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General => The Shed => Topic started by: ACE on February 13, 2020, 09:26:37

Title: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on February 13, 2020, 09:26:37
This coronavirus thing is getting a bit more worrying each day. I can't see us getting away with it. I will perish if it gets this far. I will even spray some goods I have on order from china before I handle them. Although I doubt they will even get here now with all the Chinese workers kept at home. Fake news is not helping, this is too important to play games with us but they still do it. I have overheard a conversation about somebody who has sneaked back from China via Hong Kong, how many more got away with that.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Vetivert on February 13, 2020, 10:14:38
I empathise, it is very concerning. But don't be anxious, be vigilant. It's in the country, the incubation period is 24 days - asymptomatic and contagious during this time. So all goods that arrive at your door have the potential to have been handled by someone unknowingly infected. Post gets left at our door now, opened over a bag and hands washed immediately after handling. We order for delivery from the supermarket rather than go into an area with hundreds of people. Better to deal with one delivery guy and sanitise the packaging.

I'm in Brighton, which is a hotzone right now due to that one guy who picked it up in Singapore. Some schools are closed. Councillors are complaining of lack of info and transparency from Public Health England. I have family who work in the hospital who have overheard some concerning conversations between doctors about lack of info.
The data from the CCP obviously cannot be taken at face value - there's a lot we do not know and it's of course likely to be for the worse, not better. To those who parrot 'it's no worse than flu', I don't recall the last time the Chinese regime disrupted their economy, silenced whistle-blowers, and barricaded citizens in their homes over seasonal flu.

It's frustrating to see some people's blasé view of the situation. It needs us as vectors. Deprive it of hosts. British stiff upper lip and carrying on as normal isn't going to achieve this. Panic isn't warranted but shrugging off basic contagion measures is plain stupid.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Beersmith on February 14, 2020, 15:18:11
But don't be anxious, be vigilant. It's in the country, the incubation period is 24 days - asymptomatic and contagious during this time.

If you are advising "don't be anxious", it would be better if you did not spread misinformation. The incubation period is not 24 days.  Here is an expert comment from Prof Paul Hunter, Professor in Medicine, University of East Anglia (UEA), on the research into incubation periods.

In presenting data on over 1000 cases of 2019 nCoV, Guan and colleagues have done a remarkable job. The suggestion that the incubation period may extend up to 24 days is definitely worrying, especially for people currently in quarantine who may, therefore, expect to spend longer is isolation.

However, the median incubation period remains very short at 3 days. This means that a half of people who will get ill will have developed their illness within 3 days of the initial contact and the proportion of people with the really long incubation periods will be very small. One of the issues with particularly long incubation periods is that it is often very difficult to exclude the possibility that the person had not had a second unrelated contact. Nevertheless, this new information illustrates is concerning and illustrates the need to be continuingly re-evaluating our risk assessments and advice


.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Vetivert on February 14, 2020, 17:47:58
Okay, the incubation period may be up to 24 days. I don't think I'm able to edit my post or I would make that correction. But to say I am spreading misinformation is unwarranted; the Guan et al. study you refer to in your comment does suggest that the range is 0 to 24 days.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: BarriedaleNick on February 14, 2020, 18:52:13
You can edit your posts - there should be a modify button in the top right of each post.

I am in Lewisham where someone turned up to our local hospital with the virus - in an Uber!
There was a very interesting article in New Scientist last week about this and how the situation is developing at a daily rate - death rates, incubation periods, transmission etc are a bit variable at the moment and the lack of transparency hasn't helped.
Personally I am not worried as I can't do anything about it so I am just going to carry on doing what I do - unless the situation changes..
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ancellsfarmer on February 14, 2020, 19:09:10
Folks, just relax.
In CHINA, since the first outbreak, 1400 have sadly died of the virus. In the same timespan, in China, approximately 18,000 have died in road traffic accidents. (based on 2017 statistics).
While I would be personally concerned if there were confirmed cases in my area (N E Hampshire), and I think our Government perhaps should be more open with us in relating facts and procedures we might need, it still remains a considerably greater risk of being struck by lightning (1in 33million )  than meeting a virus carrier in the UK.
 Ace, your risk while hidden away on IOW, is indescribably small. Worrying about that slight chance however will be in itself much more harmful IMO
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Beersmith on February 14, 2020, 20:43:20
Okay, the incubation period may be up to 24 days. I don't think I'm able to edit my post or I would make that correction. But to say I am spreading misinformation is unwarranted; the Guan et al. study you refer to in your comment does suggest that the range is 0 to 24 days.

I stand by my accusation that you were spreading misinformation.

You stated the incubation period was 24 days. You did not explain or elaborate. You stated 24 days as a fact.

The scientific evidence is that the incubation period is variable, but averages around just 3 days, and may in rare cases be as long as 24.

Your original claim was very misleading.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on February 14, 2020, 21:46:46
It doesn't really matter does it?  As long as we are all sensible, cover our mouth when we cough or sneeze and wash our hands thoroughly and regularly we won't be spreading germs of either this year's flu or the corona virus.    Even better if we self isolate rather than taking cough/cold/flu/corona virus to work or on the bus/trains/tram/doctor' surgery.

Plain common sense.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on February 15, 2020, 06:54:20
I don't really give a d**n who gets killed by car accidents or gets struck by lightning, The incubation period can be as long as it likes, If you are close by to somebody who does not know they have it, that is enough. Anxious I shall stay, I am not in the best of health so Valhalla beckons on every corner at the moment. Only yesterday as I walked into our little chemist a guy was asking for facemasks as he was just back from Singapore, I turned around pretty rapid and stayed outside until he came out, I mentioned it to the girl behind the counter, she said he had been screened already. So why was he also clutching a box of night nurse?  All the advice, coughing into your arm isolate etc is to stop me spreading it. This is not going to help me stop getting it when people go to health clinics and hospitals in taxis.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Vetivert on February 15, 2020, 09:51:37
Quote

I stand by my accusation that you were spreading misinformation.

