Just had a shocker, been to get a loaf of bread. It has gone up 10p overnight!!
£1.19 now for a normal loaf!!.
Is it just me or is anyone else noticing that food prices are getting a bit ridiculous?
Could be to do with the fuel prices... if it's costing more for the delivery of the goods then the stores may be reflecting that in the sale price ??? Just a thought
Shop owner said it was wheat prices! But its all getting a bit out of hand :(
10p rise on an item to cover the rise in fuel prices is a bit cheeky to say the least. How much was the last fuel rise? The fuel only has to be paid for once so why should we have to pay 10p for each item to cover the rise? A penny tops would have been fairer surely? No need for haulage firms to fleece the public like this.
twinkletoes
I've noticed the same thing spring. My food bill has probably gone up by between £7.50 - £10 per week. My petrol has gone up by £5 per week. Yet the amount of money I get in hasn't. Things are getting very tight in my house right now. Be glad when these veggies grow, save a few pennies at least.
Quote from: twinkletoes on April 30, 2008, 12:12:34
10p rise on an item to cover the rise in fuel prices is a bit cheeky to say the least. How much was the last fuel rise? The fuel only has to be paid for once so why should we have to pay 10p for each item to cover the rise? A penny tops would have been fairer surely? No need for haulage firms to fleece the public like this.
twinkletoes
when a lorry only does about 10-12 miles per gallon, you can see that fuel prices affect transport!
I think it is to do with the world price for wheat! I don't think that it is something we can control!!
I don't eat bread so I wouldn't notice!! I don't eat meat except probably once or twice a month, In fact I am aiming to be 90% self sufficient from this summer onwards! We'll see if that works out!
Obviously I need to pay for petrol and the basic stuff but foodwise I am aiming to be mostly self sufficient.
Old Bird
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2008/apr/23/supermarkets.fooddrinks?gusrc=rss&feed=networkfront (http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2008/apr/23/supermarkets.fooddrinks?gusrc=rss&feed=networkfront)
Looks like the price of wheat according to this.
Yes, food prices have gone up globally. It really isn't anyone trying to rip us off; we should think ourselves lucky, in developing countries it's becoming seriously difficult for poorer working people to feed their families. Higher oil prices have fed into this as it's more expensive to transport commodities which are traded and distributed globally. It's not the price of petrol at your local Shell that's made the bread prices go up. It's tough for those on fixed incomes, but for developing countries it can mean starvation as even aid shipments become more expensive and the money to spend on them stays the same.
On the other hand, even at peak commodity prices, the cost of the wheat in a loaf is only around 15p. At today's prices, it's more like 11p.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/7d44dc7a-1237-11dd-9b49-0000779fd2ac.html?nclick_check=1
So, even if we take the maximum wheat price, and recognise that it doubled before coming down again with a bump, the price of a loaf should only have been affected by 7p or 8p. Instead, bread prices nearly doubled in the UK as wheat prices doubled. A year or so ago, a cheap loaf cost around 65p IIRC. It's now £1.10 or thereabouts.
So what happened to the difference? 65p + wheat increase max 8p = 73p. Delta = 37p. Let's be generous and say that fuel prices have added another 4p.
Wages haven't gone up. The cost of capital hasn't increased massively. So that's another 33p profit for the millers, bakers, and retailers.
I call that profiteering, myself.
I sort of understand your argument, but I'm inclined to think that there are aspects of the price rises that we don't understand, because profiteering doesn't make sense. Supermarkets in particular attract us in by offering low prices on basics like bread and they wouldn't put the prices up unless they felt they had to. Haven't we all been moaning that standard food prices are too low, which is why people don't understand the value of food and eat battery chickens etc because they expect to pay next to nothing for their basics? Why would the same supermarkets suddenly start "profiteering"?
I guess it comes down to who you believe on this one - but given the amount of interest being paid to the supermarkets by the Office of Fair Trading in regards price fixing, right now I'm not inclined to believe the supermarket. And for once, my local corner shop is cheaper for the same loaf of bread than Tesco!
The OFT has already had to pay one lot of damages (to Morrisons) for false allegations and it's predicted they will be riding for another fall on this one if they actually name names instead of just referring to '100 companies'.
