Allotments 4 All
Allotment Stuff => The Basics => Topic started by: catherton2 on April 12, 2011, 15:55:25
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hey everyone im new to this site im be honest apart from playing on my dads allotment as a young child iv never had much intereact with them, the reason i have set up this account up is to ask some advice and options on a university project i am doing.
i am studying architectural technology at the university of central Lancashire for my final project of this year we have been given the assignment of looking into allotments and the people who use them. from the breif i have been given by tutors it is obvious that they them selfs have also never been on an allotment properly, the task we have been given is to totaly re design the are'a where allotments are and come up with building designs for say over night stays for people who do not live local to the allotments or maybe some kind of alternative green house.
The reason iv come on today is to gather any information you could have to spare anything you yourselves think could improve allotment area's.
any help would be greatly appreciated as i wish to have as much information to present to my tutor and other students and i shall also gladly display my work for anyone to look at if they are interested on the site as i progress.
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Oh dear... :)
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We could come up with enough for a PhD thesis between us, but why don't you visit your local allotments, and ask the people there? Do a case study, and it might go down better than random answers.
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The only comment I'd make [apart from a sarcastic comment on the correct use of apostrophes] would be that the whole point of allotments is that they are local......
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:-\ I suppose they want you to think radically about the design... But to be honest, for me its peace and beauty comes from almost absence of design. Design from outside, I mean.
Each allotment plot is designed by the tenant, and comes from a mix of their dreams, whims, local growing conditions, traditional growing methods of the tenant's culture, and is also shaped by availability of materials. (You'll have noticed they recycle a lot of old stuff on allotments.) If there's a load of pallets available, someone might fence an entire plot with them and paint them yellow. If there's a skip full of old doors - a shed may appear, made of old doors... There's a bucket of cheap gooseberry bushes at the local pound shop - they bung a few of them in. Someone next door offers them some runner beans, so they grow runners every year afterwards.
So allotments are very personal and home-made, maybe they sort of evolve. I think that's rare and special and to be encouraged, don't you think?
I'm not saying that to have a go, I think architecture is fascinating. I just wondered if it would give you any ideas... Can you sort of anti-design an allotment site? :)
I agree with Robert - go and meet some plot-holders.
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Where are you, catherton, maybe some of the allotments on here are close to you ? :)
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Hello catherton2, welcome to A4A.
It's pretty much essential that allotments are local because of the need for regular (several times a week) tending in the growing season, so it's an unusual thing to talk about staying over on an allotment. That said, the 1969 Thorpe Report recommended something very much along these lines, allowing shalets in a similar way to many continental European countries.
Sheds on allotments have an architecture all of their own, being traditionally built from whatever was available free, though much more often now you see B&Q pre-fabs, and some sites stipulate design and construction standards, and some sites don't allow sheds at all.
The site hut is an important central asset of many sites, useds variously as the sites shop, for tea facilities, and as a meeting place. It has a central role in site community.
The site loo is possibly the most important site asset because many of the allotmenteering demographic can't manage long without one and a lack of a site loo will exclude them from allotmenteering. Mains drainage is often not available so variations of the earth closet are becoming popular with a couple of firms doing a supply and installation for around the £10k mark.
Tell us a bit more about what you're after and I hope you get some more response.
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So these are going to be like "premier allotments" where the only thing not premier is the price?
Well I like the idea of an alternative greenhouse. It would have to be tall enough to stand in. Small enough not to take up too much growing/drinking/composting space but big enough to hold all the useful cr** over winter. It would have to be vandal proof, not rot or deteriorate for 20 years and not scare off the wild life that makes the allotment so relaxing.
Best you pop and speak to the locals and take a few cans for the chat.
Bill
P.S spell checker is a useful tool which i only use when i think it is important i get the right point across.
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What they said and......allotment plots are getting smaller. Our site has divided two plots and is offering 'starter plots' around 3x4m so portable grow walls but are not solid or are transparent.
I do think that the best designer for an allotment is the plotholder.
I would like to know why uni lecturers are all so focussed on allotment spaces for course work?
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well said AJ, cannot believe this is real, normally I wouldn't care if people can spell or not or even have basic writing skills but I can hardly believe this - why would you want to re-design an allotment area - strange
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oh dear ...
