Allotments 4 All
Produce => Edible Plants => Topic started by: Jeannine on June 21, 2010, 01:13:46
-
I am going to try tomatoes inside through the winter, is anyone else going to try it.
Sunny windowsill, heated greenhouse, under lights , there are many ideas.
I am going for minature plants under lights and windowsills.
Never done this? .. We can all learn together .
Just a bit of fun and a personal challenge to get through the grey days.
We could swap ideas for types, containers, feeding etc.
Perhaps agree to start about the same time.
No contest here, just to support each other.
XX Jeannine
-
I'm very much hoping to have a go using lights. Yayyyyy something to cheer me up during those long winter months ;D
I've got a few different varieties of toms I think might be suitable, although I'm still getting in a knot deciding what lights to get and how and where I put them ::)
I've spotted some containers I may use, I'll post a link later.
-
Am very tempted by this challenge ;D ! Treated myself to a Grow Light garden this year and have been very impressed with the results its given me for this seasons seedlings. Would definitely have to be a dwarf variety, and haven't got anything suitable at the moment so will have to look into this.
-
I've tried MicroToms for 2 winters now and the results have been rubbish! I managed to keep the 2nd lot alive through the last harsh winter (so I am learning) but they have only just given me 2 tiny toms from 6 bushes (actually they are so small they don't qualify as bushes).
They just stopped growing from about November and only started again in May, so I guess its the low light levels here (Wharfedale, Yorkshire). I would have to invest in a light thingy and I am wondering if its really worth it? The cost of one could buy a lot of tomatoes! I know the cost is not everything but there comes a point (even for me) where you expend so much time/energy/electric on them that its getting a bit bonkers?
-
I have a few seeds spare that might be the type you have in mind plot51A, if you would like some to try. What is the maximum height you will be aiming for?
-
I have a few seeds spare that might be the type you have in mind plot51A, if you would like some to try. What is the maximum height you will be aiming for?
Thanks very much JayB. About 12" maximum I think. Have done a bit of a browse and rather fancy trying Red Robin. The Organic gardening catalogue says they tolerate low light levels and are good for winter growing. When would we be sowing - presumably not for a while yet?
-
I'll join in. ;D
I start the chillies etc under lights anyway; I need to refine my set up, so this project will (hopefully) motivate me.
-
Plot51, I'm glad you fancy trying some Red Robin ;D, I'll pm tomorrow.
As for when to sow, I was thinking of starting some time in August, but will probably try and stagger a few sowings so they don't all ripen together. I may be wrong, but I'm sure Jeannine will keep us on track.
I'm growing some Red Robin at the mo, which are just starting to ripen, I'll have to check but I think they were sown in Jan. They are the first of my mini's sown at that time to be ripening. Hope thy taste ok ;D
Yayyyy Sholls, has to be tried, any ideas what you fancy growing? When will you be starting your chillies?
-
Hi all, what a super response..so following on and presuming some of us don't know which types are suitable..take a look at
http://tatianastomatobase.com
read the database about dwarfs/containers and then take a look at her tomatoes for sale, again at dwarfs/ conatiners, you may already have some suitable seeds.
By the way I can vouch for tatiana, she in Internationally known, is very good on price and postage , extremely quick to mail,and is also as super lady. I met her this year when I moved back to this part of Canada as she lives 10 minutes from me.I feel sure others would back me up.
.
The site gives loads on info and there is time to get seeds from her if need be.
XX Jeannine
-
Hey Jayb, you know much more about toms than I do ;D Iam a squash grower don't forget!!
I think we should all put our heads together and figure out a good time to start, I agree with August. The type of toms we will be growing will all be determinate(bush)ones which the are the types that will all fruit at the same time so we might want to consider staggering sowing dates times OR growing a selection of varieties that mature at different times.