The OFT seem very publicity driven these days, making big announcements before actually doing any work - take their cue from the government and its 'initiatives' I suppose.
I suppose it will help the growing obesity problem. ;D
.....every cloud has a silver lining..... I love an optimist. :)
twinkletoes
the pricew of flour and milk have increased, so has the cost of energy to cook the bread. however, at the prices of shop-bought bread, why ain't you all baking your own? Breadmaking machines are a doddle to use, even this bloke can do it!!
Quote from: tonybloke on April 30, 2008, 19:25:26
the pricew of flour and milk have increased, so has the cost of energy to cook the bread. however, at the prices of shop-bought bread, why ain't you all baking your own? Breadmaking machines are a doddle to use, even this bloke can do it!!
Personally found its not cost effective for me.
Bread flour is expensive.
Yeast is expensive
and the electric to keep it running for 2 hours.
I used to use it all the time, but lately its become too expensive for me to do, unless anyone can tell me a cheaper alternative.
The price of Wheat in the UK was going through the roof last year, I wonder if it could be down to something called 'Set aside' that was introduced from Brussels before farmers started to build golf courses on their fields ;) ;)
Did you have a nice time in Stratford Mr Smith?
It's a world price issue, last year they had 50% crop failure in australia, total failure in parts of the U.S due to blizzards, and failure in Ukraine due to floods, (global warming is just media hype?)
rgds, tonybloke
Betula,
Thankyou for asking, yes we did my wife was 60 so we had Thursday --- Monday on the 'Riverside' caravan site with our caravan, but we came back to a lotty full of weeds which still have to be removed when this rain stops :)
On the news last night:
Wheat & grain cost $400 last year. This year it now costs $1100.
Sticking with the topic, due to the price of food, I wouldn't be surprised to see an increase in the theft of harvest produce from allotments this year :(
Yes Straford is lovely,tend to take it for granted living so close.
Hope to go and see Midsummers nights dream there this summer. :)
Quote from: springbokgirlie on April 30, 2008, 20:19:27
Quote from: tonybloke on April 30, 2008, 19:25:26
the pricew of flour and milk have increased, so has the cost of energy to cook the bread. however, at the prices of shop-bought bread, why ain't you all baking your own? Breadmaking machines are a doddle to use, even this bloke can do it!!
Personally found its not cost effective for me.
Bread flour is expensive.
Yeast is expensive
and the electric to keep it running for 2 hours.
I used to use it all the time, but lately its become too expensive for me to do, unless anyone can tell me a cheaper alternative.
Fresh yeast is most definitely not expensive. I buy a 750 gram block for 99p from the larger branches of Sainsburys.
valmarg
I get a large amount of dried from lakeland plastics and the flour from lidl..much cheaper than bigger supermarkets :)
This is why miniscule pay rises for the lower paid and public sector workers is complete mens bits. Higher paid workers are still getting inflation busting pay rises averaging about 8%. These same people have an inflation rate somewhere between 0-2% because goods we want and only get when we can afford them have no inflation or are deflationary. It is goods we need that have a high inflation rate and push the RPI (strangely enough, not the inflation rate the government use to decide payrises, to 4+%) In reality, the inflation you pay is higher the poorer you are. I have calculated my personal inflation rate using the government's own tool and my rate veers between 5-6%. People earning less than the average wage have inflation rates around 8-10% yet it is these people who are being squeezed to keep inflation and interest rates down. My pay rise amounts to half of what I am paying in inflation and I have a slightly above average income - although we do only have one income which probably puts us below average because my wife is a trainee nurse) At the moment, the poor are paying for the rich - it is like living in the US. >:(
an issue not mentioned is that due to high price of wheat, farmers switching crops from spuds to cereals, less problems, better profit per acre. a shortage of spuds a'coming??
The poor are paying for the rich - at the moment? When was it ever not so?
The balance was somewhat redressed for the first five years of this government which at that point was (very quietly) one of the most redistributive government in British history. It was just that Blair/Brown did not shout about it whilst they were cosying up to business. Since then, they have been one of the worst and have virtually undone all that good work. And rest assured, I am no Blairite. It was actually Brown who did the redistribution. It is only since he became Premier that he has completely changed his priorities.