(LMAO)
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Thanks for the useful comments, and the sarcastic one's to, just to let you know im a dyslexic student so that was a massive confidence boost. Just to clarify i got the assignment properly today and have my first review tomorrow to discuss my idea's. From what you have said the idea's suggested to me from my tutors and the brief handout, the information provided is over the top and unnecessary for allotments. The general idea i have in mind is a technical shed housing a small equipment room, greenhouse, toilet and somewhere to stay if needed (this is brief required and out of my hands). The project must also be environmentally friendly using thermal technology to heat the space. I have visited the local allotment this afternoon and spoken to a couple of people who basically explained the same idea's as have been posted in this thread. After i have had my tutorial tomorrow morning i shall come back with any information or idea's suggested again to see how they fare in your opinions after all you have a better insight into this then my self or my tutors would.
Thank you for any advice and ill try to be a little more careful next time i post.
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Hello Catherton2 and welcome.
It seems to me that you have more insight into allotments than your tutors! I know in the Scandinavian countries that a lot of people have allotment gardens or summer houses/ gardens where they can stay over at the weekend.
I think it is pretty unheard of in this country, and would not be allowed on the vast majority.
Maybe you could research what happens in other countries if you have time. I remember an article in the National Society of Allotment Gardeners about this but that would be about 6 years ago. I think that some of the "Russian" countries are the same.
Good luck with your project and your degree. Having dyslexia must make it harder for you, but you have got so far so good on you.
PS I've got a sofa, stove and calor gas cooker on my plot! but never spent the night there. Loo is an ice cream pot which gets chucked on the compost heap!
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We are fortunate to get a toilet from Birmingham Coucil let alone anything else
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We don't don't have a loo on our allotment - it was suggested but the increase in rents to cover killed enthusiasm. Anyway, what's wrong with a bucket in the shed - brilliant compost accelerator.
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Interesting to think about a requirement to sleep over.
Putting aside the questions / comments around whether people would be allowed to sleep on site, I suggest that you consider the demographics of the people who may be using the site very carefully.
In the interest of space, you may want to consider lots of 'dual purpose' furniture, such as sofa beds to make the best use of the space that you have.
Personally, I'd be very happy sleeping in a hammock, which you can obviously put up quickly, and take down if not required.
Also, I often take my wee ones with me to site, so you'd have to think about toddler beds / baby cots / bunk beds to cater for children. This then opens up a whole can of worms with child proofing the space.
If people will be on-site for long periods (over 24 hours) you'll also have to think about cooking facilities, along with toilets (which have already been mentioned) and food storage / preparation areas.
Hope that gives you some interesting things to think about.
I've seen mini-chalets on sites in Germany, and always thought that it was to prevent the need to drive home after a lovely summer evening drinking schnapps with your gardening friends.
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Hi catherton 2, welcome to the forum.
I'm glad that you are being asked to consider future planning of allotment sites as part of your architecture course.
I think you should concentrate on the site hut as this is probably the one building on site that needs proper planning.
some ideas for you to consider..............
ground source heating
PV cells / battery for 12v lighting
red cedar cladding
composting toilet ( built in, but with separate access from outside the main building)
site shop space, tea-making facilities ( very important)
notice board ( inside and out)
p.s., ignore the pedants on here, as someone with a dyslexic wife (with a degree in fine art) I know the problems dyslexic folk can have with the educational curriculum.
good luck with the assignment, and let us know how you progress.
rgds, Tony
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Cheers i'll keep all of that in mind and see what my tutor says, one of the idea's he decribed to us involved changing the allotments into a single allotment for shared use. which i have interpreted to mean having designated area's for certain growth and other parts for others, with this i could in some way design special area's that are specaly adapted to the growth of that indervidual plant, and maybe bring in the possibility of growing plant that haven't been seen on allotments before. So people would be able to shar their space?
On your local allotment would this work? There's always the problem of somone being to greedy or talking other peoples stuff i guess?
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Welcome Catherton,
I just wanted to second what Tony said about dyslexia. My elder son left school without a single qualification, (apart from an A* in Causing Trouble in Class ;))
He taught himself to read after leaving school, went to college, then uni and is now doing a PhD in guess what......... dyslexia!
He also runs a very successful website for dyslexic people and their families.
Good luck with your assignment, it will be interesting to see how you get on, please keep us informed.
