Allotments 4 All
Produce => Pests & Diseases => Topic started by: N8R on June 01, 2008, 09:31:10
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having woken up this morning to the typical wet yorkshire weather i realised my wheelie bin lid was left open.and upon closer inspection i have been lucky enough to acquire an astonishing pack of rats consisting of 1 large (admittingly worried looking )mother and no less than 9 pups .which leaves now with the obvious dilemma KILL or RELEASE.Not really keen on the idea of release as i have a young baby in the house but the idea of cold blooded murder is not really in my make up either . which leads me abruptly to the point what would you do ???? ???
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If you release they multiply and come back.
Call someone professional to come and deal with them.. then the guilt isnt on your head.
If you have a baby, think of all the disease they carry around. I would personally have them removed by someone knowing what they doing.
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Killing rats is war not murder. Do the deed!
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yeah your right weils disease and so on probably best to call the rat man in the morning .having kept pet rats in the the past and realising the intelligence and complex sociability of the animal makes it hard thanks for your in post springbokgirl !! ;)
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Cold blooded murder is very easy to justify when it comes to rats. If you don't dispose of them then you could become overrun with them in a matter of a few months. The council pest control department will come out do it for you free if you can't bring yourself to kill them but there is often a long waiting list for the pest control officer.
If they are actually in the wheelie bin then won't they go on rubbish day anyway?
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yeah in two weeks time "baccyman" thanks to the ingenious idea of the local council to only collect the bins every fortnight which is the reason the rats are tempted in to my garden in the first place ,. :(
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Does your bin have drainage holes? I prefer to drown vermin where possible as you don't have to watch & there's no crunching noises.
And just to echo, this should not be a dilemma, they are repulsive creatures who spread disease... they have to go!
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If you want to minimise the murder, just kill the mum. You won't be responsible for whta happens to the pups after that. :o
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Can't you get a box and empty the rats into it then release them in a field/woods etc? That is what I would do.
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yeah in two weeks time "baccyman" thanks to the ingenious idea of the local council to only collect the bins every fortnight which is the reason the rats are tempted in to my garden in the first place ,. :(
If it is two weeks until the next collection, then I do not believe you can blame the policy. If it was between 8 and fourteen days since your last one, you may have a case. Rats are tempted wherever humans habitate - they were there already, you just didn't see them.
BTW humanely trapping then releasing five miles away, means that that particular bunch will not return - in fact, they will probably be killed by the locals if you take them out into the countryside where the rats are harder.
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yeah thanks "redclanger" for your mind stumbling inteligent input to be exact its 9 days to my collection date i do appoligise for not being exact
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Humanely releasing?!?!?! Are you insane or have I missed something?!?! THESE ARE SODDING RATS, NOT CUTE LITTLE FLUFFY BUNNIES!!!! THEY ARE VERMIN. THEY SPREAD DISEASE. KILL THEM. Oh, and if I lived in the country and some prat from the nearest town came out & started dropping his rats off on my land, I'd go mental. Why do you think you have the right to deposit your problem with someone else?
As always, just my humble opinion...
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Hi N8R, Hi all, My two-penny worth,
I dislike rats and have killed a few on the plot and seen many around the city, as I `ve posted on this forum before.
My advice is to kill them as humanely as you can. If you can`t do it get someone else to do it for you. I don`t know if throwing poison into the bin and then sealing the lid would work or drowning.
I wouldn`t want to get too close, a mother rat may feel inclined to protect her young if she feels threatened. They do bite.
Its better to kill these rats now than have their many offspring running around your garden and eventually your house. If you have one adult rat in your garden you have others so I`d also plan to deal with their relatives in the near future.
People have already written about the risk of disease and you might want to bear this in mind when your child is playing outdoors this summer.
I don`t see this as a moral dilemma I`d say it was good fortune to catch them so young and also its the inevitable result of fortnightly rubbish collections.
Col
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N8R - you shouldn't be any doubt about what to do.
Just read the replies from Ollie C, Baccy Man and Robert Brenchley. These are knowledgeable people.
You are talking about RATS for God's sake! Get rid of them ASAP.
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to use piosion or drown them is not humane,all animals deserve a humane death,
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I may be wrong and if I am I'm sure there will be no end of people pointing it out to me but the last time I checked it isn't illegal to release rats into the countryside. I live there and its what I would do as is my right. I gave my opinion simple as that, given without being rude to other posters.
Weils disease can also be carried by dogs, deer, rabbits, hedgehogs, cows, sheep, and even certain marine mammals.
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Sorry billy - it wasn't meant as a personal dig, just how I'd view someone letting out rats on my field... if I had one... I'm absolutely certain of your lack of pratishness...
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Rats as pets are one thing-and they can be really cute. Wild rats -that`s up to each to decide.
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thanks for all your replies have taken on board everyones point and 0pinions and decided to call the "rat man " first thing in the morning although the catch and release idea was looking good i need to be thinking about the next generation that will inevitably rear there heads so a dose of poison is needed thanks again n8r ;D
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According to the Wildlife And Countryside Act 1981, Schedule 9, Part 1. It is illegal to release black rats into the wild, the more common brown rats can be released however there are 2 points which should be considered first.
1) It is not "legal"/ethical to release them (or anything else) on land where you dont have permission to do so - doing so could constitute private nuisance under the laws of tort (although this is civil rather than criminal issue)
2) It is not ethical to relocate them into a strange environment where they have no knowledge of food sources ,places of shelter, predator risk etc and where they may well be attacked by the local rat population who may well not welcome strangers. Relocating them in this way could (depending on interpretation) be illegal under the animals act as a practice likely to cause unusal suffering etc...