I expect you're right, I just meant in general all throughout history since the year dot.
Now that fuel prices are expected to reach £1.50/ltr ...
Does replacing foodcrops with bio-diesel ones have much do to with the increase of world food prices ?
Living in the US would mean a dollar thirty cents a gallon not £1.30 a litre, the thing with the States is if you don't work you don't eat, unlike this great free handout of a country paying for the idle and the work- shy to do sod all ;)
Yes, the bio-diesel thing is part of the problem, but it's much wider than that - what we've got at the moment is a perfect storm.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/88effd62-1641-11dd-880a-0000779fd2ac.html (http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/88effd62-1641-11dd-880a-0000779fd2ac.html)
It is a crazy time for food shoppers. We used to manage a weeks worth of shopping for 5 people for about £36 pounds per week - which i think is a great price. Now we are looking at closer to £56 per week just over the past couple of months. I know that is still cheap compared to those that can do hundreds of pounds but when ours goes up by £100 per month it is very noticable - especially when mu wages has not gone up by £100 per month!
A big 'thank you' to Gordon for increasing OH's income tax bill by 100%.
We are pensioners on fixed incomes, but are expected to accommodate Gordon's tax hikes :'( :'( :'(
valmarg
Yes he is already regretting it.Such a stupid thing to do.I do so hate it when Labour does this kind of thing.
He can regret it until the cows come home betula, but we are not going to be compensated, we are just going to have our small income made even smaller. :'( :'(
valmarg
Yes it is so stupid,Jim was made redundant after twenty years in the job,because he is over fifty he has taken out his pension but it is only a small amount as things go
We are lucky I suppose as we have savings but in order to have some income and not hammer the savings which were supposed to be for later in life he has taken on a minimum wage job as to help keep the pot boiling.
No luck with permanent job,a lot of these firms won,t touch you over 50.
This new situation re tax makes it hardly worth bothering.
student grants haven't increased either! it's a good job we've got a lottie and produce a lot of our own food.
We're about ten years down the line from where you are betula. Tony was compulsorily made redundant after nearly 30 years service aged 56+, a matter of months before he would have been eligible for the company's early retirement scheme. He also had to draw his pension early, and it is less than I was earning 20 years ago.
We did have the benefit of Alton Towers for seasonal jobs, but last year they dropped the hourly rate, and employed eastern europeans instead of locals.
I wish you all the best. It is very difficult.
I don't mean to be a whinger, but it doesn't help balancing the books.
I can get 'down in the dumps' at times, but hey today the sun has been shining, I've been working in the greenhouse and its been a very good day.
We've got flowers on the tomato plants and strawberries. Broad beans are showing signs of flowers.
The only way is UP ;D ;D ;D
valmarg
Perhaps we need to start sharing economical recipes. I have a lovely one for Red Dragon Pie, made with adzuki beans. We all love it & it so cheap even with organic ingredients.
Janet.
Quote from: tonybloke on May 01, 2008, 15:56:02
student grants haven't increased either! it's a good job we've got a lottie and produce a lot of our own food.
That's one of the main reasons for me having my lottie - even though I get more than the average 18 year old student it still isn't enough to go round with 2 kids to feed and clothe as well. Mind you, of more help to me would be this government doing something about the useless and now defunct CSA and getting blood out of the stone whilst he's still breathing! lol ;D
Make no mistake, the recession we are about to enter is going to be very painful.
Too many people have failed to prepare, and over borrowed for cars and holidays etc that when the inevitable happens, they are going to come very unstuck.
All of it supported on rising house price funny money.
Like a lot have said the majority of plotholders have full larders, which has got to ease things a little.
Well said Posie, on the next lotty to me a young lady is doing exactly what you are doing growing stuff to feed her kids, :)
Quote from: posie on May 01, 2008, 19:52:00
Quote from: tonybloke on May 01, 2008, 15:56:02
student grants haven't increased either! it's a good job we've got a lottie and produce a lot of our own food.