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Hi Catherton,
Ignore the snipes on here. We normally have a rule that we don't pick holes in posts but I guess that doesnt apply to newbies asking unusual questions ;)
For me the shared space thing for growing is a complete non starter. There are many reasons for having a plot and for me, having my own personal space is paramount. We all garden in different ways - some organic - some not, rasied beds v open ground, organised v chaotic etc and I dont see how that would work if we all garden a shared space. On my site it just wouldnt work - some have been tilling the same plot for 50 years and I cant see them givng up thier own plot for a shared space. If you were starting from scratch then maybe it could be made to work. Also I think its preferable aesthetically to have a good mix - I dont really want to see all raspberries in one area and corn in another.
On a more positive note I believe it's a good idea to look at this from a design perspective but bear in mind that there is in reality no money!!
Mainly what Tony says below - the communial areas are important. Hut/Toilet/notice boards/area for bbqs/small shared space with area we can have as a swap shop for unwanted veg/place for shared equipment.
Good luck!
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Pedants Tone, did u mean peasants :P
Tone and BN have just about got it spot on, but if your assignment aims towards shared allotments, then plan in facility's for disability, raised beds, wider paths etc.
The live in accommodation as said would be in Scandinavian country's, we have a few on here from Denmark so they might pop in, all the best. ;D
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I kind of like the "Russian Datcha" direction - a little chalet where you could sleep over on starry nights. Why not?
Obviously an allotment is the perfect self-sustaining environment. What I take onto the plot stays on the plot. So we are looking at composting toilets, solar panels or wind energy, what about driving the project around use of recycled materials?
Also think of original ways to store water?
Actually we have a communal shed but it's half falling down and really only used for meetings. If people are having BBQs and such they either pull out their own tables or use the one picnic table we have.
On our site we have the obligatory Pétanque ground (in France there must be one as this is one of the fave summer sports), a loo that flushes (we are on mains water), a handicapped zone with a raised growing area suitable for wheelchair users (never actually seen it used but someone is growing stuff in it!).
Maybe all that gives you ideas.
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p.s., ignore the pedants on here, as someone with a dyslexic wife (with a degree in fine art) I know the problems dyslexic folk can have with the educational curriculum.
good luck with the assignment, and let us know how you progress.
rgds, Tony
no-one has said anything about people who have so called dyslexia - from my point of view I question the validity of a project for someone who isn't interested in allotments - so I'll keep out of it - and for the record people are people first and not to be described by their less ableness first
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Interesting to think about a requirement to sleep over.
I wouldnt have been too keen to sleep in my allotment shed last winter at -16C.
I cant see why anyone would want to, when you have a nice warm bed at home.
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The idea of a shared site is really interesting if you look at the pre-enclosure origins of the allotment movement. Before the enclosure movement the agricultural landscape of England was very open with people working their own strips in a big common field. The enclosures dispossessed the owners of the smallest holdings who were then allowed to work part of an allotment for the labouring poor which was usually managed by the church wardens - the word allotment comes from the enclosure movement.
Like BarriedaleNick says, I can't see a communal field being at all popular, but it's not such a good idea from an agricultural point of view either because monocultures tend to amplify pests, whereas intermixed planting which you get on an allotment sites tends to some extent to hide vulnerable crops behind less vulnerable ones.
Many allotment sites have no mains electricity so designing an off-grid communal hut would be a good start. There's solar in the summer of course, but you might want to think about a bio-digester too. Plenty of folk potter around their allotments in the dead of winter as well so the hut needs to be thermally very efficient, and how about some hazel coppice to fire a stove.
Space is increasingly scarce on allotment sites so think about a green froof that can be cropped. And if drainage considerations allow it might help if it was half burried to reduce any shadow and improve the thermal efficiency - it would make access to the green roof easier too.
Best of all is if you could come up with a design that could be virtually free to build - allotmenteers love free stuff. Think about building from compacted earth of clay is available, and used car tyres have been used for earth-filled construction too. Don't gorget thatch either - we can grow that kind of thing on an allotment and it's quite thermally efficient too.
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It's pretty much essential that allotments are local because of the need for regular (several times a week) tending in the growing season, so it's an unusual thing to talk about staying over on an allotment. That said, the 1969 Thorpe Report recommended something very much along these lines, allowing shalets in a similar way to many continental European countries.
It used to be common on my site; most plots had a summerhouse. The wealthier tenants (the plots were let on long leases so people invested in them) often had brick, the hoi polloi had wood. People used to spend their weekends there. A couple of people lived on site during the Blitz, and it probably still happens occasionally now. My predecessor on my plot slept in the shed every time he had a row with his wife, and the first thing I did was burn his horrible smelly mattress. By that time the plot had been empty for a while, and it had got well and truly mouldy.
