Allotments 4 All
Produce => Pests & Diseases => Topic started by: freeman263 on August 10, 2008, 14:34:48
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I have trouble with rats on my allotment I.E. they are eating my beetroot. As I have a trap what would be the best bait. Or is there a better way to be rid of them?
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I would ask your local council to come visit - they'll give you rat poison, and hopefully return and take it away to dispose of properly. Normally free visit
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I have best results from chocolate and bacon together. If they're live traps, do check frequently (I think the legal minimum is every 24 hours). I've had a hedgehog in mine before now!
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Smear with peanut butter. Sometimes they can lick it off without setting off the trap though..... 8)
MP
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Rats are "NEOPHOBIC" ie. they are scared/avoid anything new in their known foraging areas, so any traps need to be sat safe for a period of time, so they do not catch anything that they shouldn`t and that the rats will get accustomed to.
the best trap, IMHO is the Fenn Mk4 but needs to be set properly.
http://www.basc.org.uk/ has some good info please search for trapping/rats etc.
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Went up to lottie 8.30 this morning to pick beans and peas before the rain started. An hour later, I gather something spooked them because two enormous RATS came running into our plot, lept over the brassicas towards me.
Can you picture the scene!!!!!
Had to have a sit down and a cup of tea to get over the shock. I don't know where they went to but I went out with the hoe and rustled the brassicas in case they were still there. Nothing.
Saw the Chairman of the Allotment Ass. on the way out and I have since telephoned the Council. They are supposed to be getting back to me within 3 days. No charge apparently for them to come out.
Not a happy bunny!
MP >:(
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I'd never seen one until a couple of weeks ago when it ran along the bottom of the gate and into my rhubarb and strawberry bed. saw it again a week later, investigating the bed I'd cleared my broad beans from. I'd gone to fill up my watering can and as I walked back down the main path I could see it rootling about. I crept along the tins and it dashed into the weeds by my compost pallets and when I very slowly leaned one of the pallets over on its side the b****y thing was sitting looking at me :o
I go everywhere with a big long stick now, poking and thrashing just in case it's around. have also taken to tying the bottoms of my trousers with string after my plot neighbour told me some horror stories about rats up trouser legs :o :o :o
the council have bait boxes all over the site but because it's next to a wood with a river, and lots of plots have poultry, they're just a rather unpleasant fact of allotment life for us.
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Hi Norfolklass,
I think I might be taking a long stick with me when I go poking around. I can't say I fancy them up my trouser legs. :o I tend not to wear gloves either but I think these might be going on too. I knew rats were around as we have chicks next door but to see them in daylight, they must be getting a bit cheeky!!!
Hope the pest control man does something quickly.....
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you realy must wear gloves if you have rats about,
they wee as they move about, and there is a nasty illness carried in their waste.
hmm i cant remember the details someone will know, but its lepto something
nasty anyway, so wear gloves
oh yeah while we are at it has every one had a tetnus injection, please do if you havent, i would say this is a must ok
lbb
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I asked about a tetnus injection and was told that you only have one know if you have a bad cut ?
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Many thanks for all of your very interesting replies what with chocolate coated bacon, peanut butter and big sticks you have given me lots to think about. I will also contact the local council as well for good measure.
:D bye all
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you realy must wear gloves if you have rats about,
they wee as they move about, and there is a nasty illness carried in their waste.
hmm i cant remember the details someone will know, but its lepto something
nasty anyway, so wear gloves
lbb
I know of it as Weil's disease (a form of leptospirosis apparently - see link below), but I should mention that it is extremely rare.
Mum always used it to convince us not to drink out of cans (rats in the warehouses) :)
http://www.iphe.org.uk/health/weils_disease.html (http://www.iphe.org.uk/health/weils_disease.html)
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I believe that women of child-bearing age should always wear gloves when gardening, regardless of whether rats are around becasue of the risk of toxoplasmosis from cats (dangerous when pregnant).
Be safe ladies!!
;D
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hmm, I appreciate the concern but I just can't get on with gloves and I only wear them when dealing with muck. I'd much rather get my hands dirty ;D
I also might get hit by a bus tomorrow!
