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Produce => Pests & Diseases => Topic started by: Crystalmoon on May 12, 2010, 18:29:46

Title: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Crystalmoon on May 12, 2010, 18:29:46: Hi everyone I am so fed up with cats destroying any attempts I make to grow some veg items at home in my garden - Ive had to remove the raised beds I had & take them to my allotment as the cats kept using them as litter trays last year so all my crops were inedible :'(
Last year I tried netting, fleece & plastic covers but the cats just dug in under it all :o
This year I decided to just grow in small pots in the garden & guess what the cats are trampling on my seedlings, digging in the dirt & using the pots as litter trays even though the pots are only a few inches wide ??? & some of them Ive actually raised off the ground by putting them on benches & an old desk!
They also killed my resident hedgehog as he was coming out of hibernation this year :'( :o
I just dont know what to do to deter them, I have tried all the usual stuff, curry plant etc
Any suggestions?
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: sarah on May 12, 2010, 18:48:40: Are you positive that it is cats? You are right they can be a right pain in the bum but I find it hard to believe that they would go to the bother of digging in such small pots on a raised surface. I might be wrong of course. Is it possible it could be squirrels doing the small pots?
I have always found that if i protect the crop with nets or sticks the cats will find somewhere else.
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Crystalmoon on May 12, 2010, 18:56:05: Hi Sarah, I wish it was squirrels then at least the food would remain edible & I wouldnt have to throw out the fowled compost & keep starting from scratch. Sadly the poos are cat sized & so are the paw prints.
I dont know if its the organic compost I use that attracts them or what as I have a huge garden & they dont poo anywhere else except in my compost, it is wierd
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Duke Ellington on May 12, 2010, 19:04:30: I have one of these in my back garden

http://www.deteracat.co.uk/ultrasonic_cat_deterrent_system.htm

and it has kept the cats away. It has worked for me.
One thing though.....you will still see the cats walk in the garden but most of the time they dont hang around to do anything :-X and if you did purchase one move the sensor around the garden as the cats get wise to it and find a way to avoid the sensor.
I bought mine for £15 last year [special deal at Somerfields] so hunt around for a good price.
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Crystalmoon on May 12, 2010, 19:15:15: Thank you Duke, I had wondered if these items really work when Ive seen them in the past & had convinced myself they probably didnt ::)
I will start looking around for a good price for one. I does slightly worry me that cats start to get wise to it though. I guess I would have to move my veg pots to different areas in the garden & move the sensor with them, maybe that would work
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Crystalmoon on May 12, 2010, 19:16:44: I forgot to say the really wierd thing is that at my allotment which is just a short walk from my home I use the same compost & so far havent had a single cat poo in 3 years ???
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: pigeonseed on May 16, 2010, 20:42:20: Oh I know how you feel! Our next door neighbours have 6 cats and when the sun comes out my garden STINKS!

It's any bare soil that they go for, isn't it? When my garden was all bare soil, I could cover new seedlings with netting or sticks and they would keep off, but as the garden matures, and less and less soil is visible, and I've covered the rest in netting - they've got less choosy, and they climbed into my coldframe!

I doubt it's your special compost. It's more like desperation! If the cat scarer doesnt work, what about leaving them a litter tray and emptying it every few days? But no probably not - they're already happy with all the little litter trays you've supplied!
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Crystalmoon on May 16, 2010, 21:03:03: Hi Pigeonseed Im sorry you have a similar problem, how annoying about your coldframe :(
yep I hardly sat out in my garden at all last summer because of the awful smell, even when I clear the mess up it still seems to leave that lingering whiff :'(
The poxy cats round here dont even restrict their poo to the soil, 9 times out of 10 the morning after Ive cut the lawn I will be 'welcomed' by a pile of poo on my neatly cut grass ::) They only stop using my lawn when I let the grass grow long - sigh >:(
I might actually give your litter tray idea a go ;D
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Jeannine on May 17, 2010, 08:18:56: Zoo Poo, from lions, apparently they are scared of the smell..Lemon extract soaked on a rag and hung up over beds works too but Zoo Poo is the best XX Jeannine
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Marge on May 18, 2010, 13:14:03: I have tried a few things to deter cats (even though I do think they are cute and cuddly 'ahem') and have found the simplest method works best.