You stated the incubation period was 24 days. You did not explain or elaborate. You stated 24 days as a fact.

The scientific evidence is that the incubation period is variable, but averages around just 3 days, and may in rare cases be as long as 24.

Your original claim was very misleading.

I find it ironic that you're being quite so pedantic about the validity of information in my comments, when you clearly do not uphold that level of editorial scrutiny for your own.
Median and average are not at all the same. By your own standards you are "spreading misinformation" as much as I. But I would not accuse you of such, even with the double-standard, because I take allotment forum sources with a pinch of salt.

Ace, I'd be alarmed too if I had encountered that guy in the chemist. Are you able to shut in at home for while, or do you have to go out often?
I have to go to a busy post office today. Hopefully with Storm Dennis brewing there won't be too many people out and about.
Here's a picture of a sweet little dog fully clothed & masked in Beijing https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/feb/15/coronavirus-cases-pass-66000-as-beijing-orders-14-day-quarantine-for-returnees#img-3
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: galina on February 15, 2020, 09:57:01
You can edit your posts - there should be a modify button in the top right of each post.


Mods can, punters cannot alter posts.  If we do not catch a mistake within about an hour, it can no longer be corrected.  This is why I had to ask PKL the other day to sort out a fingertrouble mess of mine.  Thank you for that.   :sunny:
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on February 15, 2020, 10:28:40







 Are you able to shut in at home for while, or do you have to go out often?

Yes I can stay away from people normally, but I have nearly weekly appointments at the clinic and hospital. Also my wife cares for the old and infirm, she has to go out. Not much chance of total isolation even over here. Then if I do get through it there are car crashes, lightning and ordinary flu also waiting to get me.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on February 15, 2020, 10:34:41
Not an optimist then ACE?  Even tho you've come this far without all those potential disasters wiping you out?   
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on February 15, 2020, 11:22:12
Not an optimist then ACE?   
should be thankful really, lead a charmed life really. Born a blue baby, shot at by an arab in Aden when I was in navy, countless near misses when riding the old Harley with the boys. Dug out of a deep collapsed hole in the ground. Flu when I was fifty nearly wiped me out. Came through it all only to be so medicated that I think the NHS will cut their losses if I was anyway connected with a Chinese virus.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: galina on February 15, 2020, 11:23:42

 Are you able to shut in at home for while, or do you have to go out often?

Yes I can stay away from people normally, but I have nearly weekly appointments at the clinic and hospital. Also my wife cares for the old and infirm, she has to go out. Not much chance of total isolation even over here. Then if I do get through it there are car crashes, lightning and ordinary flu also waiting to get me.
[/quote]

Not sure what happened there with Vetivert's quote that got attributed to me   :tongue3:
 
From what has been said this new virus is more likely to spread but less likely to kill you than SARS, which I suppose is a small glimmer of hope. 

Stay well Ace, you got a lot of new health problems all of a sudden, but they are all being addressed which  means you are less likely to run into serious strife now than you did before being diagnosed and treated.  This virus is of course on top of general health worries, but people who do not do so well are old, infirm and weak and many live in rural areas where healthcare may be way more basic than IOW.  UK survival statistics are expected to be way more favourable than the 2.4 percent death rate quoted.  You are keeping yourself fit and strong generally, you are not ancient and certainly not weak.  Even if you were to get it, your chances are good.  That guy would have spooked me too.  Chances are, he bought nightnurse for his wife, not for himself and the masks so he would not get her common winter flu while nursing her, but it must have looked alarming. 

I am laid up at the moment with flu despite having had the jab and only one week into the two weeks the doc says it will take to run its course and to isolate myself.  Mind you I am clearly not right and resting for most of the time.  With the miniscule intellectual attention span of a hyperactive toddler when I am awake.

Keep well all of you,  Obelixx got it right, we all use our common sense, do the best we can and hope for the best  :wave:
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Tee Gee on February 15, 2020, 11:32:56
C'mon Ace don't let things get you down! Particularly things like this virus.

As I see it what will be, will be!

I don't want to appear to be complacent but the press are a bit short of "News worthy" stories now that Brexit has more or less run its course, they must find some doom and gloom to write about!

My philosophy over the years has been..... You die if you worry you die if you don't! .... So why worry?

I guess this weather doesn't help either I always feel a bit down at this time of the year, but I always find something to do to get over it!
Get the old squeeze box out and get your feet tapping that might take your mind of your current problems, after all you're only but a lad yet (well compared to me you are!):occasion14:







Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: InfraDig on February 15, 2020, 17:41:34
Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't after you.

Joseph Heller.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: pumpkinlover on February 16, 2020, 07:57:50
Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't after you.

Joseph Heller.

I always thought that was Slartybartfast in Hitchhikers guid to the galaxy! Things you learn on an allotment forum.


Ace I can't say it better than Galina.  I think that there's a lot of wisdom in what she says.

Galina hope you start to feel better soon.
 
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: gray1720 on February 16, 2020, 18:27:44
The press are exaggerating coverage for their own agendas anyway - believe what you choose! A tabloid with a record for inacurracy and a name that rhymes with Daily Wail has been reporting that Chinatown in London is deserted owing to fears over the virus. I can tell you that I was there on Friday evening and it was as crowded as ever. Sure, a few more facemasks, and one shop had an NHS guidance notice on its door about coronavirus, but the  Wail's article was (not to put too fine a point on it) a load of bovine ordure.

