Dear All
I found out about this site yesterday - absolutely fab, havem't been off it since! :)
I got my first lottie a year ago, but have really only started to take it seriously since the autumn. It's about 50% covered in couch grass and I'm getting a bit disheartened digging and digging.....
I know it's got to be done, but any success stories of getting through it would be welcomed!
Thanks!!!
Hels Bels
Hiya H_B and welcome! Couch grass, the bain of every lottiers life, but it can be beaten. Little and often is the way to go. Concentrate on one patch, get it clean and then you can plant and whilst you are working on the next patch, you can admire your emerging fruit or veg. We did something a bit daft on our old family plot, but something I know others do and it works okay for them, but we kept grass paths, but it was couch grass, and all it did was spread back into the cleared beds. Nightmare! Got rid of the paths, stopped the problem! Hoorah!! You will do it, and you will look back this time next year and smile. aaaaahhhhhhhhhhhh ;D
I too have couch grass! Hate the stuff!! But do as EJ says and clear it bit by bit! It seems to be one of those things in my experience that is impossible to eradicate totally, but easy to pull up the odd one or too when you have managed to get it under control :-) Keep up the good work, you'll get there in the end!
I`m afraid that although I normally grow completely organically, where couch grass is concerned I`m prepared to break the rules just for once. By all means get a small portion cleared by hand (although you won`t get it all in one go) to enable you to start growing your early planted stuff, but as to the remainder I would leave it for another few weeks until it is growing and then spray it all with Roundup - full strength, mixed with a few spots of Fairy Liquid to help it stick on the blades. After a few more weeks it will all be dead and you can dig the ground safely.
I had a badly infested patch, and I did this just once - it has never come back.
Fear not, HB - just look upon couch as a fact of lottie life! On my plot I find it creeps in from the main grass paths, so I'll never get rid of it, but if you can bear the hard work, taking out what you can it does eventually get manageable. >:(
On the positive side, if you dig it up and dry it in the sun, couch makes a brilliant kindling for the bonfire - and it makes a satisfying crackling noise as it burns! ;D
Remember - tackle small bits of your plot at a time and cover it or grow something as soon as you've cleared a patch!
AC :D
hiya, dont get down hearted . had me lottie for a month now. The guys on this site know thier stuff. i,m halfway now but now have the cooch to deal with . i,ve skimmed the surface but now got to deal with white roots.your not alone goodluck.Angie
Welcome, Hels_Bels, to the wonderful world of couch grass!
It is truly a pig to get under control, but it can be done. Trick is to get the soil as clean as you can of the roots once - as Emma Jane says, bed by bed, a bit at a time - and then stay on top of it (which is MUCH easier).
Second/third year on a cleared bed, all I ahve to do is edge the couch grass path and clean out the stuff that's tried to spread over the winter - a great way to uncover clumps of slug eggs for the birds to get, and get a good start to this year's compost heap as well.
(http://www.keirg.freeserve.co.uk/diary/photos/04_feb/0.jpg)
Looks odd - the old guys think I'm mad; better still, they think it's real hard work, and are VERY impressed. But those three 20 yard tumuli you can see were only about three hours work. Bed edged, soil thrown on top of the green manure, and couch grass clumps and roots removed ----- minimal problems all year.
Good luck - Gavin
Don't worry! You can start a new sideline with all the couch grass you dig up - Voodoo Love Potions!!!
Recipe: Voudou Fried Eggplant (To Attract a New Love)
1 Eggplant
1 Egg - Beaten
1 Teaspoon Cinnamon
Bottle of Peanut Oil
1 Cup Flour with 1/2 Cup Finely Chopped Pecans
Salt & Pepper to Taste
Bread Crumbs with Cooked Oats
Teaspoon Garlic Powder
1/2 Teaspoon Powdered Couch Grass
Peel and cut Eggplant in 1-inch strips. Powder them in flour mixed with garlic powder and couch grass. Pass them through egg and then shake the strips in breadcrumbs, oats and chopped pecans. Deep fry in Peanut Oil at 375 degrees, turning often until golden brown. Salt and pepper to taste. Dine by the light of 2 pink candles.
Ten x
I am still digging out the beds on my allotment now. I've had it since the turn of the year. The entire plot is cooch grass infested. I am gradually hand weeding the entire plot, leaving sore fingers but reasonably cleansed patches. I am keeping the grass walkways if only to stop me sliding all over on the slippy clay. I was hoping that by keeping the grass trimmed short it would eventually phase out the cooch grass leaving proper grass. Well that is the aad wives tail. Ohh yes and 2m square takes about a day. :)
I'm pretty sure I read somewhere recently that they sell couch grass roots in Italy as a vegetable/salad ingrediant. Could make a few bob on the side!