Spread as well as height be important if growing under lights, so I think avoiding such as Tumbler, Whippersnapper, Anmore Treasures might be sensible, they only grow up to 18ins or so but are very bushy, they may however be OK for someone where width doesn't matter, ot would to me I think under my lights set up.
Types with rugosa leaves might be a good idea as they are strong and self support well, Patio is a common one that springs to mind.
To newbies out there, jump right in, if this sounds like Greek to you, don't hesitate asking. Don't be left out cos you think you don't know enough,this is a learning thing for many of us.
Take a look at the link above, maybe some of us will be able to share some seeds if we see what we all have.
XX Jeannine
-
Hi all, what a super response..so following on and presuming some of us don't know which types are suitable..take a look at
http://tatianastomatobase.com
read the database about dwarfs/containers and then take a look at her tomatoes for sale, again at dwarfs/ conatiners, you may already have some suitable seeds.
By the way I can vouch for tatiana, she in Internationally known, is very good on price and postage , extremely quick to mail,and is also as super lady. I met her this year when I moved back to this part of Canada as she lives 10 minutes from me.I feel sure others would back me up.
.
The site gives loads on info and there is time to get seeds from her if need be.
XX Jeannine
I can vouch for Tatiana, she's very well respected in the tomato world.
-
I'd love to partake in this project, however right now it's impossible for me. The major downside of my house isit's windows face due east and west, there is no sunny windowledge in the entire house.
-
Put pot on East and move to West later in the day,follow the sun :D
ALL my windows face North so no place to move to..
XX Jeannine
-
Hey Jayb, you know much more about toms than I do ;D
XX Jeannine
I very much doubt that ;D , I'm just happy to love toms in all forms ;D
-
Put pot on East and move to West later in the day,follow the sun :D
ALL my windows face North so no place to move to..
XX Jeannine
No-one is at home at the crucial point and alas it would still result in very little exposure as the sun spends about 90% of the day casting no direct light into my house. In winter it casts no light into my west windows because of the houses across the road and the hill behind them.
Lights might work to supplement daylight, but I am concerned about the cost. I tried to overwinter a tomato plant by re-rooting suckers concurrently, but it failed because my house is too cold.
-
Mmm, anyone got ideas for amphibian. The lights I use are very low in terms of electricity.
XX Jeannine
-
I might have sounded negative in a previous post but I would love to have toms through the winter. Just that I expended so much time/money so far to little success.
Anyway, do you think its really possible without lights?
-
Yes, I have done it without any additional light, best was in a big bay window facing South.
I did it last year and used a regular light, they stretched a bit but I did get fruit from Patios and a couple more.
Just a bit of fun.
This year I have got seeds specially for the purpose, some do well in lower than usual light.
XX Jeannine
-
How are folks doing with their choices,, do you need help to decide. I can give a list of maybes and Jayb has some great ideas too.
We need to decide what height of plant,size of pot needed for that plant, extimated time to maturity might help..air movement for pollination.. anything I have forgotten anyone.
Oh yes dates to go... or staggered.
XX Jeannine
-
Yes please Jeannine a list would be useful. I think I've got totem & minibel, will check.
-
We have a very light family room with french doors and velux's. I plan to make the tomato plant a feature and will be using a large pot. Any suggestions for a sizeable plant? Hight is no issue, as we have about 12' ceilings.
-
I might have sounded negative in a previous post but I would love to have toms through the winter. Just that I expended so much time/money so far to little success.
Anyway, do you think its really possible without lights?
I’m wondering if no extra lighting is available, if producing a compact tomato plant with the bottom trusses just starting to ripen as it needs to be brought in, might be the way to go? I thought Tommy Toe might be worth a try as it is not too tall. Not so much actively getting it to flower and set fruit throughout winter but more getting the plant to ripen fruit for some time?
-
Javaheart, what about Sungold? It is a super performer, pretty much the first to start cropping and also the last to be ripening fruit into Autumn.
-
Right here goes nothing,but I do fancy a go .