Yes, we should be concerned, but it's far from the Black Death even if the tabloids want us to believe it is.

Adrian
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: cudsey on February 17, 2020, 18:39:28
 Going back to the thought of coronavirus on the 15th Jan I ordered various packets of seeds from Amazon they arrived within a couple of days all except one which was geranium balcony and within a few days an e mail said they had been dispatched and would arrive by the 11th Feb which I thought was a long time they never arrived I kept tracking it and was given different dates  Sat they said to contact seller and then found out they were coming from China I am not sure if I want them now so I did canx them so I now know why they did not arrive but not sure what to do if they should end up in my postbox  I am wondering why geranium seeds have to come China wish I had tried Wilkos
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on February 17, 2020, 19:43:16
For heaven's sake!

The virus is like flu - passed on as water droplets after coughing or sneezing and by transfer after contact with such droplets on the hands.  The seeds would not have been carriers or even infected and yes, definitely best to buy from local or UK suppliers because seeds from elsewhere can carry unwanted plant pathogens such as the ones killing of box and ash and rhodos and olives
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Froglegs on February 18, 2020, 09:50:52
I work for Nottingham trams where i come into contact with hundreds of folk daily, a lot of which are foreign students from the universities, I see passengers coughing  and sputtering all the time, me and my colleagues are constantly coming down with coughs,colds and sore throats ....in the past couple or three months I've had the flu that put me in bed for a week , just got over that only to come down with a chest infection and had to go a course of antibiotics. So yes I'm worried....it will only take one to slip through the net as the NHS struggles at this time of year as it is !















 
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on February 18, 2020, 11:06:29
I remember as a child there was a public health campaign on TV and presumably in newspapers and so on "Coughs and sneezes spread diseases" so cover your mouth and wash your hands thoroughly.

How hard would it be to run such a campaign again adding social media to the mix.  It would help enormously.   Maybe time for tram and bus drivers to be protected again by screens between them and passengers.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: saddad on February 18, 2020, 13:08:44
 "Coughs and sneezes spread diseases".... this and things like "No Spitting" signs on busses and the like... came out of pioneering work of Drs Like Dr Niven who was a medical officer in the Manchester area during the 1918-1919 Spanish Flu pandemic. Things like closing Cinemas and Theatres as well to avoid crowds. It was very successful and the Death Rate in Manchester was much lower than comparable cities. It still appals me the amount of spitting in public theses days...
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on February 18, 2020, 13:23:26
Footballers spit a lot and on TV too - they should be fined and shamed every time.  It's disgusting.

Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on February 25, 2020, 21:12:41
Getting worse isn't it? The 'It will get better as the weather gets warmer' has been shown to be wrong, The Canaries is warm all the time. Self isolate yeh right, who is voluntarily going to give up their wages when they could  already be on the breadline? 
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: galina on February 26, 2020, 07:21:04
Ace you are right.  That is what annoyed me yesterday about the 'official' advice.  Self isolate, but they will still sanction you when you don't show up for an appointment, anybody self employed will not be able to do that either.  No provision has been made for self isolated people at home to be medically supervised and have regular screening.  Stay at home, feel well or feel unwell and have no provisions in, then what?  And the rest of the family too?  This has all not been thought through beyond the catchy phrase 'self isolation' and because of that it will not work.   



:BangHead:
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on February 26, 2020, 10:25:35
Must admit I've wondered how they're going to manage the whole medical certificate/sign off process so people get paid and also the logistics of supplies.  We have a well stocked pantry and freezers but not everyone does. 

On the other hand, this bug is not yet as virulent or as lethal as, for example, bubonic plague or post WW1 "Spanish" flu which was actually a bird flu from Kansas.

Meanwhile, common sense still applies.  Make sure you and yours are covering your mouths if you cough or sneeze and washing hands regularly and thoroughly with soap and water, not antiseptic wipes or gel which are less efficient.  Eat healthily for a full range of vitamins and minerals to boost your immune system and avoid unnecessary crowd situations.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: pumpkinlover on February 26, 2020, 13:16:27
I have to say that I am not happy that there is no restriction on travel.
This virus only gets from one country to another by people flying about the world.
So unpopular though it might be, to me at least the sensible action would be to ban non essential travel.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on February 26, 2020, 13:50:55
Profits come first, lives second, they will not even call it a pandemic because it will affect the stock markets. It will all come down to the less well off losing money with  self isolation before business takes a hit.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on February 26, 2020, 14:50:30
Businesses are already taking a hit - tourism here losing Chinese customers, manufacturers not getting Chinese components and materials as their suppliers have closed, travel all over affected, shortages of all sorts of supplies building into the system and so on, even face masks!

This virus is killing fewer people worldwide so far than seasonal flu does in one UK winter.   

If you have a health condition, take precautions about where you go and whom you meet.   

Common sense is needed, not fear-mongering and worry.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: saddad on February 26, 2020, 16:25:10
It would get here without flying... just take longer to arrive. It will blow itself out only once it has been around the world. At least it doesn't seem as virulent as the "Spanish Flu", I wouldn't recommend Pandemic 1918 by Catharine Arnold as light bedtime reading at the moment...
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: BarriedaleNick on February 28, 2020, 07:45:31
One of our sister schools has closed although it is a self imposed measure as no one has tested positive yet.
We have been asked to make sure all IT and comms are working so that everyone can work remotely and we have a family that has self isolated on advice after returning from Italy = again no one  has tested positive.
It seems only a matter of time before it blows up in London as it is such an international city.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on February 28, 2020, 09:46:21


This virus is killing fewer people worldwide so far than seasonal flu does in one UK winter.   