That's one of the main reasons for me having my lottie - even though I get more than the average 18 year old student it still isn't enough to go round with 2 kids to feed and clothe as well. Mind you, of more help to me would be this government doing something about the useless and now defunct CSA and getting blood out of the stone whilst he's still breathing! lol ;D
Posie I am in the same boat. Studying and trying to feed and clothe two kids on nothing. Its another main reason why I am trying to be self sufficient too.
Quote from: springbokgirlie on April 30, 2008, 20:19:27
Quote from: tonybloke on April 30, 2008, 19:25:26
the pricew of flour and milk have increased, so has the cost of energy to cook the bread. however, at the prices of shop-bought bread, why ain't you all baking your own? Breadmaking machines are a doddle to use, even this bloke can do it!!
Personally found its not cost effective for me.
Bread flour is expensive.
Yeast is expensive
and the electric to keep it running for 2 hours.
I used to use it all the time, but lately its become too expensive for me to do, unless anyone can tell me a cheaper alternative.
I find my homemade bread is much cheaper than shop bought. I was paying £1.52 for a Warburton's loaf in February, prior to buying my breadmaker.
Tesco Strong White Bread Flour 1.5kg is 48p. Wholemeal is more expensive. Their Strong St/Grnd100% Wholemeal Bread Flour 1.5kg is 93p. A packet of either of these would make 2 or 3 loaves.
Tesco own brand Fast Action Dried Yeast 48g is 50p and works out at about 5p per loaf.
I am sure that the electricity used would not cost too much. It would use a minimal amount when proving although more in the baking stage.
Quote from: valmarg on May 01, 2008, 18:01:02
I don't mean to be a whinger, but it doesn't help balancing the books.
I can get 'down in the dumps' at times, but hey today the sun has been shining, I've been working in the greenhouse and its been a very good day.
We've got flowers on the tomato plants and strawberries. Broad beans are showing signs of flowers.
The only way is UP ;D ;D ;D
valmarg
Valmarg, I hope to make some extra cash by selling my surplus plants. The toms, aubs, cues, peppers etc are 60p, half the price of B&Q and my plants are two or three times as big. I won't have to pay tax on it either as my pension falls short of my tax allowance. Admittedly I have had to buy three x four tier staging units at a cost of just over £30, but then I will have them for future years. I have a notice pinned to a post at the bottom of my drive showing what I have for sale.
I notice that you have a greenhouse too, so have you thought of making extra cash out of it?
I bake my own bread it cost me £0.82 for a 2lb loaf, in the shops around here braces bread is £1.03 a loaf
I have baked my own bread but I have to say because I'm rubbish at slicing it, it doesn't tend to go very far and as we go through a loaf on average every two days, it was just wasn't cost effective really. Anyone got any tips on slicing because I much prefer my own bread??? lol
We use an electric carving knife and it slices a loaf beautifully. :D
we tend to make more cobs, flat bread and naans, also trying out pitta bread, not so many loaves as we eat too much ;D
paulines7, unfortunately we live in an area where it is bveryb unusual for people to 'grow their own'. I think one reason we were free from tomato blight last year was that there were so few people 'growing their own'.
We have no allotments in the area. I think we are quite strange, locally, insofar as we grow plants to eat. Other people in the locality seem to think that grass (aka lawn) is the best use for their land. :( :( :(
When it comes to selling excess produce, we are in a 'backwater'. The route to Alton Towers bypasses us (thankfully). I think we would be better trying to sell 'ornamentals' rather than edibles.
valmarg
Quote from: Paulines7 on May 02, 2008, 19:32:04
We use an electric carving knife and it slices a loaf beautifully. :D
Time to hit freecycle me thinks!
Quote from: valmarg on May 02, 2008, 20:52:27
......... I think we would be better trying to sell 'ornamentals' rather than edibles.
valmarg
Bedding plants might be your answer then. I live in a small village with only 65 houses but it is surprising how word gets around and people come back the next year. We have little through traffic and my A4 laminated list is stuck on the fence post so no-one could read it from a car anyway. I had a new customer who came for two tomato plants and ended up buying 4 toms, plus 2 cucumbers and 2 aubs.
I think given the price of food in the shops, you may find a few people who can be persuaded to try growing their own veg once you have lured them into your garden to buy bedding plants.