I want to see how far I could go with natural light(easy said on a bright day like today)I have some lovely 'house plant' type toms
outside at the mo and will check the label and give them ago ,maybe two sowings.
I will post seed name later.
-
Height for me is an issue as I have practically no natural ligt facing North so under lights I go.
Therefore I am sticking to real littlies on my top shelf up to about 15 inches tops,then by taking out my second shelf I can go to about 30 inches by planting on the bottom.
Still trying to decide about which varieties.In the running and some maybees are
Chibikko
Hahm'sGelbe Topftomate ..definate
Top shelf
Red Robin]
Tiny Tim
Yellow Canary
Micro Gemma
Spiridonovoskie
Extreme Bush
Yellow Pygmy
Mohamed
Demidov
Minibel
Polyaenye
Floragold Basket
Shtambovy Kaetofelnolistny
Budai Torpe
Totem
Lucky Leprechaun
Yaponskiy Karlik
Golden Swarf Champion
Dwarf Champion Improved..red
Usual proble, too many choices , not enough space. the smaller light fitting is useful for a spreading type.
XX Jeannine
-
I thought I'd share these pictures of Red Robin, shame I picked the few ripe toms before I thought to take a photo ::)
Taste is better than I was expecting, not very sweet but a nice bit of tomato tang :) One for me to try this winter ;D
[attachment=1]
[attachment=2]
-
I've just looked that one up & it says 30cms. What height has yours made Jayb please. That's about 13" which would be ideal for me.
-
Just under 9'', I put a ruler in the second picture to show but its not as clear as it could have been :)
-
Thanks Jayb, even better, count me in ;).
-
Wow, that is great. I am doing that one for sure.Thanks Jayb.
I found another one today called Far North, has anyone grown this one?
XX Jeannine
-
Jeannine I do love your setup it looks super :)
I'm wondering if anyone can help, if I got a T5 light would I want blue or red bulbs or both?
-
Balconi Red - I may also root some side shoots in September.
-
Still trying to cut down on the choices, anyone else made up there mind.
Not tomatoes but we picked 2 beautiful Tom Thumb lettuces today that were grown completely under lights, they were perfect.
We have 2 small green tomatoes on a mini plant that has been under the lights since birth.
Now my tomatoes through the winter comments will also include my salad veggies grown inside.
XX Jeannine
-
Jeannine, just wondering- did all those on your list of toms come recommended for growing under lights?
-
Well no not exactly, some did come with that suggestion but most don't, There is supposed to be a few that can tolerate low light but I have never found any conclusive data on that, not worth filing as I do anyway. I was going mostly by size, I pulled all my small ones out, some I have since decided are too tall for my light fixture without rigging something else up and I don't want to do that this year.
I have room for just one under my smaller light and I think that will be a low growing but widespreading one, possibly Anmore Dewdrop, not sure yet though.I have used this light before with a Tumbler and it works quite well , the pant doesn't get as big as outside in a hanging basket.
I am gradually eliminating ones that grow over 2 feet but am actually aiming for a bit less,I am trying to put a more comprehensive file together focusing on accurate size, then will feel better able to choose but this year might be a bit hit and miss, but there is not much info out there. However I will carry on for now.
Do you have any ideas yet?
Maybe I should rewrite the list with what heights I have and perhaps others can add to it.
XX Jeannine
-
It soundsvery interesting :D
-
I'm wondering if anyone can help, if I got a T5 light would I want blue or red bulbs or both?
I'm planning on getting a 6700K one, that's the colour temperature my compact fluorescents are and they worked just fine for me last winter. Most manufacturers have the emission spectra of their tubes online, if I remember correctly my 6700K cfl's had a good output near the main absorption peak of chlorophyll-b. (Edit: That's towards the blue end of the spectrum).
-
Thanks Sholls, I'll have another look, trouble is I've come across LED grow lights now!