Instead of sonic animal deterrents, orange peel that looks manky, or expensive anti cat gels and the like, I decided to try something to make it uncomfortable for Kitty to go near.

I cut lengths of berberis with especially prickly bits and scattered it all over the borders or anywhere where 'presents' might be left. I have found this to be really effective.
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Crystalmoon on May 21, 2010, 09:04:52: Hi Jeannine what a fabulous idea, I do have a Zoo quite near where I live, I will get on to them asap to see if they sell the Tiger poo ;D

Hi Marge, thanks for your suggestion, I dont have any berberis but I could collect up brambles this year dry them out & give them a go

Thanks everyone for all your great suggestions
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Jeannine on May 21, 2010, 09:24:49: My daughter in law works fror the Emmen Zoo in Holland , they sell all types of poo.She told me one day a tiger peed on her and even after changing her clothes before she got home, her cats ran off away from here and stayed away for a few days, so try to get tiger poo or lion or any of the big cats.it truly does work XX Jeannine
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Baccy Man on May 21, 2010, 10:10:35: Quote from: Crystalmoon on May 12, 2010, 19:15:15
Thank you Duke, I had wondered if these items really work when Ive seen them in the past & had convinced myself they probably didnt ::)
I will start looking around for a good price for one. I does slightly worry me that cats start to get wise to it though. I guess I would have to move my veg pots to different areas in the garden & move the sensor with them, maybe that would work

Every study which has been carried out on ultrasonic devices has shown they are ineffective, some may shock an animal briefly when they first hear the noise but it only bothers them for a few seconds but if you heard an unexpected noise you would probably wonder where it came from too.
The 'mosquito' devices they use to keep teenagers from loitering outside shops (essentially the same type of device) was turned into a ringtone (http://www.freemosquitoringtones.org) very popular with kids within weeks of the devices being released, not exactly a good advert for a product designed to repel teenagers.
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: lottie lou on May 21, 2010, 12:44:55: have you tried shortish lengths of hosepipe on the areas? I have heard that cats think they are snakes and avoid the area. Seems to work reasonably well for me.
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Robert_Brenchley on May 21, 2010, 12:52:27: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Silent-Roar-Cat-Deterrent-Repeller-Lion-Manure-Pellets-/230473865769?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_Home_Garden_Garden_Plants_Weed_Pest_Control_CV&hash=item35a9501a29
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: lewic on May 21, 2010, 13:18:50: Are you sure it is cats? Sounds more like foxes than anything else. They are much better diggers and have similar sized poos and paw prints.

And I dont think a cat would kill a hedgehog. They might give it a sniff and bat it lightly out of curiosity, but I think the prickles would put them off. A fox however might..

BTW I used to have a cat that loved using my umbrella plant as a litter tray. Problem was easily solved by putting a paper plate around the base of the plant, with a hole in the middle!
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: reddyreddy on May 21, 2010, 13:55:44: They sell lion poo called silent roar in most garden centres, good luck!
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: telboy on May 21, 2010, 21:15:25: Thanks Robert - Silent Roar seems to be the best deterrent I'VE ever heard of.
Cat poo is a perennial problem & comes up regularly on A4A.
For myself, I've tried all sorts of remedies, brambles/holly/sprays/orange peel/olbas oil/mouse traps - yes!/ultrasonic devices - many! One I haven't tried is the motion sensor water spray. Like that one but the hassle of plumbing it in!
I shoot pigeons/sqirrels without a qualm in the garden but I wouldn't shoot a cat.
Someone once said that the real answer is to get a cat/dog yourself - not!
:P
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: GrannieAnnie on May 24, 2010, 13:24:56: It seems to me, I say gently, cat owners should have to restrain their cats just as dog owners do, don't you think?

I know this runs counter to cat owners who think cats have to roam and have a right to roam.
If they have a right to roam, let them roam their owner's yard.

But who says cats have to roam? There are indoor cats who live well.