If you have a health condition, take precautions about where you go and whom you meet.   

Seasonal flu is as well as and for health conditions every time an expert starts talking that it is not a killer unless you have ………….. and then they reel off my ailments, they might just as well say don't worry, you will not die, unless your name is Ace.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Tee Gee on February 28, 2020, 09:57:24
Quote
West Yorkshire school pupil tested for coronavirus after Italy ski trip

She lives in my village apparently.....fingers crossed her tests turn out negative

So yes it is getting nearer to home!
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on February 28, 2020, 10:06:20
Quote
West Yorkshire school pupil tested for coronavirus after Italy ski trip

She lives in my village apparently.....fingers crossed her tests turn out negative

So yes it is getting nearer to home!
Blimey, If that was near me I would move to an island
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on February 28, 2020, 10:08:14
ACE - you can use self defense measures, just as you would with flu.   Personal hygiene re hand washing and using tissues when coughing or sneezing and not associating in groups where others may be less careful.   

Given your recent health problems and the measures take to improve you're not going down the pub anyway.  You're retired so no journeys on crowded buses, trains or tubes.  If you feel ill, call 111 rather than going to the doctor's surgery.

Common sense - and remember to look both ways before crossing the road!
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Tee Gee on February 28, 2020, 11:21:48
Quote
Blimey, If that was near me I would move to an island

Good idea .... what do you charge for B&B?
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: pumpkinlover on February 28, 2020, 12:28:07
I understand your concerns Ace but best not to dwell too much.
My  personal anxieties are about Mr PKL who has had an awful lot of health issues in the last few years. He doesn't go out and about that much but I am using public transport and meeting a lot of people when I am volunteering. The thought of bringing it home to him is a worry.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Froglegs on February 28, 2020, 13:10:17
I was listening to one a them travel experts yesterday on the wireless encouraging folk to snap up holiday bargains the virus is creating ....surly it would be better to cancel all none essential fights as the spread seems to be picking up speed? 
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on March 01, 2020, 15:30:43
I expect it will slow things down but it could work
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on March 06, 2020, 09:01:08
Ran the gauntlet yesterday, another eye test, people coughing and sneezing, not a tissue in sight, there is no recorded virus over here yet but you would think people would start taking notice of the guidelines. I have a huge bottle of surgical spirit which I am going to devise a way of getting into a small spray to use on my hands when I am out. Just a thought, do you think spraying coughers might end me up in court.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on March 06, 2020, 09:12:39
That's pretty awful ACE.  Hope your eye test was OK.

Over here there have been public health announcements at frequent intervals on all TV and radio stations and in the press and everyone is knocking elbows or feet or just saying hello rather than the usual greetings of kisses and handshakes.  Generally being sensible and good humoured and carrying on with life.

Soap and water are still more effective than alcohol gels for hand washing but one of the worst places for bugs is a mobile phone and they don't do well under a tap.  The government here is introducing price caps on alcohol gels.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on March 06, 2020, 09:42:30
That's pretty awful ACE.  Hope your eye test was OK.


I have to see a specialist next Tuesday before they do the cataract, but with the current situation a lot of operations will be postponed.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Jeannine on March 06, 2020, 09:56:54
Take care Ace, and be well XX Jeannine
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: George the Pigman on March 07, 2020, 21:24:34
I had both eyes done for cataracts a several years ago (a few months apart) and they piled loads of antiseptics on them before treatment. As well as local anaesthetics of course! It was a day case so you should be OK re the dreaded coronavirus.
It transformed my eyesight and should have had it done earlier. I could see more after a few days after the op than I could the day before the op.
All the best
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: galina on March 07, 2020, 21:58:20
That has been my experience too Pigman.  A life changing operation and as they insert prescription lenses I am now free of my high myopia thick glasses too. 

There are lots of eye drops to be taken after the operation.  That should take care of any nasties.  And before the operation, they come round every few minutes for yet another set of eye drops.

Unfortunately the wait was awful, they don't do these ops anymore in a timely fashion, but let you go on and on.  When I was first diagnosed, they said the op would be needed in about 3 years.  Well for me it was nearer 7 before they did the first eye and nearly a year after that the second.  No way would I have wanted to delay. 

You will be amazed Ace how well you can see afterwards.  And the colours are wonderful.  I was wearing a red jumper on the day, thinking that it looked quite old and washed out, a brownish orangey red.  After the op, it was bright red again.  And all the flowers were so much more intensively coloured than before.  Best of luck.    :wave:
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on March 10, 2020, 07:33:26
Another game of Russian roulette today, I have arranged to get blood tests and eye specialist done on the same day to save me having to go to the hospital twice, we have had a case prove positive over here so after today I will be self distancing. The grandchildren will no longer be picked up from school, I shall be cycling everywhere to save going on the bus and all my friends will be warned not to approach me, just shout hello from a distance. Using 'underlying health conditions' might allay the fears of a younger generation but for me being  one of the walking dead it only rubs it in. I fear the government is going too slow, so best take my own precautions now.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on March 10, 2020, 08:06:35
Sounds like a sensible plan ACE.   Even when there is no virus epidemic doing the rounds we all need to take responsibility for our health and for that of our loved ones so healthy diet, regular exercise, no excess alcohol, not smoking.  We would thus avoid all sorts of problems such as avoidable diabetes, many cancers, heart attacks, strokes etc and thus save ourselves and our loved ones a lot of grief and the NHS an absolute fortune, freeing resources who haven't got self-inflicted illnesses.