I have worked like E.J suggested, digging 4ft x 12ft beds slowly, planting as I have gone along. This ensures at least some return for your effort. I covered the areas not being digged with black plastic to try and curtail its growth, but don't be fooled its brutal stuff and not put off by lack of light, but it did help a bit. Finally got to the end this autumn, what a relief!! Its taken 18 months but worth it to see the beds ready now for a full planting, can't wait. Janet H.
Hi everyone
Wow - thanks for all your thoughts!! It's great to know it WILL go. :) I've planted some autumn and summer raspberries in one cleared area, with enough space in between to put a couple of rows of potatoes.
Will make sure I've got my beans' and peas' strip cleared next - my fave veggies so definitely an area to do properly.
I did manage to clear one area last year and then covered it over winter. That bit's got hardly anything coming through right now, so am very glad I did that!
If it gets just a little bit warmer I should be able to spend a good long time there at the weekend, rather than the paltry hour I've managed today! ;D
The veggie part of my lottie is as good as couchgrass free. I have stomped down earth paths that occationally need hoeing. If I see a couchgrass leaf, I will dig and dig on my knees till I have the whole root out. However, the flower part is invested and the problem is the permanent plants and bushes. The couchgrass is all inbetween the roots of these and I see no way to get rid of it.
Every time I get to the lottie, I play couchgrass police. With a black and a red bucket I walk the whole area, plucking and digging couchgrass wherever I see it. Regular weeds go in the black bucket for the compost and couch goes in the red one to be taken home and disposed of. I believed that if I deprive the couch by not allowing it to have leaves, the roots I can't reach must starve but it doesn't seem to work that way. I still feel that I keep it managable this way but it's ongoing.
Don't know why it helped but it did, i had a badly infested plot with couch grass and dug madly to start with, and then planted with potatoes as my first crop and the area hasnt been too bad since. Maybe couch doesnt like spuds ????
Good luck with your new plot and may you have lots & lots of yummy crops.
Piglet. :)
That's helpful Piglet, as yesterday I cleared an infested bit at the top of my plot for my pots - luckily the couch only seems to have invaded the top 6 ft of my plot. I noticed that most of the roots seemed to be in the first spade's depth, which would make sense as couch grass tends to go along and up rather than way down like docks. I've left a spade's depth 'trench' all around the bed to see if this deters the couch grass. If this works a physical barrier to that depth, slates on their edge for example, may be one answer?
The trench idea sounds like a good plan, and worth considering as I am in the process of clearing an bit of a wild area at the top of my plot, which is heavy in couch grass - what a slog it is clearing it, such slow going.
Anyhow last year we did grow our potatoes on another area thick with the darn stuff, and it seems to have worked a treat, as that area seems so clean of it now. busy_lizzie
Yup - the trench idea works! That's where I get the funny looking beds in the piccie above; trenching around and piling the stuff on top of the bed.
Controls the couch grass - and slugs! What more could you want? Apart from a bit of spring sunshine without an arctic blast!
All best - Gavin
Hi All
Cleared a bit more at the weekend - whohoo! ;D I'm trying the trench too now. Have rough dug whatever I can get, piled it in front of me to wilt for a few days. I wasn't quite sure about this idea, hence my original question, because I thought the roots would grow back, but they haven't! Probably because we haven't had a lot of rain in West London, but I've gone along a few days later with a big claw and pulled up all the loose roots, then dug into the piles to get the rest. At the moment it seems to be working - nothing's growing back any more or less than using the more 'traditional' way. Would definitely recommend it now I've tried it - it's not so hard on your back either!
Will take some photos to track progress - then if I cn work out how to post them..... :)
H_B
Build a compost heap with the turves and the roots? I know - you're not supposed to; but it worked for me - and a lovely crop of compost for the next season!
Gavin
I have taken over an allotment plot at the end of last October 2003. Its was covered in couch grass. I was going to dig the plot over, but it was a massive task so I had the council come in and rotivate the plot. I then divided the area into bed around 10' X 4'. Initially I forked over these beds and hand removed any debris, glass, wood, couch grass etc. Not too suprisingly the couch grass re-appeared! My next plan of attack was to hand weed all this plots. After doing this and clearing a load more of the couch out. I then resorted to hoeing the plots. Taking the tops of the couch grass and any other weeds off. I now seem to be at the point were I have resonably clear plots. So from my experience I think you just have to be persistent!!! I find it quite satisfying to spend a couple of hours hoeing over the plots. You feel as if you are making progess if everytime you go you have cleared some of the stuff out!