-
My thoughts so far, other people may have different results/thoughts.
Not more than 6-8’’
Vilma, ok crop, flavour, nothing to write home about.
Red Robin, under 6’’, producing masses of fruit for its size. Lovely shiny round red fruit, taste is ok.
Under 10’’
Minibel, good crop forming, healthy looking plant
Ditmarsher,a trailer and so far my favourite, an abundance of small pink grape cherries, quite sweet, early to produce.
Tiny Tim about 18’’ good set just starting to ripen.
Under 2’
Golden Dwarf, Victorian Dwarf, Lucky Leprechaun and Yaponskiy Karlik, all have a good crop coming along.
30'' Polish Dwarf, as above
Maskotka is producing well, fruit is tasty and is a tomato I would grow again although I doubt for winter planting as a tad too boisterous for that. Great for summer tubs though.
Hundreds and Thousands, small, sweet and tangy, again too large a plant for me for winter garden.
-
How about Garden Pearl?.... I've got some of these in pots ATM and they're tiny little things that are disappearing under their flower trusses...
chrisc
-
Garten Pearle is a bit too wide for my single light XX Jeannine
-
Help needed please
I've been having a trawl around and I'm wondering about these;
http://www.greenhousesensation.co.uk/product-range/holiday-proof-planters-1/quadgrow-octogrow-1.html
http://www.ctledlight.co.uk/catalog/3/ledgrowlights
Not sure which size lights so will probably email them, but any thoughts?
-
Hi Jayb, I have toyed with the idea of getting a LED panel about 30 inches square a mix of red and blue bulbs but I really shouldn't. I am not sure where I would put it. John bought my light fixture as a surprise ..had I known what he was planning I might have gone this route. I have heard very good things about them. Amazon US is where I might have got one from or even Amazon CA except they don't usually have the range of the US site.
XX Jeannine
-
Thanks Sholls, I'll have another look, trouble is I've come across LED grow lights now!
Yes, I was considering getting my soldering iron out last winter, it might yet happen. ;D I do have a small blue LED array with an Edison screw fitting, it was good at stopping the seedlings from becoming leggy, but the plants soon outgrew the area it illuminated.
On the tomato front, I'm in with:-
Chibikko
Shtambovy Kaetofelnolistny
Hahm'sGelbe Topftomate
Micro Tom
I've already got Micro Tom and the other three are on order from Tatiana. I might give more a try depending on space, but for now I'm trying to exercise restraint. ;) (It won't last long... )
-
I thimk I will pop down and see Tatiana, I am curious if her UK sales have gone up recently LO XX Jeannine
-
Mmm, I like your choices Sholls and think I will be growing some of those too. I still haven't managed to shortlist what I'm growing yet, although I've decided to scrub Tiny Tim and Vilma from the running. I've yet to put in an order for lights, maybe later today :P
Anyone else know what they are growing yet?
-
No, I have been waiting to see what you are doing ;D
We should get our heads together and go over each one we have, I have lots and I know you do so we could knock some off the list. Why have you bumped off Tiny Tim and Vilma.
I am knocking off anything over 18 inches I think or I have to buy another light or take a shelf out of mine.
Still temped by the other light though
Oh the pressure :-\
XX Jeannine
-
;D I've been super lucky to have been sent some fantastic varieties, which makes it even harder to choose :o
Grown this summer;
Tiny Tim, love the name, been easy to grow, good crop and is a little top heavy with fruit (as are most of the others ), had my first few ripe toms with loads more to come, just for me, not that tasty.
Vilma very compact, similar in growth and habit to Red Robin, again very easy to grow and looks very cute, for its size lots of lovely toms, but RR has the edge on flavour.
I'm just waiting on a few dwarfs to ripen and have a taste, for me Polish dwarf will be out due to it being too tall. I think some of the other 'dwarfs' are over 18'' Are you counting from soil up or including the pot height?