As gardeners we invest a lot of time improving the soil and applying balanced fertilisers according to the needs of the plants we're growing - nitrogen for leafy plants, P & K for tomatoes.  Why not do the same for ourselves?
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Tiny Clanger on March 11, 2020, 12:23:22
Hi Ace,  Keep using the disinfectant spray.  We are getting shopping on line and wiping down the packages, going to the shops as little as possible.  You are doing all you can.  Try to stay positive and wait it out.  Wish I could say nothing to worry about but hey, worrying is not going to make any difference, so enjoy the fact that you are feeling OK right now.

GOod luck, and with a bit of luck and god's blessing we will all be still here in a few weeks time.  Keep posting Ace to let us know you are OK? xx  :blob7:
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: BarriedaleNick on March 12, 2020, 18:42:55
Where I work (School) someone's partner has tested positive so I expect they both have it and it will have been spread round to dozens if not hundreds of people..
I fully expect we will be shut down soon and all sent home. 
Worrying times.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on March 12, 2020, 20:09:19
Too close for comfort, but I think we will all come up against it at sometime. Just keep washing your hands and toilet rolls are now easier to get even though every time somebody sneezes ten people crap themselves.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Jeannine on March 13, 2020, 04:29:46
Ace and other UK friends, I am thinking about you. I am quite isolated which is a good thing as I am close to the US  border and on the other side it is gaining quite quickly. they are advising Canadians not to go so I guess my parcel at my US address will have to wait.

It is still low in Canada but there have been a lot of restictions here.Our church is still open fpr worship but communiom has been cancelled as have all the church activities, and we are on stand by for further restrictions. Canada health has sais as from today said anyone leaving Canada , even to the US  cannot go to work or school for 14 days.

I have not ket up to date with the Uk, I need to go and take a look, but it sounds scary.

Take care you all,,you are in my thoughts.



Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: saddad on March 13, 2020, 07:47:03
OH works in the NHS, and I work in schools... our chances of not getting it seem fairly slim...
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on March 13, 2020, 11:52:00
Saddad, I assume your are both in the age range likely to be least affected and will therefore get some immunity of infected.  The trick, as ever, is not to pass it on to vulnerable people less able to cope with the infection.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on March 14, 2020, 07:08:51
Well it looks as if the sporting world has told the government we are not playing your game, in fact we are not playing any game. If all the governments advice to me is don't go out or go on a cruise it leaves a lot left to chance. I saw the phrase 'Culling the elderly' in one paper and I don't think they are far off the mark.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on March 14, 2020, 09:55:03
French government advice is for all 70+ people to stay at home to protect themselves as they are the most vulnerable age group.   There isn't a health system in the world that has enough respirators to cope with a crisis with the kinds of peaks seen in China and Italy so advice to delay the inevitable spread of the virus makes health as well as economic and social sense.

No point in panicking or feeling got at.   Stay positive, be careful and make the most of any gardening opportunities to stay active and fit for the duration.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: BarriedaleNick on March 14, 2020, 14:42:27
We are going to postpone our site AGM.
It may sound overly dramatic but our elderly crew are the ones who always feel they must turn up to the AGM and we don't want them to feel they have to turn up and risk their health.  It's not like much happens at the AGM anyway!
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: George the Pigman on March 14, 2020, 22:27:13
I think the government is backtracking on their policy on seeing its becoming unpopular and is getting a lot of criticism.. The person mainly involved in making the decision is an epidemiologist whose experience is mainly in malaria not viral diseases which is a vector transmitted disease which is very different. Lots of experts who know more about viral diseases are criticising his approach. The computer model he is using has not been looked at by any of the other scientist and hence never peer reviewed.
Hopefully sanity will prevail.

I was a Clinical Biochemist in a NHS Specialist Service (not Microbiology though) and worked in a University Research Department prior to that This feels like an experimental approach that would never have been very difficult to pass through any ethical committee.

But keep on gardening. That's the best way to stay healthy!
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: pumpkinlover on March 15, 2020, 08:05:55
Interesting information there George.


Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: BarriedaleNick on March 15, 2020, 09:20:17
London seems to be shutting itself down slowly.
It is getting quieter by the day - although I haven't been out much.  People are posting pictures of empty tube stations and deserted streets.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on March 15, 2020, 10:20:39
I expect a lot of younger people would just like to catch it and get it over with, but have elderly parents and vulnerable friends who don't want to be anywhere near it. Only two cases over here, so my wife ran the gauntlet yesterday and done some essential shopping, with my diet, enough to last a month, but just a weeks worth to most people. Extra hand cleaning and wiping down trolley handles. She said there were empty shelves in one shop but plenty of the unpopular food I have to eat. It is a pity the plot is a bit sparse at the moment, otherwise we could nearly get away without shopping. But I can get there and back without encountering anybody so a bit of sunshine and planting fast growing stuff we will survive. The fly in the ointment is that she is a care worker, and her hands are already getting sore with all the washing. I am tempted to move into the motor home, but if she gets it I will have to look after her anyway so washed fingers crossed it will not get too bad here.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on March 15, 2020, 11:11:36
No idea why anyone would think a virus would spread along teh same lines as malaria as it isn't mosquito borne.

Yesterday the French PM announced that the French need to be more responsible in counteracting the virus and, to drive the point home, says all social gatherings are cancelled, family gatherings should not be held, all bars, cafées, restaurants will be closed as of Monday and also all shops except essentials like food, pharmacies and banks.  That means no patch group meetings, no mosaic group and, I expect, no dance class either

On Thursday the president announced all schools, colleges etc will be closed as of Monday.  teachers are expected to teach their classes online - whilst looking after their own children - and parents of under 16s who have to stay at home to look after the will receive sick pay from day 1.  No idea how all the rest is going to be financed but it will be a major hit to the economy.