So couch grass?
What does it look like exactly, we have a covering all over our lottie which to me looks like grass, how can i tell if it is the dreaded couch grass?
I was going to double dig it all and hope nothing came back up...but if something did just keep on top of it....would this not be a good idea?
Please help before I start digging.
Les
Confused Couch Grass Hater.
When you dig, all the different clumps of grass are connected with evil white/creamy yellow roots, which grow along a bit, and then up into grass shoots, and then along a bit more, and more, and more. When you pull them they break quite easily, and the bits left in the soil just grow some more, and more!
The roots are also quite fibrous, even a bit hairy looking.
But it's very satisfying to give a gentle tug and out they come from the clump of earth on your spade :-)
Ten x
Isn't it good too, when you see a little bit poking out of the top, turn it over with the fork and find a lump the size of a football!!!
We're really lucky and have a huge communal compost heap at he plot so everyone puts their couch grass on that.
In answer to the question about what is and isn't grass, I've decided to pull it all up - after all, even if it's 'benign' I'd rather use the space for grwoing veggies! ;)
tenuse, i agree.
honestly, it could be brambles (which i got my sweetheart do do as they were brutal). I love rootling down at soil level and hoiking couch roots out. They will all go eventually but i spend about 20 times longer handweeding than digging (well, forking at any rate). I sorta hoik a great heap of stuff on my fork and chuck it about a bit, shaking fork around so the earth kinda crumbles (mine does, iknow thew heavy clay lot have it a bit tougher). Then i get down on my kneeling mat (what a mardy!) and rustle about, poking and pulling. Course, I can usually onlymanage about 3squ.metres every session but, in truth, I am overwhelmed by the huge space anyway and it is good to focus on very tenable amounts( like a metre or so).
Good luck, remember, it might be ground elder or bindweed or that sodding speedwell sorta stuff with big hairy leaves and HUGE taproots.
suzy
Little bit of advice remembered from a student job years ago - if it's got white roots, it's a nasty and pull it out! Covers the thsitles, bindweed, coltsfoot and couch grass I could have problems with.
Hels_Bels - what happens with your communal compost heap? Do people use the compost, or is it just an evergrowing heap of decaying vegetation?
If it is used for compost, how careful are people NOT to throw on potatoes and potato haulms, or brassica roots? I'd never, ever use the huge heap at the end of our allotment site for compost - but then few of the other plotholders want to use compost; they chuck anything and everything - including loads of club-rooted brassica and diseased potato stuff!
If you do want to use home-made compost, you might think about starting your own heap/s; free nutrition, free conditioner ----- and as much as anything, you aren't throwing away your valuable top-soil.
My beds are considerably higher than path level - cos almost everything (except pots and brassica roots) goes back in, via the compost heap. Some of my neighbours' plots are anything up to 4 inches BELOW path level, cos they're throwing away so much soil, and not getting anything back.
Just a thought!
All best - Gavin
Should you not throw brassica remains on a compost heap then? Even leaves, or is it just roots?
Ten x
Sorry, Tenuse - my ambiguity! Brassica leaves, heads and stalks (I chop 'em up roughly first) DO go on my compost heap --- but NOT the roots.
:-[ :) :)
All best - Gavin
My plot abuts the communial compost heap on our site, it just gets bigger and bigger as the years go by! Judging by all the old rubbish people throw on there, I wouldn't touch it with a barge pole to put on my plot!Couch, brassicas, dandelions the size of carrots! We even get plastic being thrown on..drives me crazy! So I have my own compost heap, and have to put up with everyone elses weeds creeping towards me! (oh and by the way, whilst clearing my "new" bit today, found a safe someone had dumped :o.........empty unfortunately!)
a safe? pop a bit of glass on top - hey, a free cold frame!
Hmmmmmm good thinking Ceri!!
I'm posting this to, hopefully, provide some encouragement, not be a botanical pedant. The white parts of couch grass are not roots but modified underground stems (rhizomes). The actual roots of couch grass are the fibrous brown threads emanating from the rhizomes at each node.
Like all stems they tend to grow very close to, or above, the soil surface. Practically, this means that you don't have to dig very deep to get rid of the rhizomes. The problems everyone experiences come from the thick mat that the rhizomes form- news to no-one I'm sure! Because they are underground stems they dessicate very rapidly when exposed to sun or wind. This is a very good way of preventing them re-growing if they are to be added to the compost heap. Because rhizomes grow very close to the surface another way of eradicating them is deep burying them as they do not have the food reserves in the true roots to grow out. However this method requires thorough burying- just a little exposed rhizome will allow the plant to grow out.