I think a postcard in the local shop window might be a good idea ;D
Thank you for all your suggestions. I really do appreciate your help.
valmarg
Do you really think it is cost effective to grow your own stuff?
I love doing so and don't mind spending a bit of money because I get a kick out of making something for myself but if you factor in the cost of all the tools,shed, greenhouse, weedkiller, rent, sundries, compost, seeds, failures etc etc etc..........
I really can't justify it on a financial basis.
I know you will say Freecycle, second hand, compost heap but if you factor in the time, inevitable transport cost and sheer bloody hard work It would be far easier to do a shift or two on the till in your local asda and buy your fruit and veg from there and get your staff discount as well.
I wouldn't want to do that myself but I won't and can't tell you that it is cheaper for me to grow my own.
I think when you first get an allotment you can spend a lot of money.
As time goes on the expense goes down.If you are like me I think oh I can't manage without this that or the other
However I do know plotholders who turn up with a fork and spade and a few seeds and that's it.
I have spent too much this year making raised beds but I think the money I spent is a good investment.
To me it is a hobby and lots of people spend a lot on their hobbies.
In fact it is more than a hobby it has become a way of life.
Do not get me wrong I always have my eye on the skips and things just hanging around,In fact I spoke to some guys demolashing a house close to me and going back for stuff next week.At one time I would not have had the confidence to ask.
Quote from: Gazfoz on May 08, 2008, 17:20:44
Do you really think it is cost effective to grow your own stuff?
Yes
Quote from: Gazfoz on May 08, 2008, 17:20:44
....... if you factor in the cost of all the tools,shed, greenhouse, weedkiller, rent, sundries, compost, seeds, failures etc etc etc..........
I really can't justify it on a financial basis.
I know you will say Freecycle, second hand, compost heap but if you factor in the time, inevitable transport cost and sheer bloody hard work It would be far easier to do a shift or two on the till in your local asda and buy your fruit and veg from there and get your staff discount as well.
In the last few years the only money I have spent is 2 new chains for my chainsaw @ £15 each (petrol oil etc.. for them is factored into the cost of the work I have been using them for) £170 on a new shredder (paid for itself 10 times over through work tree felling & clearing scrub for people) a few pairs of gloves at £1 per pair, plant pots @ £24.65 per 6000, £160 on timber, about £15 on replacement spade/fork/pick handles & a few pence on rivets for them & £18.99 on a new electric propogator, I don't have the figures on plants & seeds to hand but probably a couple of hundred pounds a year.
I don't pay for compost as I make my own, I don't pay for manure, I don't drive & have a free disabled pass for the bus so transport cost is zero, I don't use weedkillers fertilisers etc... as I don't find them necessary.
As far as hard work & time goes 8 years ago when i moved to this area I had a 300 square foot area that had a mixture of clay & slate which I referred to as soil & the only thing growing there was japanese knotweed & brambles. Getting that into a workable condition was hard work & very time consuming.
Since that time I have taken on several acres of land part of which is for my own use part is used to provide produce for the landowner to use & the rest for produce for the landowner to sell at a farmers market with the profits split between us.
Although that sounds like it should be harder work it is actually less time consuming as there is constantly something growing & I use a lot of mulches there is little if any weeding to do. Digging is fast because I am constantly adding organic matter to increase the humus content of the soil therefore making it more easily workable. I am able to manage this land singlehanded & work from home building/repairing computers & other electrical repairs I do a lot of tree felling, garden clearance & general garden maintenance in my spare time & recently I have started servicing petrol tools chainsaws, mowers, brushcutters etc... I help less physically able plotholders with the heavy work (digging, shovelling manure, shifting railway sleepers to make raised beds etc...) & I am currently helping one of my neighbours renovate their house. Then every few months I am involved in volountry work clearing hillsides of knotweed, rhodedendrons or bracken & maintenance on local waterways.
So far this year I have raised £5765.50 purely from plant sales then there is sale of produce & other gardening work on top of that. What I make significantly exceeds what I spend, to a large extent I am self sufficient & I still have plenty of time to waste surfing the internet participating in several forums & moderating one of them.