Don't gardeners have rights to a stink-free garden? YES!
And Roaming Cats hurt the bird population. Don't birds have rights? YES!
Especially in the UK with all your intensive gardening?? YES! Down with Roaming Cats.
I say:
Gardeners Unite! Strike out against roaming stinking cats.

UNITED WE BRING JUSTiCE!
Any unrestrained cat has earned the right to be a Dead Cat!
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Robert_Brenchley on May 24, 2010, 13:53:40: I'd agree that it's about time cat owners started taking responsibility for their pets. If you're a dog owner, and your dog creates havoc, it's clear that you're responsible. The same should apply to cats.
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: betula on May 24, 2010, 13:55:44: The two are in no way comparable and sorry to say you are talking rubbish.

Kill a beautiful animal just to save a few veg.................get a life.
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Glen on May 24, 2010, 15:01:15: Obviously Betula you are a cat person. But would you feel the same if you didn't have a cat and then all your neighbours cats came to do their business in your veg beds?

Why shouldn't cat owner's be responsible for their pets? If you have to clean up after your dog then why not your cat? If the argument is then one of "who knows where their cats goes" - then shouldn't the cat be kept indoors? If a dog strays on the street it gets taken to the pound, why does this not apply to cats?

I do not agree with the killing of cats as I like all animals, however I find the method that works best for me is a quick shout and a kick up the bum! The cats soon get to know you and stay away! ;D
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: betula on May 24, 2010, 16:05:46: Meet Tilly,local cat,not mine who parades with a fine air.

I have two dogs so am not particularly a cat person but Tilly does make me laugh with her antics and yes she has been on my small veg bed but one day I caught her and shouted at her and clapped my hands and she does appear not to have been on again.

In my experience over the years I have never had a huge problem with cats so I suspect some people maybe prone to a little exaggeration.

Long live cats.And dogs. ;D

(http://i45.tinypic.com/mx1zwp.jpg)
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Old bird on May 24, 2010, 16:17:42: Surprisingly - as I have now three large dogs - two of my earlier dogs dislike cats and have chased them from my front garden over the road and they have had to run for their lives (I have a lurcher who is Very very fast) they still chance their luck in my garden. I would dread the dogs catching and killing/maiming one - how embarrasing would that be.

I had a dead baby bird - which had been eaten and then sicked up so you could see the beak and other bits of bird - right in the middle of the garden and the following day there was just a dead bird left - not having been eaten or anything.

I think it is the cat's way of sticking up one finger to the dogs.

I would imagine if you have this problem - I don't grow veg and my garden is not titivated - what about one of those powerful water guns or a blast from the hose.
Neither of which will hurt the cat but they certainly don't like powerful water jets.

Unfortunately the cats have learnt that the dogs are shut in over night so that is when they make merry - but luckily no pooing - I think that goes to my next door neighbour who has immaculate beds and the like!

Old Bird
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: grannyjanny on May 24, 2010, 17:42:26: Our cat poos in our garden. Possibly because she hasn't always lived with us. She adopted us about 9 years ago. She lived at the back of us.
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Plum on May 24, 2010, 18:19:27: I'm sorry but it is not exaggerating. We are surrounded by lots of cat owners except for police couple next door. I have watched cats balance on my pots to use them as a toilet, they will leave parcels on lawn, dig up new plants and use all raised beds as litter tray. I have a sonic scarer which does keep the lawn clear. Recommended one to police couple when them moved in as their front lawn was like a litter tray. That now stays clear. They dig up their pots too. I put bamboo skewers in any clear piece of soil, the cats can see them and seem to avoid them. On the advice of one of my really nice neighbours we have used water guns, they don't hurt the cats and they have learnt to keep away. Though we only need to be away a couple of days and they come back. ( my neighbour has asked me to spray her cats when they walk along our fence to try and get to her bird box)
It has taken alot of effort to claim back my garden( I do not have an allotment so want to grow at home). I do not want to have may grandchildren unable to play on my lawn or dig in the soil with me. Small gardening gloves covered in cat poo is not funny.
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Digeroo on May 24, 2010, 18:26:24: My next door neighbour used to have lots of cats They particularly like carrot seeds and if I sowed them you can be sure that they come a do something right in the middle. I find hawthorn cuttings very useful.