Another property of couch grass is that it cannot stand repeated close cropping. On a large area sheep have been, and still are, used to eradicate it. On a small scale repeated close mowing or strimming of "lawns" will eventually kill it, as will hoeing in beds.
While Gavin is reporting success with a trench the only time I tried it I found the rhizomes simply started following the soil surface around the trench walls. Attempts to dig these rhizomes out ended up destroying the trench.
hey gavin,
i also subscribe to the white roots theory but i tend to phrase it a bit more rudely - if it's white, it's sh*t*
cheers, suzy
Hi All
In answer to the communal compost heap question, I have only ever seen couch grass on it, although there may be nasties hidden I must admit. When I asked my club secretary if it was OK for the weeds, he said it would be fine because it would probably be left to rot for about 7 years anyway - but I have a feeling that isn't enough time to get rid of clubroot? :-/
As sson as I clear more of the dratted grass I will get myself a bin to put all my own stuff into, but I must admit I will probably use the biggie for the couch - it will get VERY hot and hopefully break it all down. By the time it's ready I may well have moved on anyway.
I know that's not completely community spirited of me, but I'm trying to be 'right' about what I put in it! ;)
I have twtch...is that the same stuff? I dig up a couple of spade fulls and then pick out all the roots....sigh....there is no other way.....glad my plot is small.... :)
I have been digging out new beds this last week, and have put couch/bindweed/marestail into a black dustbin.
My hope is that they will rot down if I cover the bin and leave it for a year.
So, will they rot down?
Or should I simply burn the whole lot?
We have just dug out a couple of unproductive pear trees. The couch grass roots went down below the pear roots and into the pure sand which is our sub soil, a good 2 feet down. What chance do you stand of weeding that out. If you completely exclude light for long enough, yes it will rot down. Just be glad the seeds are over 90% non-viable!
Are you sure those were couch roots? Mine have always been quite shallow-rooted, except where I managed to dig them in deep when I first dug the plot, and even there they didn't last very long at depth. Have you got any horsetail mixed up with it?
What do horsetail roots look like?
Don't burn or compost couch grass (twitch/witch grass/quack grass), take the rhizomes and steep them in water, they will rot in the water and this water can then be used as a liquid feed for your plants.
The turf I pile onto a sheet of weed control fabric, upside down, I then lift and tie them, like when you tie the cornors of a hanky to make a makeshift head covering; then I pile some more turves on top and cover with more weed control fabric, which is tucked under the lower piece and secured with gaffer tape. What you should now have is a large piece of ravioli, I then poke holes through this ravioli and plant strawberries through it, they love it. Every so often the couch makes a bid for freedom through the strawberry holes, but it is easily removed before reaching the four leaf stage. As your strawberries grow enlarge the holes, and cut new ones for runners.
If you construct your ravioli on a large sturdy pallet, then you have a massive moveable strawberry mound. It does look a bit like you are growing strawberries through a body bag though.
No mares tail ,no bindweed of either persuasion and seen enough couch grass to recognise it.
We have been composting couch (and other nasties) for more years than I care to think about. Here we have a 'non-compost heap on to which goes every thing you are not supposed to put on the real compost heap. I have just used the last one (5 years old and beautiful) as a top dressing on the part of the garden we jokingly call the New
Forest. The next pile is already 6 by 6 by 4 feet.It will be ready for use on my retirement.
Somebody before you has probably dug the couch roots in then while trying to cultivate; it's easily done when there's a mass of them.
Just finished digging that bit, say a metre wide by about 4? Taken out a green wheelie bin full of just couch roots, and that from a border which has been weeded both by hand and chemically for the last 8 years. It grows in from the 'lawn' along side, under the lawn edging which is about 9 inches deep. One of these days I will concrete over the whole place and grow everything in big pots stood on it.
I bet you it would get through the concrete!! ;)
Quote from: caz and baz on October 15, 2005, 19:01:57
I bet you it would get through the concrete!! ;)
Or the dreaded knotweed would spring up from somewhere.
I hate the flipping stuff! It has even kept me awake at night! I have a huge pile of it contained by 4 pallets, covered up to exclude light - and have just bagged up 12 rubble sacks of it and put that on top of it!!! Now I intend to forget it for a couple of years whilst it slowly decays!
I will win the battle! I will win the battle! (if I say that often enough it might work)
I am going to grow spuds to help keep it at bay in the cleared beds and am going to grow squashes/corn/courgettes throught card and muck mulches on the bits I haven't had time to clear quite so well (mainly because my back hurts and I am sick of digging and have nowhere else to put all the d**n roots!).
So the question is - who's gonna give up first ? me or the couch?
My money is on the couch losing ........
Louise