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re lepto what nots, hmm i'm surprised that its so rare, the canoe trip at school was canceled this year because of rats at the canal, h&s said we couldnt let the kids go (£$%^&*h&s)
my gp gave the kids tetnus jabs and me a booster, we have no cuts
how odd
lbb
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Did a google on Weils and found this...
http://www.nhsdirect.nhs.uk/articles/article.aspx?articleid=230 (http://www.nhsdirect.nhs.uk/articles/article.aspx?articleid=230)
Includes this: "Leptospirosis is rare in the UK, and Weil's disease is extremely rare"
I've never met anyone who's caught any form of it but it's hard to beat the Waffen H&S.
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But tetanus jabs are for tetanus - not lepto?!!! ??? ???
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Maybe I'm being a bit slow... ::)
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But tetanus jabs are for tetanus - not lepto?!!! ??? ???
i dont believe i said it was, if i wasnt clear i'm very sorry,
it was just a thought while i was writing about nasty stuff in soil
lbb
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No need to apologise littlebabybird. The confusion is more likely to be my fault for being a bit slow on the uptake!!
::)
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A quick way to get rid of rats from compost heaps under sheds etc is to put block up the holes that the rats use but leave a couple open, put a rubber hose that is attached to an exhaust pipe into another hole and just watch them bolt out when the fumes hit them at this point stand over the hole and whack them when they come running out, a Rotovator, chain saw etc will serve this purpose. ;)
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I'm glad I'm not a rat. Don't think I like you very much.
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Thanks for the help, but i think i was save gassing the rats as a last resort...do you have any advice on voles?
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Back on/off topic on the anti-tet jabs. I asked my GP to renew mine recently and she said they no longer give them routinely. You only get one if you are considered high risk for getting tetanus. I explained my allotment exploits and she agreed I could have one.
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I went to my GP surgery and also asked for a booster for my anti-tetanus but my surgery nurse explained that as i was 50 years old i would be protected as i received all the shots when i was younger. I still am not convinced at this as she said i would have received a booster in my 20,s. I exlained that i handled horse manure etc but she was adamant that i am protected.
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I would ask to see your GP.I had a booster ,no problem.The nurse just said do not let anyone give you another one within the next ten years.
When I was at college doing a Horticulture course we had to sign a form to say we had had an up to date jab. :)
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Friend of a friend got Weils disease after a canoeing trip.. But it does help if you fall in and drink the water. Not heard of anyone getting it through gardening.
Surely rats will bugger off if there is not much food in their area? I reckon there will always be one or two around snaffling the odd vegetable but they only seem to congregate en-masse when there is a really smellly bin or compost heap nearby. And they are a delight to watch on the telly, so intelligent!
Thus said, I am new to this and have never ventured onto the allotment at night. I may eat my words and end up one of those weirdos who sleeps in their shed with a black widow catapult under the pillow, having laid weedkiller flapjack next to the beetroots...
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I went to my GP surgery and also asked for a booster for my anti-tetanus but my surgery nurse explained that as i was 50 years old i would be protected as i received all the shots when i was younger. I still am not convinced at this as she said i would have received a booster in my 20,s. I exlained that i handled horse manure etc but she was adamant that i am protected.
Just been reading up on this - "......... current UK guidelines state that a total of five doses of the vaccine are considered to give lifelong immunity -- the exception is in the case of a tetanus prone wound when a booster is given as required."
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Back on/off topic on the anti-tet jabs. I asked my GP to renew mine recently and she said they no longer give them routinely. You only get one if you are considered high risk for getting tetanus. I explained my allotment exploits and she agreed I could have one.
back Off topic ::) What did you do for your rats/have you ever had rat problems?
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back Off topic ::) What did you do for your rats/have you ever had rat problems?
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Yes, we have rats on our site, there are always rats on allotments. There's an all-year-round food supply and nice places to live so you will never get rid of them. We live with them, there are worse pests.
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How many times have people said that they take on allotments so they can take their kids down the lotty and get them interested in gardening? I'm all for it, but when there is a known rat problem on allotments I would be keeping children well away, they are disease carrying vermin not fluffy over sized mice :)
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The whole country has a rat problem, made worse by the current idea of fortnightly rubbish clearance so allotments are no different. (OK wrong forum for a rant)
We are never more than 6 feet away from a rat, so the environmentalists tell us and we have managed to survive up till now.
I had some rats using my garden as a run, despite having 3 dogs and 3 cats and 1 rat chewed through a brick and got into my kitchen. He died!
Respect the rats lifestyle (so you dont get bitten) and don't prod or poke them, bait for those that are in inappropriate places, like houses, and live with the rest because we really have no choice but to do that.