Soon as I can I'll check some more heights and growth habits and report back, it may help rule in or out.
LIGHTS I will decide soooooooooooooooon
-
Height including pots, which I know really cuts down on my chances, I might have to re think things XX Jeannine
-
I thimk I will pop down and see Tatiana, I am curious if her UK sales have gone up recently LO XX Jeannine
She's certainly efficient. 8) The seeds have arrived, that's a four day turn around.
-
Actually she is probably the best person to ask which types are better for our purpose, maybe I will check with her. I would be curious to see what sort of light set up she has.
XX Jeannine
-
I have to question why you are doing this.
If you need artificial lighting to grow a crop (although a handlefull of tomatoes hardly qualifies as a crop) it must be very special or valuable in some way?
In environmental terms it makes no sense whatsoever. A light powered by electricity generated by fossil fuels in the middle of winter is fine when???
Don't do it! Eat swede, sprouts, leeks, etc. and look forward to the summer! Don't add to global warming.
-
Not everything can be explained in environmental terms so it doesn't always need to make sense to everybody.
I can only answer for myself. Why am I doing this..because I am interested is growing out of season in order to be able to enjoy something more than a few weeks of the year.
A crop to me is obviously different to a crop to you, if it is big enough for my needs it is a crop.
Lights powered by electricity generated by fossil fuels in the middle of winter are fine when they are capable of producing edible food for a family, especially when one member of that family is not able to eat swede,sprouts, or leeks, or are you suggesting my husband should eat what he cannot just to save the power.
We do not smoke, do not drink, do not gamble, we are pacifists and we are very careful with the environment.We recycle every single thing we can, my husband walks wherever he can , we abhor waste,we give 10% of our income to charity, and support two foster children in Kenya,surely we can eat a few salad veggies out of season without being made to feel guilty .We don't even leave the TV or pooter on stand by. We recycle everything from potato peelings to aluminum foil, we even wash and reuses zippies,and we return excess packaging back to the supermarket.I think we do more than our bit to preserve the earth and it's resources we are also helping care for humanity.
The lights that grow the food also light the room they are in which is our study it is in constant use, they also heat that room, the heat then flows into the hall and through our living room. We have chosen to keep our apartment a bit cooler than most so we do not use our central heating.It has never been turned on in the 15 months we have lived here.
I realise that the environment is very important but picking veggies up from a supermarket out of season, one that has hundreds of lights blazing surely cannot be much less than using a few low energy fluorescents to light a room ,heat a home and grow food that is safe to eat and healthy wether out of season or not..
I am sure it was not your intention but I am a little offended to answer someone who starts by saying... I have to question you, then tells me I make no sense. then tells me to stop doing something and eat other things that are not liked because I shouldn't add to global warming.
Yes, my tomatoes and fresh picked salad in winter are very important to me, as is cooking a meal, and yes I use an electric oven. Should I stop making my own bread and buy it at the supermarket so I don't use so much electricity at home.
I think we have to be sensible here, certainly save where possible but I don't think that we have to give up everything in order to feel justified to live on this planet. I would not be so impertinent as to tell you what you were doing wrong, at least not without being very sure I was aware of what you were doing right.
We do everything we can to conserve electricity, fuel etc, we even drive a small car for that reason, but sometimes we really do have to be able to make a decision as to what best suits our needs without a guilt trip. I wonder truly how many folk you know who do not heat their house in the winter.
To be able to judge, you really do need to have all the facts.
With respect
XX Jeannine
-
For me I try and be as self-sufficient in fruit and veggies as I can, Fuel costs are something very real to me, I don’t live close to any shops so any shopping entails a journey, the nearest large supermarket is a good ½ hours drive away. This certainly makes me consider how and what I shop for.
Much of what I produce is grown little and often, I try and extend seasons as far as possible growing year round in a polytunnel. I also try and get some things started off early inside and transplant outside when weather is more favourable.