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After showing my tutor the comments and idea's suggested and the hole that had been poked in the breif he wasn't the umm happiest person. Im suppose to think more along the line of the allotment of the future, instead of trying to accomidate for today's users. In my oppinion thats his way of defending his breif but ill go along with it, the general idea's im going to think about are the prospect of inserting some form of social hub upon the sit somwhere for people to meet chat get information have a cup of tea or couple of drinks on the night, it will also include a small amount of sleeping accomidation. I shall also be including some form of alternative green houses that could be specially designed for the growth of different plants and veg not usualy seen on allotments these area's would be shared between tennants wishing to experiment on new idea's. Aswell i shall also be looking at the layout and design of existing allotments keeping them as indervidual spaces so allotmenters can personalise to their own taste.
If any of you have any idea's or feedback then please let me know, this could be any improvments just generally what you think. Also are there any types of plants or veg you wish you could grow but can't because of the british climit? my tutor suggested chilly but i havent had chance to look into this yet. just to say this isnt descriminating but the project site is located in preston so it isnt the sunniest location.
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I bet some sites already have solar power,id love to see it on ours one day in the distant future!
You can tell your tutor from me he really needs to do a bit of research before giving you your brief,we all grow chillies already very successfully in our greenhouses or even at home on windowsills!
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haha ill let him know! looks like im gonna have to be a little more inventive and get my head into some research after iv done these drawings. Cheers for the quick reply.
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there's even a part of this forum dedicated to growing Chilli
http://www.allotments4all.co.uk/smf/index.php/board,38.0.html
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The point is you have to realise the function of an allotment is different for each person. My criteria s that i have to be able to harvest vegetables somewhere near to to the value of of what i spend on the allotment in a year, hence the object is to do it with minimal cost.
Other people use it as a hobby, and dont mind if its not strictly economic.
The point for me would be i wouldnt pay for fancy greenhouses or summerhouse etc, because it would take years to recoup the costs. If the owners paid for such things, they would have to bang the rent up to recober there costs, also making it economically unviable.
Allotments are not a thing that require vast amounts of money spending on them, thats not the point of them.
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i understand that completly cost is everything no one is going to pay for this kind of improvment out of their own pocket, but at the same time i need to come up with a desing that isnt all about cost efficency my project and from what i can tell everyone else in my class is basing the project on the fact that the local council would pay (not that, that is ever going to happen well not my local council anyway) the reson for assuming this is that my project is all about changing the allotments into that sort of thing i couldnt just go to my review without a change and say that i didnt want to do anything because of the cost implications.
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yes you need to think about future allotments, rather than present ones, because much of what you want to do is difficult or probably not allowed.
Remember you have council provided (public) and private allotments and the rules are different. Strictly speaking planning permission is required for a shed or a greenhouse on a council plot but some councils let you put sheds up without planning permission so long as they don;t have a permanent base; some require you get planning permission for any shed, and maybe some don't allow any sheds at all - like in an Area of Outstanding Snootiness
councils themselves can of course build anything they want..so there's your communal hut maybe
on private sites of course first it's down to the rules of the owner, then planning permission
here's a sample set of rules for allotmenteers
http://www.thurrock.gov.uk/environment/allotments/content.php?page=regulations (http://www.thurrock.gov.uk/environment/allotments/content.php?page=regulations) note -staying in your shed is specifically not allowed
and personally i think a council provided area with some sleeping arrangement is absolutely ghastly, not to say unhygienic (and open to abuse) :)
if you want ideas for new things on the plot, there's always the greenhouse made out of recycled plastic bottles, that ticks all the boxes.....
http://www.shedworking.co.uk/2008/10/recycled-plastic-bottle-sheds.html (http://www.shedworking.co.uk/2008/10/recycled-plastic-bottle-sheds.html),
which would not allowed for instance under the rules for these allotments
http://tinyurl.com/East-Herts-Council (http://tinyurl.com/East-Herts-Council)
as for new veg, i think Leeds University used to have a project for trying to grow winter crops from the Indian subcontinent as summer crops here, so that would be probably okra, aubergine, chickpeas maybe, and the dreaded bitter gourd.
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How about being different to your 'council, ie taxpayer will pay' colleagues. Allotment(eers)s could theoretically create income for innovations themselves - selling produce, expertise eg growing 'lessons', loads of things.
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Ok time to think outside the box.
We grow in soil. How about looking at hydroponics and building a structure to accommodate growing area with appropriate sun levels and supply the appropriate nutrients from a central supply.
