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Produce => Non Edible Plants => Topic started by: triffid on May 10, 2007, 09:12:27

Title: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: triffid on May 10, 2007, 09:12:27
This is one I've had for 14 years but the label was lost a house-move ago.
It's a montana type, in full flower now; a green-white blossom, and is unusual for a clematis, in that it has a really sweet scent.

Help with ID would be terrific.  :)

(http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p103/triffidspix/a90b1bcf.jpg)
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: Grandma on May 10, 2007, 12:36:49
Don't know, Triff, sorry - but I have a pink one, very similar, Montana (something) 'Elizabeth' and that has a wonderful, strong perfume, too - very like a carnation, sweet and clove-y. Maybe yours and mine are related?  ;)
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: Grandma on May 10, 2007, 12:54:07
Just checked, Triff and mine's called C Montana 'Elizabeth' - nothing posh! Seems to have broader petals than yours?  ???
(http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/8752/clemelizabethcl9.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
Bit past it's best now but has been lovely  :)
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: triffid on May 10, 2007, 14:18:09
My clematis isn't a posh 'un either, Grandma.  ;D  (Pretty pic, by the way!)

In the back of my mind, I think I remember it being something like montana 'Alba'... which would make sense, as it's a white montana.  ::) But I could be confusing it with my potato vine, which is solanum jasminoides 'Album'. I'm easily baffled, me!
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: Palustris on May 10, 2007, 15:07:11
It  looks like C. montana wilsoni, which is the standard whitish Montana. All the other whtish montanas are either much fuller flowers or have appeared in the last few years.
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: triffid on May 10, 2007, 15:13:47
Thanks, Palustris! :)  So presumably C. m. wilsoni is scented, then? Cause that's the thing that everyone who walks past this one asks about... 
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: Grandma on May 10, 2007, 15:46:17
Hello again Triff! I hope I'm not going to confuse the issue even further but I'm pretty sure yours is not C. Montana 'Wilsonii' which has large, white flowers - in July and August!!!

But I don't think it's C. Montana Alba either!

(http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/314/whiteclematiscl9.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
This is my C. Montana Alba today - it has a larger flower than yours; is pure white - (not greenish-white) - and has absolutely no perfume at all.  ???

Have you got something a bit special?
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: Obelixx on May 10, 2007, 15:57:16
There's a website with a search facility that lets you key in info to find clems.   I put in white tepals, yellow anthers, montana group and scented and it came up with these 4:-

http://www.clematis.hull.ac.uk/new-clemdetail.cfm?dbkey=3147
http://www.clematis.hull.ac.uk/new-clemdetail.cfm?dbkey=3111
http://www.clematis.hull.ac.uk/new-clemdetail.cfm?dbkey=2932
http://www.clematis.hull.ac.uk/new-clemdetail.cfm?dbkey=3330

As you have the original, you could compare more easily and refine the search further if you think none is the correct one.

Have fun.
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: bombus on May 10, 2007, 16:59:00
Hi Triffid, could it be Montana Grandiflora, it looks like it to me, and its been around for years.
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: Palustris on May 10, 2007, 17:33:40
According to my research C. montana wilsoni flowers just a little later than straight montana and is sweetly scented.
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: Grandma on May 10, 2007, 20:07:36
Isn't this a teaser?  :-\ I so want to agree with Palustris! C montana Elizabeth and Wilsonii are said to be the most strongly scented. The Wilsonii flowers (with their narrower petals) look just like yours, Triff - but it is supposed to be a 'late' variety! Maybe this year, with such a warm, sunny April it thinks its high summer already!
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: Palustris on May 10, 2007, 20:22:40
So let us muddy the pool again. These are our collection of C. montana. I know the names of some of them, but not all. Taken today.
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: Palustris on May 10, 2007, 20:26:25
and more
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: Palustris on May 10, 2007, 20:29:25
and finally!
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: triffid on May 10, 2007, 21:01:17
Thank you everyone for helping with the puzzle: and Palustris, what a wonderful clematis collection you have!
The closest to mine seems to be 006; it's got those turned-under tepal sides that mine has.

It hasn't been possible to see between the raindrops this evening but I'll get out and measure the flowers tomorrow. They're not big -- at a guess, about 2.5 inches across -- so that eliminates some of the larger flowered montanas.
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: Palustris on May 10, 2007, 21:07:36
I think that one is straight forward C. montana, did not sniff the flowers though. Some clones of it are less scented than others though.
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: janet h 1948 on May 10, 2007, 21:58:58
Clematis wilsonii flowers may-june & smells of hot chocolate. Just had a look on the hull site.
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: Grandma on May 11, 2007, 00:33:32
Triff - Does look like No 6, doesn't it? Whatever it's called it's a real beauty! Enjoy it and its lovely perfume!  :)
Palustris - Oh, wow! What a fabulous collection! Thanks for taking the trouble to photograph them all, too.
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: triffid on May 11, 2007, 02:03:52
Quote from: janet h 1948 on May 10, 2007, 21:58:58
Clematis wilsonii flowers may-june & smells of hot chocolate...

At the moment, everything in the garden just smells of rain!  Can't say I've picked out hot chocolate, though, among the wafts from the clematis...  *will go and have a snuffle in daylight and report back*  :)
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: Twospot Ladybird on May 12, 2007, 17:04:42
I agree with Palustris and janet h. It looks like Clematis Montana 'wilsonii'

Palustris, picture 006 of yours looks like 'wilsonii' too

(http://www.allotments4all.co.uk/joomla/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=31430.0;attach=9575;image)

here's a link to the clematis hull pic for comparison

http://www.clematis.hull.ac.uk/new-clemdetail.cfm?dbkey=324
Title: Re: Help with clematis ID please?
Post by: Palustris on May 12, 2007, 17:51:15
Sorry, but No 8 is labelled wilsoni and it does indeed flower later than the others and smells of chocolate (ish). Trouble is that there are dozens of different clones of C. montana with wider or narrower tepals and more or less scent. It is so easy from seed that almost every grower has a different clone. Even worse, Wilson brought over more than one form of C. m . wilsoni so there are different versions of that flying around.