I very rarely buy vegetables and my eating is seasonal. Although most veggies are eaten fresh I do make use of a chest freezer for some fruit and veg. I also make and freeze soups, passata, sauces for pasta and the like, for the cupboard I make jams, chutneys, pickles etc.
But I find it a long time to be without fresh toms, I usually eat the last ones in December and then wait until June/july for my next fix. This year I’m also growing several storage type toms which I hope will support fresh eating a little further.
Last year I gave in and bought some toms during the winter from a supermarket and it got me thinking how I might extend my season.
The lights I’m hoping to get are 45 watts. Although I haven’t worked it out, the running cost seems a reasonable enough compromise to me, although I can understand it may seem daft to others. We all have to make our own evaluation on how we use the worlds precious resources.
What I am hoping to achieve is a modest return of tomatoes grown at home. Not only for the delight of having them to eat fresh during winter but also the fun and excitement that growing them will give me. This will also be an added interest for me during the winter, which I hate, all that dark, cold, wet and wind.
-
Do we have a starting date yet?
-
No, I don't think so. I was thinking in terms of my birthday, 1st week in August, but if growing the real tinies it may be better to stagger the sowing as they don't have huge amounts of fruit.
I am still trying to figure out which ones, has anyone else made up their mind yet ?
I think that might be a good start.. Which are you starting and why!!
I could make a decision more easily with my single light rather than my 3 tier fitting as it only takes one plant, so a Tumbler, Anmore Treasure or something else that grows wide rather than high might be the right thing.
The bigger light I have to take a shelf and light ftting out to give me two tiers then I can have a bit more height, easier said than done..I will natter John later today.
The little one shows an African violet but it can take a much bigger plant, the height can go low and then rise up to about 20 inches, it is computer controlled so it turns the light on and off. It can be programmed to seasons. Bit gimmicky but it was a housewarming gift so I must try to use it.
XX Jeannine
-
I shall be growing Red Robin and Minibel - thanks to Jayb's kindness :)
-
John has taken my lowest light out now so I have only two tiers bit it does give me about 3 foot height on the bottom shelf and my upper one would take a few about 12 inches.My single light will take 1 pot with 1 plant up to 18 inches , so I feel as if I am getting somewhere.
I have been all night working on myn mini plants list.
I could get 6 plants on the top I think so possibly go with the little ones at max 12 inches
Halms Gelbe Topftomate 6 "
Micro Gemma 8"
Mohammed less than 12"
Chibikko 6-12"
Yellow Canary 6-12"
Minibel 6-12"
Red Robin 6-10"
Totem 10-12"
Have to cut back a bit more yet on those but that is a start.
My single lightplant is gong to be something that would normally go in a hanging basket I think
Still working on the taller ones.
Anyone else decided yet.
The four foot light fixture he took out, he is now talking about putting it on the balcony over my salad boxes that are struggling for light.
XX Jeannine
-
Balconi red- from seed and side shoot, no lights(or hope) still it is one way to learn!
-
Just discovered I don't seem to have any minibel. does anyone want to swap a few Xx Jeannine
-
I've got minibel. Would you like me to send you some Jeannine?
-
Ooh yes please.. I was quite sure I had them but no.. do you want me to send something back to you? I have lots of littlies, if you let me know what you have i can send you soemthing different.
XX Jeannine
-
I'll PM you Jeannine. Thank you.
-
I am planting this weekend for under lights.Is anyone going to join me.
Oh and my home made tiny seems to be stable.
It came from a different branch of a Tommy Toe plant where all the toms on it were small. I grew the saved seeds from it this year and I have 6 identical plants..all about 12 inches high. We had early fruit from just a couple of flowers but the pants are loaded with flowers now, they have been grown totally under lights.
Jay B how is your plant going.
The flavour is not bad at all, but I grade everything to my Sungold yardstick.
I aim to keep seeds to share but am still looking for a name.
XX Jeannine