Topic: Not looking good for labour...

[redimp]

Remember Poll tax was per person,Council tax is per household :)

Which is why it was much fairer.

Mother in law, a pensioner, lived next door to a household where there were four wage earners.  She had to pay the same rates as the people next door.

Personally, I would prefer to see the poll tax reintroduced, as opposed to the iniquitous council tax.

Gordon Brown may like to reflect on his abolition of the 10p tax band.  It has increased OH's income tax bill by 100%.  He is over 65 so will not benefit from the so called 'concessions' that will be 'available'.

The disgusting thing about this government is that all benefits are 'means tested'.

You think you are eligible, and you are sent a 35 page booklet to complete.  It is so complicated, the government wins because you find it too difficult, so don't bother.

The government says that there are millions of pounds out there in benefits that are not being claimed.

WILL THEY JUST MAKE IT EASIER TO CLAIM!!

valmarg

Only people in large houses think it is fairer.  Just because your particular focus group benefit to the detriment of others in society, does not mean it is fairer.  A large house is capital, therefore savings.  If you have to pay more tax than someone who doesn't have a large house/capital/savings, then that is fairer than those same people paying the same amount.  The only fair tax is income tax (and inheritance tax is included in that as being a progressive taxation) and to a certain extent, savings taxes.  Flat taxes like poll tax and VAT are inherently unfair.  Council Tax is (should be) fairish, but it is still not as fair as a true income tax.

[Gazfoz]

You know how we have Mothers Day and Fathers Day etc. When do we have childrens day?
Or should we just wish that we had never been born in the first place.

[Rhubarb Thrasher]

Every day is children's day

[Paulines7]

Remember Poll tax was per person,Council tax is per household :)

Which is why it was much fairer.

Mother in law, a pensioner, lived next door to a household where there were four wage earners.  She had to pay the same rates as the people next door.

Personally, I would prefer to see the poll tax reintroduced, as opposed to the iniquitous council tax.

Gordon Brown may like to reflect on his abolition of the 10p tax band.  It has increased OH's income tax bill by 100%.  He is over 65 so will not benefit from the so called 'concessions' that will be 'available'.

The disgusting thing about this government is that all benefits are 'means tested'.

You think you are eligible, and you are sent a 35 page booklet to complete.  It is so complicated, the government wins because you find it too difficult, so don't bother.

The government says that there are millions of pounds out there in benefits that are not being claimed.

WILL THEY JUST MAKE IT EASIER TO CLAIM!!

valmarg

Regarding your Mother in Law, I think I have mentioned to you before Valmarg that a single person gets a 25% reduction in their rates. This is not means tested so even a millionaire would get this as a right if they live alone.  In addition, many pensioners are also eligible to get Council Tax benefit

I disagree that the forms are difficult to fill in.  If someone because of age or mentality finds them difficult, there is always help available.  For someone such as yourself, who is computer literate, it is very easy to fill in a questionnaire on line to ascertain eligibility for Council Tax benefit.  We filled it in the other day giving details of our future income for when my husband retires.  We found out we would get a reduction despite the fact we have our 30 year old son living with us and having his salary taken into consideration too.

What is disgusting about having benefits means tested?  It seems the only fair way to me.  Benefits have always been means tested whatever Government has been in power so why mention "this Government"?

[Barnowl]

Didn't Maggie come out with the infamous phrase to defend herself that she wasn't lying but 'being economical with the truth'?!....

Sorry, but she took my milk when I was a kid - Thatcher the milk snatcher she will always be... >:(

Despite the milk snatching I have to correct you. Mrs T. never used the phrase - in fact it wasn't technically a politician that coined it but a "Sir Humphrey", the Cabinet secretary Robert Armstrong in 1986.

PS I read a letter from a Chartered Accountant the other day who agreed to help someone sort out their tax credits situation he gave up in the end.  How many extra bureaucrats has this invasive and unwieldy system required? 

PPS One person in four is now on the government payroll.