I would say on the whole growing veg is pretty cost effective for me and once you get into a routine it does not have to be hard work to get a good return on the time & effort you put into growing things.
Wow,you certainly have it all in hand Baccy Man ;D
And is all that cheaper than the supermarket ????
Price doesn't come into the equation.
Taste, freshness. No pesticides. Whilst not being able to be accredited 'organic', we do know that what we have produced is pest free. What we grow is honest, decent food.
Come the Summer I wouldn't give you a thankyou for supermarket climbing french/runner/broad beans/peas. Home grown are lovely, tender crops.
I'm sure there are others on this site that would agree with me.
valmarg
Chwarae teg Baccyman but I gotta say for someone with a free bus pass you get a fair bit done ;D
Quote from: Gazfoz on May 10, 2008, 21:51:43
And is all that cheaper than the supermarket ????
Yes.
The biggest expense I have is seeds & the bulk of those are bought for produce which will be sold at the farmers market so they go down as a business expense & don't really count. My own plants & seeds are paid for out of what I make on plant sales & as I only sell tobacco & strawberry plants both of which are grown from saved seeds in compost I have made & planted in pots which cost less than a penny each in effect they cost me nothing to produce. Even if I wasn't selling plants the costs of my own produce would be minimal. I only started selling tobacco plants because it seemed wasteful discarding millions of seed each year & the strawberries followed because there was a demand for them most of the money those plants generate is spent on clothes, make-up & whatever else my wife decides she needs I don't get to see much of it & don't need it for the small amount I spend on plants, seeds, tools etc...
It is not the cost that interests me though I prefer to grow more interesting varieties of fruit & veg that actually have some flavour unlike most of the stuff you find in the supermarket. I also use a large area to grow hops, grapes, cider apples, perry pears & 6 varieties of elderberries for homebrew and another large area for my tobacco.
Fruit & veg cost me next to nothing to produce. Tobacco costs me £0.02 per ounce as opposed to £5+ an ounce in the shops. Alcohol is obviously the most expensive thing to produce as there are things which I have to buy in (sugar, yeast, steriliser etc...) & depending on what I make it may be cheaper to buy certain drinks but again with alcoholic drinks I am more interested in quality rather than cost.
Before you ask "what about the time spent growing things?" I can't put a price on my time because I enjoy doing it. Yes I could pack it all in & work 9-5 doing a job I don't like & buy a load of flavourless food from a supermarket but personally I would rather spend my time doing something I enjoy & produce food that is worth eating in the process.
I buy cooking bacon (great for sandwiches) every week from the foremost leading supermarket and it has gone up from 70p to 1.18, thats a 48p rise IN ONE WEEK!!!
This is way above any inflation or price of grain to feed the pigs.
And bear in mind this is a supermarket that has made a 2.8 BILLION pounds profit last year, greedy b***ers!!!!
I always say,"For poor people we do eat very well" ;D
If it wasn`t for the allotments I simply wouldn`t eat much fresh fruit at all and I`d stick to basic veg. With the plots I`m able to eat fresh fruit in season or from the freezer, and fresh veg of all kinds in season or from my own stores. I make my own jams, chutneys and pickles which I eat every day. The fruit in particular is a high value crop. I worked out that last year I grew £250 worth of redcurrants from two "stick in a bag" bushes from poundland. My fruit cage must supply me with £1000 worth of soft fruit every year and thats set to increase. My strawberry patch is looking to be at its best ever. I used to consider strawberries as a luxery food. I am about 90% self-sufficient for food and I buy mostly dairy, vegetarian protein foods, and things like sugar, vinigar, and flour...and chocolate ;D
One project for this year is to grow beans for drying in huge quantities.
I`m also working on secure, hidden and underground storage for food as well as tools. Root veg store very well the old fashioned way.
I live and eat better because of the allotments. ;D
Col
I boycott supermarkets completely.
I have found it cheaper and more waste effective to buy from local butcher for meat, and veg from market (as none available that I have grown yet).
Only thing that does come from supermarkets is nappies, wipes, washing powder and conditioner...and my best mate gets those when she goes shopping on a Saturday for me :)