Also the garden hose is very useful once a cat has had a good wetting it does not come back very quickly.

Cats can be very useful when it comes to soft fruit, I never had any problems with birds eating the red currents when a large cat decided it was a good place for a kip.
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: SamLouise on May 24, 2010, 18:29:53: Quote from: Plum on May 24, 2010, 18:19:27
On the advice of one of my really nice neighbours we have used water guns, they don't hurt the cats and they have learnt to keep away.

That really works for you? I've been using a super soaker on the neighbourhood cats for quite a while now, with hopes of knocking 'em off the other side of the fence, but they're so used to it they all run for their shower gel now instead.
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Jeannine on May 24, 2010, 20:54:17: No of course it is not an exaggeration, cats are territorial and sadly if they choose your garden as their place you are in for trouble BIG TIME.. no exaggeration, it is folly to even think that unless you have been one of the chosen.It is simply a case of you know how bad it can be if it has happened to you, if it hasn't happened to you then you are not in a position to comment about it.

Cats especially pick the recently dig soft loamy soil so but they will use anywhere in their chosen spots if need be.

I couldn't condone killing a cat but I sincerely believe that owners should be responsible for damage that they cause, what ever it is. No pet should be allowed if your neighbours have to put up with dirt, smell damage, fear or noise. It is just basic courtesy.

I had cats and dogs for years,,showed both, and would not allow my animals to annoy my neighbours,who have a right to a pet free life within their own boundaries and would contain them if need be in order to be fair to those around me. While I believe some animals have a right to roam I also think in a dense area that pushes the animal to roam in private areas then the roaming right has to be taken away . Sad ,but a reality, as far as I am concerned..my choice to keep an animal should never spoil the rights of my neighbours in their own private space.

XX Jeannine
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Borlotti on May 24, 2010, 21:12:11: So I should sue my neighbour at the end when her kitten came in and pulled down my net curtains. I must admit have lost a few bedding plants as cats do love a newly dug flower bed, had one cat that liked digging up bulbs, great fun. Suppose you either love them or hate them, the hose trick does seem to work and next door puts pepper down as her old cat has a cat litter tray and the terrible twins use her garden as a toilet. I hate idea of indoor cats as they do so love to explore. Have given up planting anything in my window box (which is on the earth) as Dulcie loves it to sleep in, and Dulcie is not my cat, although he thinks he is. I just love him to bits. Too many cats in small gardens in town is the problem, perhaps we should market nappies for cats to solve the problem. Don't blame the cats, they are very clean and most haven't learnt to use the toilet.
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: OllieC on May 24, 2010, 21:17:38: The legal position is fairly clear - cats are expected to (and the owner has a legal right to let them) roam, dogs are not. That's why, whatever anyone's views, the owner of a cat is not legally responsible for what it does on someone else's property, but a dog owner is.
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Robert_Brenchley on May 24, 2010, 22:58:44: Can you quote us the legal basis for that?
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: macmac on May 24, 2010, 23:36:31: To echo Borlottie there are far too many cats,we have so many in our street and given that we cultivate our garden for veg we are a speciific target mmmm lovely fresh soil Grrr.I'ts little better on the lottie as one lovely cat dissappeared and several million took it's place >:(we have to net most things .
CATS there are just too many >:(
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: betula on May 24, 2010, 23:53:05: Quote from: Jeannine on May 24, 2010, 20:54:17
No of course it is not an exaggeration, cats are territorial and sadly if they choose your garden as their place you are in for trouble BIG TIME.. no exaggeration, it is folly to even think that unless you have been one of the chosen.It is simply a case of you know how bad it can be if it has happened to you, if it hasn't happened to you then you are not in a position to comment about it.

Cats especially pick the recently dig soft loamy soil so but they will use anywhere in their chosen spots if need be.

I couldn't condone killing a cat but I sincerely believe that owners should be responsible for damage that they cause, what ever it is. No pet should be allowed if your neighbours have to put up with dirt, smell damage, fear or noise. It is just basic courtesy.