On the up side, the sun is shining at last and OH has been able to start cutting the grass.   This pm we'll go and prepare the polytunnel for the tomatoes and chilies.

Take care everyone.   Stay safe and well.


Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: George the Pigman on March 15, 2020, 14:02:42
It was announced today that there are plans for asking all over 70s to self isolate for up to 3 months even if they have no high risk relevant health conditions and haven't got the virus! That would mean a very large proportion of our allotmenteers would never be able to manage their plots. Provided one doesn't mix closely being on the plot couldn't be more healthy.
I can't see this being practical. What if you live in a house with people younger that 70. They can go out and catch the virus and give it to you! Also if someone lives on their own getting food can be a problem. Ocado have already stopped taking on new registrations so I can foresee all delivery services will soon be saturated.
I am in favour of the immediate one off isolation of nearly everyone that other countries are using and has been shown to work in China, South Korea and now seems to be starting to work in Italy rather than an experimental approach that is unproven and based on computer models.
The herd immunity idea is normally only used in vaccination the idea being that if you get 60%-90% of a community immunised it protects the unimmunised. A learned scientist on the BBC pointed out that to get the 60% figure they are aiming at they would need for 40 million people to get the virus. Even at a conservative death rate of 0.1% that would mean 40,000 deaths - more than happened in China! It's an unworkable plan and playing with our lives.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: pumpkinlover on March 16, 2020, 07:56:47
We are working on the principle that going out side is the best to promote a healthy immune system. I don't consider going to the allotment to be a high risk activity as apart from talking to people there's no close proximity.
The activities we are avoiding are all inside.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on March 16, 2020, 09:04:21
Same here, I am quite isolated at the plot and I don't meet anybody along the lane to get there. I have been organising an event in the town for over a year, dancing, shanties, irish music, English music, folk singing and a bit of Cajun all in different pubs and running all day. I asked them all if they wanted to cancel. A big no came back. I cannot or dare not go and if it is not stopped officially some of them said they would stream some back to me. The internet will now be my main way of contacting friends. A year at the least before a vaccine is ready even if they can, I cannot see a lot of us avoiding it that long. Perhaps later we should have a big 'sh!t or bust' party and go out with a bang, at least the waiting will be over with.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: George the Pigman on March 16, 2020, 11:37:54
I usually walk to and from the plot (unless I can persuade my wife to drive me or pick me up as I don't drive). It's about a mile and usually never get within 6 ft of anyone. At the plot, although I talk to people, I never get within 6ft again. Also, as the experts say, there is less chance of catching in in open spaces.
I'm a reasonably fit 71 year old and very fortunate to have none of the high risk conditions that would make me particularly vulnerable (ie, lung, heart or circulatory problems, diabetes or a weakened immune system). So working on the allotment would not be a high risk activity but would in fact be beneficial for mind and body.
I only bought my seed potatoes and onions at the weekend so I do need to get them in some time over the next few weeks. Although it's going to take some time to get the plot ready to plant. The heavy rain in Autumn and Winter stopped me doing any digging and the plot is still soaking. Might start a few spuds in boxes at home and some onion sets in pots to get an earlier crop as I doubt I will get them in before mid-April at the earliest.
In the news it looks like they are backtracking a little bit. They are now saying as regards the over 70s it doesn't stop them going for a walk just make sure to avoid close social contact and use common sense which sounds more reasonable.
I am all in favour of common sense!
Sounds like a reet good do ACE! At least nowadays we have the internet and mobile phone speak to and see people so one is less isolated.


Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: pumpkinlover on March 16, 2020, 18:09:41
What a shame about your event Ace, it sounds brilliant and great fun.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on March 16, 2020, 18:18:52
It does.  Maybe postpone it?

All sorts cancelled here too from patchwork and mosaic groups to exhibitions and fairs including our garden club fair and, no doubt, the local spring fair where I buy all the lovely heritage tomatoes we grow.   Schools closed till after the Easter hols.   Bars and restaurants closed.   

Thank heavens I have lots of things I can do indoors and we have a big plot and veggie section we can work in till this is over.

Best to be safe than sorry so take care everyone and be sensible.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on March 16, 2020, 18:26:04
With the latest no unnecessary socialising I have had to cancel it. It took nearly a year to organise, but we will have a bigger and better event to celebrate when this is all over. I am glad to hear the latest bulletin from Boris, it should make it a bit easier to avoid getting it now we are all on the same wavelength. Some shops are opening early for a pensioners hour which might make shopping less stressful without having a crowded store to get around.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: George the Pigman on March 17, 2020, 20:59:50
Mowed the lawn and dug and spread compost on the salad veg bed at the back of the garden today. At this rate the garden is going to look emaculate when it's all over!
The allotment - now that's another matter!
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: pumpkinlover on March 18, 2020, 07:22:25
I am getting so much work done on the allotment because so many other activities are curtailed. All the jobs which I never get round to.
George are you not able to get to the plot?
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: saddad on March 18, 2020, 09:00:59
I'm certainly making good progress on the backlog of allotment jobs now the torrential rain has eased up... 1 or 2 people per 300 sq yards seems sufficiently isolated to me.. just try to avoid a queue near the toilet block!
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: InfraDig on March 18, 2020, 10:05:02
Remember to take your own paper!
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Beersmith on March 18, 2020, 11:15:07
Remember to take your own paper!

Are you mad?  Out alone in possession of a roll of loo paper?  Asking for trouble.