[Moonbeam65]

Its been very interesting reading all the post on this topic but what we have to realise that all politicions are con men & con women and that there job is no matter which party they represent is to con as many people to vote for them before an election is due so they can reap the benefits on the back of the public who vote for them.
Will they change i very much doubt it as the voters do not kick up enough fuss when they the polititions bring out legislation that makes us poorer and them much richer.
Petrol prices are a prime example they have no chance of coming down as not enough fuss is being made about it so the goverment will just go on ignoring the issue unless we the public say enough is enough.
 

[Sinbad7]

Totally agree with Moonbeam, the British have always sat back and moaned and never ever, well once, over the poll tax, stood together and made the government of the day change their minds.  We really deserve all we put up with.

I just love the French and the way their truck drivers bring the country to a halt, if only us Brits were more like them but we never will be so there is not much point in moaning about any of them they are all as bad as each other, every man/woman has their price and it seems to me the most ordinary of MP's soon change and someone has found the price to offer them.  Every time I watch Diane Abbot I think it proves my point.

Sinbad 

[Geomet]

We have an infinately greater chance of social justice with the Labour Party than with those currently hoping to gain power........not without faults,or not error free,but just plain and simply a higher degree of sincerity and genuine intent to cultivate social justice

[Gazfoz]

Maybe 30odd years ago geomet. But then the country was in a total mess.
Social justice, how long have Labour now been in power? Where are the trade unions? Remember Tony and John, the dream team! What did ex shop steward Prescott ever do for the working man whilst taking a fortune in wages and expenses.
Tony Blair did a very slick job of giving the Conservatives nothing to whinge about and kept everyone happy for a while, you always felt he was just on the verge of doing something really great.
Does anyone watch the TUC anymore? Do they even have a TUC anymore since Arthur Scargill left and formed a Party committed to social justice which sank without trace.
I think we should all just be very thankful for what we have and hope that this global economy that we are all part of will be able to keep things running relatively smoothly for all of us.

[jjt]

If we all hope together just as hard as we can, or maybe clap our hands, perhaps it really will happen.

[Gazfoz]

Well I personally don't fancy a Civil War but anybody who wants to take what is mine can have one, that's for sure!

[Geomet]

I for one wont be hoodwinked by a band of distortive power seeking opportunists................I think Labour is most folks ONLY chance of a greater degree of fairness..................Sure...........there has been a concerted and frankly succesfull approach by the tory party, of character assasination against Gordon Brown...........they want power and seem intent on distorting reality to try to gain it.

[Sinbad7]

Urm geomet, don't you think GB has dug his own hole and now we should bury him ;D  He kidded us all that he had a grip on the economy when he was chancellor, it's a shame he didn't tell us it went pear shaped after the first two years, where he laid out his plan for a five year strategy, and instead of the economy growing he had to start to borrow money (big time) to keep us all spending our money and thinking this is great the economy is really growing, we are better off now with Gordon in charge.  The man is a con artist like most other politicians.

I would just like to say I never vote Labour or Conservative, so any of my comments have nothing to do with a political leaning to either main party's, oh and I don't vote Liberal either but do like to listen to what the politicians are up to.

Sinbad

[Mr Smith]

All these folk that call themselves 'Labour', how many belong to a trade union?, eHhhh whats a trade union ;)

[Geomet]

A trade union is a group of workers who band together to prevent total exploitation by callous employers void of social justice.

[grawrc]

I'm a union member. I used to vote labour too before Tony Blair.

[redimp]

I'm a member of a union too - which is why I was vilified in the media for standing up for a pay rise that was merely in line with inflation and not 2% below it.  Now I wonder why trade unions are struggling. :-\

[Moonbeam65]

I think geomet has got it slightly wrong of what a trade union is.
A trade union is a group of workers who band together pay there dues and more often than not get nothing for it as most unions are to scared to stand up to the government

[Gazfoz]

Well now.
Arthur stood up to the government and got his bloody arse kicked.
When governments continually move the goalposts and create new laws then you cannot win.
I consider myself to be a socialist and I would advise anybody to go and buy a packet of seeds and grow something once a week rather than waste it on union subscriptions these days.

[jjt]

At least one proper union's left. RMT don't back down easy. But in general I'd agree with seed packets.