Workout the growing area required to feed a family of say 5 and then split up the current area so that we have increased growing areas for more "allotmenteers".
The structure will have to cater for different sized vegetables and probably could house "allotmenteers" below ground so that the plants will not lose out on sunshine and rain/fresh air. You will need to consider a "funnel" structure so that the air never stays still over the plants (care of blight etc.)
A structure to retain water will be required.
There back in the box again, off for a pint. Just need to spellcheck before I go.
Bill
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Catherton, I am not sure I understand what you are after.
I am in Canada, was on a UK allotment till a couple of years ago then returned here. Our allotments are a little different to most UK ones.
We have a comminity hut which stores all the tools for everyone to use.
Our plots are our own of course but we do also have a community area.
This is fenced off from ther rest of the plots and is used by various groups and individuals not growing strictly for themselves.. they grow for the food bank or soup kitchens etc.We have a large grenhouse on there that is my job, it grows plants for all to use.
We also have fruit areas,. trees and shrubs with all manner of fruit. these are all over the green areas of the gardens and are for anyone to use, wether a plot holder or visitor. The plots are in a Heritage Park and wildlife sanctuary so we get lots of folds walking through. They leave the individual plots alone but folks do pick the fruit and berries in the common areas.
We also have an area with a summerhouse, it is often used by groups , often a large marquis is put up, but no one sleeps over.
Just a slightly different view.
Good luck with your project.. as you can see my spelling and grammer are terrible, I can spell I just can't type so your writing looks great to me!!
XX Jeannine
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I've seen shared community gardens before - there was one in Brockwell Park in Brixton. You could go along and join them, and either grow things or help them with what was already there. Being raised a typical Western individualist, I couldn't get my head round it. I went twice, found them a little cliquey and never went back! However I know this is my failing not theirs. :) I am a communal, socialist type with my brain, but my heart loves my little plot of earth which is my dominion! ;D
Found your post about the history of it really interesting, Unwashed.
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I think this planning brief is to look at communal gardening rather than individual plots for personal use.
Much along the lines of what is going on as described here
http://www.growveg.com/growblogpost.aspx?id=73 (http://www.growveg.com/growblogpost.aspx?id=73)
Growing crops which are not normally grown in our climate is nothing new remember folks Victorian gardens where they would grow any number of exotic things. The interesting part of this project is how you would do what the Victorians did but in a more fuel efficient / sustainable way.
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Ok time to think outside the box.
We grow in soil. How about looking at hydroponics and building a structure to accommodate growing area with appropriate sun levels and supply the appropriate nutrients from a central supply.
Workout the growing area required to feed a family of say 5 and then split up the current area so that we have increased growing areas for more "allotmenteers".
The structure will have to cater for different sized vegetables and probably could house "allotmenteers" below ground so that the plants will not lose out on sunshine and rain/fresh air. You will need to consider a "funnel" structure so that the air never stays still over the plants (care of blight etc.)
A structure to retain water will be required.
There back in the box again, off for a pint. Just need to spellcheck before I go.
Bill
you can also do hydroponics in a porous medium such has perlite, fytocell or coco fibre.
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Actually a design for a community shed would be a great idea. Once of the most essential things for allotments is that it should be very cheap. Hanging space for tools and stacking space for canes and hazels (at least 8 or 9 ft tall).
Perhaps a design for a portable ie small composting toilet.
Also growing walls, so there is extra usage of the space.
Perhaps design for a roof top allotment system or a dual use building which can have an allotment on the side or on a set of sloped steps.
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Our site has had experience of a 'designer' ( the reason for my initial ...oh dear' post) We had some funds towards some disabled raised beds and approached the council for assistance as they are under an obligation to provided if a need was identified, they declared they could find some funds (2006) , and proceeded to set to with a designer.... The result some thought to be a joke, but turned out to be a waste of time and taxpayers money... the design included , a cranberry wetland... a butterfly garden, a nut hedge , pear trees in the car-park, along with other un-workable stuff, oh ..and a couple of raised beds, (new sleepers). our membership turned it down. on grounds of cost, maintenance and being inappropriate for an allotment, we asked for a sows ear and got a silk purse...we eventually got a grant and did-it-ourselves. In general I would suggest an area that could be improved nationwide would be provision of a (secure ) site hut / meeting room with facilities .
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a cranberry wetland ;D
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Have been thinking about the allotment of the future, have you seen the zoo I think it pay be paignton who have an amazing system of plants on mini paternoster type system to grow greens.