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Actually it was worked out to be that we are never 247 feet from a rat or something like that and I don't mind the fortnightly collection of rubbish, unless we miss it...
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Ishard,
And what also contributes to the rat problem in our backwater is the amount of food take aways we have in town, well not so much the take aways but the idle gits who don't dispose their half eaten kebabs into the waste bins (the ones on lamposts and not fortnightly) :)
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Ishard,
And what also contributes to the rat problem in our backwater is the amount of food take aways we have in town, well not so much the take aways but the idle gits who don't dispose their half eaten kebabs into the waste bins (the ones on lamposts and not fortnightly) :)
Sounds about right! Jonny foreigner, coming over here, with his half eaten kebabs and rats!
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OC,
I think you will find that a Kebab is popular with many people in this country along with burgers and hot dogs from the States plus Chinese food and many other take out foods which in my town do end up on the streets on a weekend , I can't understand why you have to imply a racist overtone in your post which I presume is directed at me when the posts are about Rat problems, :)
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OC,
I think you will find that a Kebab is popular with many people in this country along with burgers and hot dogs from the States plus Chinese food and many other take out foods which in my town do end up on the streets on a weekend , I can't understand why you have to imply a racist overtone in your post which I presume is directed at me when the posts are about Rat problems, :)
No, I was just having a joke because I'm in such a good mood that nobody, not even you, can put a dampener on it. Since you raise the topic of race, I notice that you don't mention British fish & chips as being a problem.
Again, I am making a whimsical observation.
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Ishard,
And what also contributes to the rat problem in our backwater is the amount of food take aways we have in town, well not so much the take aways but the idle gits who don't dispose their half eaten kebabs into the waste bins (the ones on lamposts and not fortnightly) :)
Having seen the revolting looking, mechanically recovered blobs of meat that is a donner kebab, rat food is about all that it is fit for. ;D
We don't buy takeaways or pre-prepared food. Certainly do not litter the streets.
valmarg
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[No, I was just having a joke because I'm in such a good mood that nobody, not even you, can put a dampener on it. Since you raise the topic of race, I notice that you don't mention British fish & chips as being a problem.
Again, I am making a whimsical observation.
It ain't funny. I've seen loads of white people with British accents chucking food on the floor, same as everyone else. Why try to attach it to specific groups of people when they all do it? I've seen fish and chips on the floor as well, but not so often as there aren't so many chippies round here.
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RB,
totally agree but OC always comes with a whimsical dig, the only thing I mentioned was half eaten kebabs and then he goes on about Johnny Foreigner whoever that is? and I thought this string was about rat problems :)
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It's a shame really. I didn't think this site attracted bigots. I really thought we were all above this. :'( All this nonsense spoils it.
This thread is about rat problems not race.
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Re: Rats. Can you not get the Council out to put their sealed boxes of poison out. They find out where the 'runs' are and place the boxes there.
Weils Disease: I had an Uncle die from this many years ago. He was a Gamekeeper and had removed a Rat from a trap. He foolishly did not wash his hands before lighting his pipe. The disease got into his system and 5 days later he was dead.
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I found a dead rat on my allotment and after a lot of screaming, a nice man came and buried it for me. Yesterday the allotment next to mine had a dead fox on it, I was too scared to look at it. Don't mind them alive. We think someone must be poisoning them and are now worried about the allotment cat as didn't see it yesterday. Must finish on the computer in a minute and go up to the allotment and hope I don't find any dead animals. A lot of people have put slug pellets down, do you think that could have poisoned the rats/foxes. I also have plenty of red ants, and was chased by wasps. We burnt that nest out and it was really scary and I couldn't dig one end of the allotment.
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I doubt there will ever be an extinction of rats in this country and the measures to try and cope with them just bring more poisons into the environment which too has its hazards
there cannot be a wild animal or insect that doesn't carry, bacteria, ticks, fleas, parasites, stings, poisons etc than can harm humans, so what do we do, kill them all?
domestic cats are a threat to young children, shall we kill them all, deer carry ticks that cause Lyme disease, shall we kill them all, honey bee sting can kill someone who is susceptible, shall we wipe them out
the food chain is massive and yet humans always want to gouge out a great chunk of it - at our peril, in time
brown rats, like a lot of others, have a 90% mortality rate which takes care of a lot of them
PS if you knew what was in a tetanus jab you might think twice as well
rant over, thank you and good night ;D
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Re: Rats. Can you not get the Council out to put their sealed boxes of poison out. They find out where the 'runs' are and place the boxes there.