 :laughing9:
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: galina on March 18, 2020, 12:06:54
Or avoid the loo altogether, because you need to touch quite a few surfaces.  Just saying  ..........  :BangHead:
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: pumpkinlover on March 18, 2020, 12:36:27
Bucket in shed for me.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on March 18, 2020, 12:55:10
No need for bog roll plenty of soft leaves about, mullen, mallow and lambs ear, (if you can get one to stand still long enough) they have just nicked a shop lifter down here. 
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on March 18, 2020, 14:00:19
This link might make you smile - https://www.boredpanda.com/quarantine-coronavirus-jokes/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=BPFacebook
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: George the Pigman on March 18, 2020, 21:17:43
I can get to the allotment OK pumpkinlover but its so soaked it's not worth it at the moment. I need for it to dry out a bit to dig out the weeds.
As regards alternatives to loo roll I used to know someone who swore by dock leaves. However one day she misidentified a plant with very sore consequences!!
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: DrJohnH on March 18, 2020, 21:25:26
1 or 2 people per 300 sq yards seems sufficiently isolated to me

Read that as fertiliser- oops!
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Beersmith on March 18, 2020, 23:09:58
We ran out of milk a couple of days back, so a bit reluctantly went to a local store today. Luckily it was fairly quiet, so  taking care to stay a good distance away from the few other customers we were putting a few items into a basket when two men walked in wearing heavy masks.I must admit that we felt a bit of panic at first, but everything was fine. They had just come in to rob the place.

 :toothy10:
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Beersmith on March 18, 2020, 23:22:42

And now I am worried that my gallows humour may offend some members.

So I will send my sincere best wishes to you all. My hope is that we all get safely through this. Take care. Keep smiling and keep gardening!
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on March 19, 2020, 06:54:55
Beersmith laughter is the best medicine, when I was at work on the parks and gardens and needed cheering up I used to go to the gravediggers tea hut. Funniest blokes around.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: pumpkinlover on March 19, 2020, 07:09:49

And now I am worried that my gallows humour may offend some members.

So I will send my sincere best wishes to you all. My hope is that we all get safely through this. Take care. Keep smiling and keep gardening!

Well it will not offend me, ex-nurse we are the worst.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: BarriedaleNick on March 19, 2020, 09:03:52
Well Im off to school today to see what will happen. I work in IT so i may end up being required to attend even though the place is shut - I am still employed after all.
I was In Portugal on Monday and the difference was stark.  Every taking it very seriously - nothing open in the evening, no bars, shops or cafes.. 
BUT the big shops had plenty of everything - Lidl was limiting the amount of people in the shop, no one was panic buying and you could get everything you needed.
Popped out to Sainsbury's yesterday - loads of people milling about but no meat, no fish, no rice, no pasta, no bog roll, no fruit, no veg - seriously nothing except some duck breasts!
A mate went to work yesterday and said she still couldn't get a seat on the underground.  I fear London is going to have catastrophic numbers in a few weeks.
Loads of our staff are off with temps and even though I wasn't working yesterday I spent hours online trying to get staff set up for remote work.
I expect London to go into max lock-down soon.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Peanuts on March 19, 2020, 14:04:08
Yes, the difference here in SW France is very different too.  Not saying it is perfect, certainly not in Paris by all accounts, but here no shortages, and people are taking it very seriously indeed, and have been doing for 10 days now.  No shortages in shops locally and loo paper shelves are full as normal. 
We can only go out with a signed and dated piece of paper, saying which of four absolutely essential reasons we are having to do.  On pain of  on-the-spot fines of well over £100.  And my goodness the gendarmes are really imposing that.
Have to say though, that we are very fortunate.  We have a large garden, and plenty of home produce, and eggs and milk from the farm next door. But goodness knows when we will next see our lovely four small grandchildren in the UK :sad10: :sad10: :sad10: :sad10:
Take care everyone
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on March 19, 2020, 14:10:07
Did my weekly shop this morning.  Very serene with quiet roads and a calm SM.  No patrols and no panic buying.  Only things in short supply are frozen green veggies and organic eggs but I got local free range so that's OK.  Staff and customers all polite and smiling and maintaining social distancing.  Only 2 wearing masks.

I found everything I needed for the pantry and house including some new paintbrushes, wood filler, radiator paint and clear acrylic varnish so I can DIY and paint to my heart's content.  However it's warm and sunny so this pm I'm playing out in the garden and veggie plot.

Take care everyone.  It looks like we're in for a long haul and this thing will go on for weeks.  Stay Zen.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: George the Pigman on March 19, 2020, 19:55:44
Went to local Sainsburys in Brum today to pick up a prescription. We have a friend who is housebound and totally bedridden with severe MS. We rang her yesterday and she said could we get her some milk and frozen meals as the carers tried to get some but the shop was sold out!
The hoarders are making it difficult for housebound people.
Interesting to hear Portugal and France don't have this sort of problem.
Why are us Brits so scared of running out of loo paper? Sanitiser, paracetamol, food I can understand - but loo roll!

Must be some primeval fear deep inside us!
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on March 19, 2020, 21:11:18
Apparently it started with the Japanese who import all their loo rolls as they have no domestic source for wood pulp.  Good old social media has spread the story and others are panicking too.