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2) It is not ethical to relocate them into a strange environment where they have no knowledge of food sources ,places of shelter, predator risk etc and where they may well be attacked by the local rat population who may well not welcome strangers. Relocating them in this way could (depending on interpretation) be illegal under the animals act as a practice likely to cause unusal suffering etc...
Some fair points, especially on the Tort issue and although I said more or less the same thing about town rats being killed by country rats, I think that it being interpreted by the courts as being illegal under the animals act as a practice likely to cause unusal suffering would be really stretching it.
And sorry NR8, I did not mean to be curt.
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for me a couple of kettle fulls of boiling water and that would put an end to it.Not nice i know but quick
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It never fails to amaze me that some people think they have a god given right to inflict pain on living creatures. >:( >:( >:(
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All I can give is my opinion and view. I wouldn't dream of doing what some of the posts are advising to do but we are all different and each to their own. No worries Ollie. Thanks for replying.
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Hi NR8, Hi Dennis,
to use piosion or drown them is not humane,all animals deserve a humane death,
:( I am aware of this but I`m at a loss to come up with something better.
I know a bloke who could shoot them and it would be a quick end but thats a rare skill.
Col
(35 years as a Vegetarian)
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It never fails to amaze me that some people think they have a god given right to inflict pain on living creatures. >:( >:( >:(
I don't think it's a right, betula, I think it's a hygienic essential; and I think it should be done as humanely as possible. And I don't think it's given by god either, but that's a whole different discussion (I have a slight evolutionary advantage, my species invented morals & are therefore responsible)! It appears to be down to the following choices, in order of my preference:
1) Kill them quickly (my favourite)
2) Kill them slowly (release them elsewhere or boil them)
3) Let them live and let them risk the health of others until someone else kills them
I don't think you have the right to risk exposing your children & others to disease when there's a quick, simple solution, if we're talking morality...
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yeah the erm boiling water trick a little barbaric for my liking jockomorrocco but thanks for the reply anyway mate . the reason this has been a "morale dilemma " at all is that i have kept pet rats my self . there personality traits intelligence and behaviour can be quite remarkable . im no soft lad but i freely admit i was heart broken when my last rat died. anyway d day for the rat family approaches thanks to all for the posts n8r
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I know what you are saying Ollie but the boiling water remark made me a little bit cross. :)
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aha, well in that case, me old china (betula), we're in agreement... no need to hurt anything (more than essential) here... actually you know what, a kettle wouldn't hold enough to kill them, so it would just cause pain & not solve the problem, and by the second kettle full, the first would be too cold to be contributing to a quick death...
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It never fails to amaze me that some people think they have a god given right to inflict pain on living creatures. >:( >:( >:(
They shoot horses dont they??
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It never fails to amaze me that some people think they have a god given right to inflict pain on living creatures. >:( >:( >:(
They shoot horses dont they??
nope, rats do many things but they lack the manual dexterity to hold a gun...
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It never fails to amaze me that some people think they have a god given right to inflict pain on living creatures. >:( >:( >:(
They shoot horses dont they??
nope, rats do many things but they lack the manual dexterity to hold a gun...
RAT A TAT TAT,RAT A TAT TAT.....sound of a rat machine gun ;D
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:o anyone remember the plague!! :o :o :o :o :o :o
Amazed at all the "let them live" "creatures deserve life" etc...
I thought we were talking about Rats!!!..
My ex husband works on old stone buildings, and many dead rats are usually in the properties and between the cavity walls... they have to wear masks over their nose and mouths to protect themselves from disease etc until all of them are removed.
Just amazed at the above responses LOL.. sorry!!. Dont condone animal cruelty before someone accuses me of that one, but its Rats!!!.. I dont get it!! ??? ???
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It never fails to amaze me that some people think they have a god given right to inflict pain on living creatures. >:( >:( >:(
They shoot horses dont they??
nope, rats do many things but they lack the manual dexterity to hold a gun...
RAT A TAT TAT,RAT A TAT TAT.....sound of a rat machine gun ;D
;D ;D thats funny, If your not feeding em, they will of died of starvation by the time the rat man comes ;D ;D
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:o anyone remember the plague!! :o :o :o :o :o :o
we are all too young for that and that is wrong anyway - the rats just carried the fleas that caused the disease of the plagues
there isn't a species alive that doesn't carry disease and will pass it on to others who are susceptible but the human method is always to kill kill kill >:(
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:o anyone remember the plague!! :o :o :o :o :o :o
we are all too young for that and that is wrong anyway - the rats just carried the fleas that caused the disease of the plagues
Rats still carry the fleas that cause the disease.
When people think of the plague they only associate it with the second pandemic of Pasteurella Pestis that occurred during the Middle Ages (The Black Death) they forget that the third pandemic only ended in 1959 & even since then there have been small outbreaks of the disease. Although usually controlled by antibiotics in 1998 the first case of human plague that showed total resistance to all known antibiotics was reported in the US.
At present the plague is largely controlled throughout the world, but it remains endemic in some rural areas of Asia, South Africa, and South America. Sometimes, as in Vietnam during the 1960s, as a result of war conditions, it flares up into epidemic proportions.
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of course you are right, didn't want to write a history lesson but just dispel some of the myths about rats and plagues - thanks :)
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The fleas only transferred the disease from rat to human. They were a vital link in the chain, but it's essentially a rodent disease that infects humans as well.