Unfortunately after the rat has taken it`s belly full of poison away, it may die somewhere in the open and present a danger to cats/foxes/dogs/birds of prey etc.
Trapping/baiting runs is a better and safer option.
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How very sad for all those fluffy fury rats but did we not have a problem in this country back in the 1600's called the Bubonic plague or was it just me reading mi 'Dandy' in class when I should of been paying attention to the history lesson about the history of this great country of ours ;)
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Not to mention the 'Black Death' in 1348, also caused by rats.
valmarg
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these are the same plagues just different names and it was bacterium that was responsible not rats - this bacterium exists with or without rats, please do get facts right :)
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The rats were only carrying the disease - it wasn't their fault. If the plague had been spread by horses, perhaps we'd have different attitudes towards horses and rats.
Rats are actually highly intelligent animals, and make fantastic (and clean) pets. The ones who live in the wild didn't choose to be put on this earth, they manage to feed themselves and survive (very well) with our help. If we didn't inappropriately throw away as much food as we do there wouldn't be enough for them to survive and their numbers would decrease. But all the junk food and kebabs and burgers that's chucked (and puked) onto the streets will only serve to ensure they stay. Chucking poison at them won't solve the problem, reducing their food supply will.
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I actually give on people making excuses on behalf of the rat population, I doubt very much that they have ever seen one or knowingly ever been close to one or gone out trapped them and disposed of them for local farmers, go and see the damage that they can do to grain silos and stocks of animal feed, the next time you drive through the countryside look between the hedgerow and the crop, you will see a big divide that is caused by the rat population.
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I am very sad about the dead foxes and will be even more sad if I don't see the allotment cat tomorrow. I wasn't aware of rats on the allotment until we kept finding them dead. Did anyone see Gardners World with Joe Swift and my good friends on the allotment. Hope Joe hasn't got rats. I was the one smiling two weeks ago with the hat when I didn't win for my beans, courgettes and potatoes. Manuel's allotment is beautiful, and his pumpkin is really good. Sorry if that sounds rude, but I mean his pumpkin.
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these are the same plagues just different names and it was bacterium that was responsible not rats - this bacterium exists with or without rats, please do get facts right :)
I thought rats were the vectors in both cases, ie spreaders.
valmarg
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I doubt very much that they have ever seen one or knowingly ever been close to one
Mr Smith, please do not presume to know what other people's experience of rats and other vermin are. You certainly know nothing about me. I have been up close and personal with more "nasties" and creepy crawlies than most people have had hot dinners. Rats, scorpions, cockroaches, snakes, centipedes, land crabs, chiggers, fleas and ticks are just a small selection. Even now I automatically look for weevils when I sift the flour. I picked weevils out of my children's Farleys rusks when they were babies - they are now in their late 30s and seem to have survived. My brother-in-law is a farmer and I have spent many summers working on the farm (wow, I even saw some rats!).
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Quick check and these are the diseases which can be spread from rats to humans(pecentage is how many found with disease in UK 1995)......
WORMS
the liver worm Capillaria in 23%
the cestode Hymenolepsis diminuta in 22%
the cestode Hymenolepsis nana in 11%
BACTERIA
Leptospira spp. bacteria causing Weil's disease in 14%
Listeria spp. bacteria causing listeriosis in 11%
Yersinia enterocolitica bacteria causing yersiniosis in 11%
Pasturella spp. bacteria causing Pasturellosis in 6%
Pseudomonas spp. bacteria causing Meilioidosis in 4%
PROTAZOA
Cryptosporidium parvum causing cryptosporidiosis in 63%
Toxoplasma gondii causing toxoplasmosis in 35%
RICKETTSIA
Coxiella burnetti evidence of infection by Q fever in 34%
VIRUSES
Hantavirus causing Hantaan-fever or hemorrhagic fever in 5% :o :o :o
ECTOPARASITES - (note: these ectoparasites are vectors for diseases which are transmissible to humans, such as typhus)
* Fleas found on 100% of the rats
* Mites found on 67%
* Lice found on 38%
:o :o :o :o :o
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OMG :o :o :o :o :o :o :o That is SOOO shocking. I think you'll find that 100% of hedgehogs have fleas too (at least 100% of the ones I've seen have)
And what about all the viruses and bacteria and STDs that humans pass around ... ... ...
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And what about all the viruses and bacteria and STDs that humans pass around ... ... ...
Don`t have a trap big enough for them ;D