I do despair of all the idiots behaving badly.  Shameful.   It's happening in Paris - huge city, little sense of community - but nothing like what's happening in the UK.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: BarriedaleNick on March 20, 2020, 08:05:00
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wA4KS546rZo

Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Paulh on March 20, 2020, 08:17:56
I saw a white van yesterday with written in the dirt on the back "No toilet rolls kept in this van overnight".
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on March 20, 2020, 09:11:03
It will not be long before people have stocked up, It is a good job we are at the off season stage on the plots as I reckon we would all have been robbed of produce. They can hoard all the tinned stuff they like I do not use any apart from tinned tomatoes. Freezers can only hold so many ready meals, mine is full of fruit and veg from the plot, meat I can do without, not that I want to, but I could always go to a friends farm butchery. There is also a lovely weigh it yourself shop near us which will said it will deliver to regular customers, oats, pulses and lentils a plenty  We have a few easter eggs for the grand children but it will most probably be a loo roll hunt this year.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: galina on March 20, 2020, 14:05:51
From our shopping trip today (for 2 weeks to reduce infection chances) we got most stuff or easy substitutes, but only a couple of rolls of kitchen towel.  OH will have to find the hacksaw to turn it into loo paper.  Now should we go for halving the width of the roll or for an economy narrower version by creating 3 rolls out of every kitchen towel roll?   :happy7:
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ancellsfarmer on March 20, 2020, 15:59:44
Yes, the difference here in SW France is very different too.  Not saying it is perfect, certainly not in Paris by all accounts, but here no shortages, and people are taking it very seriously indeed, and have been doing for 10 days now.  No shortages in shops locally and loo paper shelves are full as normal. 
We can only go out with a signed and dated piece of paper, saying which of four absolutely essential reasons we are having to do.  On pain of  on-the-spot fines of well over £100.  And my goodness the gendarmes are really imposing that.
Have to say though, that we are very fortunate.  We have a large garden, and plenty of home produce, and eggs and milk from the farm next door. But goodness knows when we will next see our lovely four small grandchildren in the UK :sad10: :sad10: :sad10: :sad10:
Take care everyone
Regarding the grandchildren; have you considered enabling a Skype account, to gain the comfort of image exchange. Depending on their ages, they may enjoy 'playing you up'- at a safe distance!
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Obelixx on March 20, 2020, 16:03:04
I am currently using FB messenger to chat with my daughter in Belgium to let her know what we're up to and find out how she's doing - final year of Master's and cooped up in an all be it comfortable apartment but on her own.   We have several What's App (??) chats a week too.   Camera on my PC kaput and hers is dodgy so no Facetime but it would work well otherwise.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: George the Pigman on March 24, 2020, 18:53:43
Just thought people might want to know there has been clarification about the rules of going out for exercise. Michael Gove has confirmed that going to the allotment counts as the once a day exercise.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/mar/24/uk-lockdown-gove-tries-to-clarify-confusion-over-rules

There are strict rules about hand washing, keeping your distance etc. Our allotment society has provided us with guidelines.
Of course its a personal decision whether one goes or not and certainly you shouldn't go if you have the virus or are isolating because you share a house with someone who has it.

Also most of the garden centres near us have closed down although one is offering deliveries or collection at a safe collection point.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ACE on March 25, 2020, 08:54:13
I have just seen the protective gear they have given my wife as she is a carer a plastic apron gloves and a dust mask. I have also told her to pack up her job.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Jeannine on March 26, 2020, 08:42:13
Here in Canada we are not on total lockdown in my area. The city next to me , about 20 minutes drive,  has several cases, new this week, and to the left I have the US state line to Washington  , also 20 minutes,where it is bad. We can'lt go there though. I am on isolation because of my age and chest problems, so I haven;t mean out for a month. Everything is pretty much closed down, pubs, restaurantchemists are open but on ess hours, many banks are closed. School kids are not expexted to get back until September.

I have to say I am proud of our Premier, they are doing tons of things for folks who are not able to work and have put tons of money arounf for these kind of things. We are all paying the lowest rate of electricity, their is a freeze on student loan repayments, no interest on morgages, and they have  frozen all landlords right to ask tenants to leave if they can;t pay their rent.

I am fine, very isolated, and as I am a bit of a sqirrell, I always stoch my panyry and freezers in the late Fall and then in April I start using evrything up and take it easy over summer, then stock up again , so I am fortunate that I am fully stocked with pretty much everything right now, so could easily go a few months without shopping.

Anyway  friends,stay safe, keep well.. it will all get back to normal eventually.. XX Jeannine
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: ancellsfarmer on March 26, 2020, 17:05:06
From our shopping trip today (for 2 weeks to reduce infection chances) we got most stuff or easy substitutes, but only a couple of rolls of kitchen towel.  OH will have to find the hacksaw to turn it into loo paper.  Now should we go for halving the width of the roll or for an economy narrower version by creating 3 rolls out of every kitchen towel roll?   :happy7:
Caution, the high wet -strength kitchen roll will clog your drains. Not a situation you want at this, or any time.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: pumpkinlover on March 26, 2020, 18:06:39
From our shopping trip today (for 2 weeks to reduce infection chances) we got most stuff or easy substitutes, but only a couple of rolls of kitchen towel.  OH will have to find the hacksaw to turn it into loo paper.  Now should we go for halving the width of the roll or for an economy narrower version by creating 3 rolls out of every kitchen towel roll?   :happy7:
Caution, the high wet -strength kitchen roll will clog your drains. Not a situation you want at this, or any time.

Yes we had an e-mail from the water company about this.
Title: Re: getting a bit anxious
Post by: Jeannine on March 26, 2020, 19:42:59
Can you get Wizzy Wipes  over there.Little compressed rounds of  material that expands into a decent size pice of fabric  with a teaspoon of water. it  is like the wet wipes we all know. I have kept a roll of them in my handbag for a long time  now and they work really well. If you are out in the bush , country etc and no facilities they do make decent toilet  paper. They are about the size of Steradent tablets. Great if you have kids.