration very straightforward. Most restaurants allocate a button on their till to StreetSmart during November and December. Staff add £1 (or more if the customer wishes) to the bill given to the customer. At the close of business each day, the end of day report gives the sum totals for food, alcohol, beverages, service, etc., and a separate sum for The amount taken for StreetSmart can then be subtracted from that day's sales.
At the end of each month, the accountant determines the balance of the restaurant takings versus total sales, and the surplus would be the sum of all the StreetSmart contributions made by customers. The restaurant then simply writes a cheque or makes a bank transfer at the end of each month to
Cost to the restaurant
Essentially, zero. StreetSmart provides all the table cards and any information to the restaurant in October, and the administrative burden is very small. The scheme is a very cost efficient way for restaurants to fulfil their social and community responsibility.
Restaurant staff and tips
As electronic tills make adding the £1 easy and straightforward, participation usually presents no problems for staff. And most staff enjoy being associated with an employer who has a social conscience.
Most restaurants find that participating in StreetSmart has no effect on the level of tipping. Our experience has shown that customers are happy to contribute to the scheme and don't make any adjustment to the level of tip they would normally leave for a meal.
Customer attitudes
Over ten years of experience has shown that less than 1% of customers decline to participate, and often request that more than £1 be added to the bill! During the lead-up to Christmas, most customers are very happy to "give a little something back" after enjoying a fabulous meal.
VAT effect
The £1 donation is added to the bill after the service charge and VAT, so it does not affect the restaurant's VAT returns.
Any restaurant is welcome to make a donation in addition to or in lieu of participating in the £1 campaign. Those donating will of course receive the same publicity and exposure as those in the regular campaign.