I also want a house with glass on the south facing roof so I can have a growing space up there. We are wasting a lot of potential growing space.
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Hi catherton2 welcome and good luck with your project. Have you checked out alltments in the Netherlands, lots of them have huts where people go and spend the weekend and tend their garden?
re veg that I'd want to grow but can't cos we're in the UK - basically the main problem(as I see it) is low light levels in winter (think latitude), or veg that needs a long growing season, you can do it but its a struggle. So maybe think about how you could extend the growing season
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sorry for the absence with it being the easter holiday i went back home and with a bit of spare time i decided to get overtime at work earn a bit of spenidng money. The project is progressing nicely gonna have another review on tuesday and thursday next week. And hopefully i shall get some news that im on the right track. Thank you for all the information had a spare hour this morning so i went though it all! if i get chance before mydeadlines ill try n scan some drawings in t get your feed back of plans!
cheers again guys you have been a massive help overall!
chris
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would love to see the plans :)
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Hi Catherton2
Brainstorming:
* A secure boundary system (anti-climb) that also can be planted with productive crops (living wall fencing kind of thing). Could have integral irrigation system.
* A stand-alone off-grid climate-controlled module where tenants can leave surplus seedlings/seeds/produce for others to use. A sort of posh cool-box. Maybe combined with notice board
* Off grid modular transportable building system.
*Eco frost protection - device collects and concentrates passive heat, then when it senses frost, releases it to create a mini heat island.
*Street lamp-sized growlights on each plot. With a webcam built in.
Better stop now- it's getting mad ;D
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just submitted the work this morning for my tutors to go though i have my meeting later in the day where they will give their oppintions, i took on board all ideas for the indervidual green house/allotments. We will see what they think, one system i went for was a modified roof pond which iv changed to deal with britsh weather. If i designed it right it should provide more heat to the green house plus water vapour to transform the space into a more tropical climate.
ill let you all know how the review goes and wat they consider changing!
cheers again guy you have been a great help :)
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Don't forget availability of water - irrigation, conservation and transportation - that in itself could occupy all your attention.
Also, and I guess this does not apply to every site but certainly is a consideration for many, remember parking and access. If people are more than a few hundred yards away they will probably need access with a car and maybe a trailer, plus somewhere to park.
I suppose you could look at communal composting though, with an area where everyone adds their garden waste to a central pile, it can be turned in one go (maybe with a machine) and everyone gets some of the finished product. But that would again homogenise the process which is probably varied between plot owners. I just thought that water, garden waste, parking and compost are all pretty vital and common to all/most plot holders.
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communal composting is an interesting idea, as the larger the pile the more heat is generated. But then I guess you need to follow that up with how to manage it!
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Don't forget availability of water - irrigation, conservation and transportation - that in itself could occupy all your attention.
Also, and I guess this does not apply to every site but certainly is a consideration for many, remember parking and access. If people are more than a few hundred yards away they will probably need access with a car and maybe a trailer, plus somewhere to park.
Remember that folks wanting to get a decently sized rotavator and a ton or two of manure will be driving a long-wheelbase Transit towing a graked trailer the size of a horsebox.... that's wht will need to get through the entrance.... the entrance at my plot is so tight I have to swing out onto the verge on the opposite side, disconnect the trailer, two-point turn to get my nose into the gate, reattach the trailer and then drive on.... I always use a lot of verge on the way out too..... If the gate was a foot wider adn they'd indented it a foot or so (not hard with what they made ot from) then none of thiis would be neccessary....
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Dunno about Catherine but I've really enjoyed reading this thread.
Thanks - and good luck with the assignment
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right guys n gals i finished and handed the final work in on friday the 13th which is a bit unlucky, but iv received the email confirming a pass woop woop, i got a 2.1 which is kinda like a B, realy couldn't of completed the work to the level i did without your help, your all amazing some of the ideas you gave realy gave me somthing to research into which is never a bad thing. I went in to take my work down off the board so i took a picture before so im gonna try n work out how to post it but i havent got a clue so ill look into it, again thank you you have been a massive help and i love you all ;)
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Thanks catherton2, and best of luck to you.
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congrats on the 2:1 8)
you can load photos to the likes of photobucket, and post links here :)
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Well done - it's because you took the trouble to do some research, you deserve it.
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a cranberry wetland ;D
I lolled at that too, reminded me of Granpa Simpson, "forty years as a night watchman in a cranberry silo"