I had cats and dogs for years,,showed both, and would not allow my animals to annoy my neighbours,who have a right to a pet free life within their own boundaries and would contain them if need be in order to be fair to those around me. While I believe some animals have a right to roam I also think in a dense area that pushes the animal to roam in private areas then the roaming right has to be taken away . Sad ,but a reality, as far as I am concerned..my choice to keep an animal should never spoil the rights of my neighbours in their own private space.

XX Jeannine

Many things do not happen to many people but it does not stop them commenting on it so I do not understand your logic.

People do exaggerate.........Adele are you sure several million took that one cats place ?? ;D
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: :( on May 25, 2010, 00:29:52: Quote from: OllieC on May 24, 2010, 21:17:38
The legal position is fairly clear - cats are expected to (and the owner has a legal right to let them) roam, dogs are not. That's why, whatever anyone's views, the owner of a cat is not legally responsible for what it does on someone else's property, but a dog owner is.

Theres no legal right to let them roam, theyre just not specified in legislation that applies to eg dogs or livestock. Theres a common law duty of care to make sure cats dont cause injury to persons or damage to property.

http://www.cats.org.uk (http://www.cats.org.uk)
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: OllieC on May 25, 2010, 09:52:55: Quote from: Robert_Brenchley on May 24, 2010, 22:58:44
Can you quote us the legal basis for that?

I found something a couple of years ago which I can't find now... it was an online resource clearly(ish) laying out who was legally responsible for what & also where lots of the confusion comes in. Of course, when you look now all you get is people repeating opinions they've read elsewhere... It went along the lines that there is specific legislation requiring dog owners to keep the animal under control in public, and nothing similar for cats. Therefore, as a cat owner, you are not responsible for what they do as long as you are being reasonable (and you have to let them exhibit normal behaviour such as wandering around freely or it is cruel!)... So, clearly not as clear as my previous post suggested!
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Baccy Man on May 25, 2010, 11:22:44: Section 14 of the Animal Welfare Act 2006 does apply to cats. A code of practice for the welfare of cats can be downloaded from the DEFRA website. That is the only specific legislation I know of relating to cats other than the trapping legislation which allows trapping of feral cats but not pet or stray cats.

http://www.defra.gov.uk/wildlife-pets/pets/cruelty/index.htm
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Jeannine on May 25, 2010, 18:33:39: Weher or not the law says responsible or not for me it is a question of neighbourly decency, I would be mortified if a cat of mine fouled a child's sandpit or pooped in someones strawberries and certainly if a tom decided to spray everything around a doorway,,runners, umbrellas etc, the smell is unreal.

How could one explain to a neighbour.."well I am not responsible"

XX Jeannine
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: OllieC on May 25, 2010, 19:32:37: Quote from: Jeannine on May 25, 2010, 18:33:39
How could one explain to a neighbour.."well I am not responsible"

XX Jeannine

Um, well you're a nicer person than me! When my neighbour complained about Maggie digging up a couple of little bits of his lawn a couple of years ago (and, in fact, the reason I looked into it then), that's pretty much what I said. Mind you, he got his own back with one of those bloody sonic things - the cat didn't care about it but it made me jump every time I went outside (high range of hearing!).
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: Borlotti on May 25, 2010, 21:36:19: Reading the code of practise it says "it needs to be able to exhibit normal behaviour patterns", which means crapping in your garden, sorry but cats will be cats, and I am a cat person and much more concerned about child cruelty or neglect than a bit of cat poo. The only thing I will say is that too many cats, dogs in London, small gardens causes a problem. My dog when he needed a wee could kill a plant instantly, cats not too much of a problem and the hose does work but perhaps people with cats and a small garden should train their cats to use a litter tray. If you have a sand pit, cover it, as cats seem to love them, as I know from experience and that is dangerous for children. My cat is 18+ and has never pooed in the house, he walked about with crossed paws when it was snowing and got so upset I had to go and buy cat litter and he was upset about pooing inside. Don't blame the cats, blame the owners.
Title: Re: Local cats are ruining my veg
Post by: campanula on June 06, 2010, 20:10:05: yeah well, if dogs did the foul muderous bird killing which cats do, they would probably be made to be muzzled. Try a catapult.