Allotments 4 All
Allotment Stuff => The Basics => Topic started by: hopeful vegigrower on May 12, 2009, 17:41:50
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From what stage do you need to protect against carrot root fly? Do you need to do it right from when you sow the seed, or will it do at a later stage?
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we cover when we sow, just a bit of fleece to start, then it goes over hoops as they grow :)
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Between my carrot rows I've have planted Chives which I planted when I put the carrot seeds in, I'm very organic sometimes when I want to be, :)
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I cover mine with fleece from the go
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Me too. I don't take any chances
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Thanks all. I'll do it from the off with my next sowing. ::)
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On reading this thread and others within the recent past on the same subject, it has set me thinking.
In this thread it is said; I cover mine with fleece from the go is this a good thing or bad?
Why I ask is; It is a known fact that the grubs overwinter in the soil meaning that when they mature into flies in spring! are they not trapped under the fleece cover. ???
Is this why we read/hear of people having carrot fly problems despite covering with fleece from the outset?
Similarly it has been said; I've have planted Chives obviously the plan here is; the smell of the chives will deter the fly.
Then there is the experiment on a similar vein that I am going to try this year, and that is; I plan to water the drill with an Armillatox mixture prior to sowing.
My plan is; to leave 'my scent' shall we say? like some animals do to ward of intruders from their territory, in the hope that I will ward off the fly
So c'mon everyone what is your view on 'carrot fly deterrants'?
Lets have a good debate on this one! TG
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What rate of dilution will you be using for that experiment Tee Gee? How soon will you have any results?
Janet
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Lets have a good debate on this one! TG
I'd like to join in Tee Gee...............but I can't get carrots to grow at all. :-\
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Just may be lucky with the fly this year,
managed to get my hands on some( BROMOPHOS)
Have to use it sparingly though :o :o
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Lets have a good debate on this one! TG
I'd like to join in Tee Gee...............but I can't get carrots to grow at all. :-\
What do you mean ? you can,t get them to germinate or they germinate then don,t grow on.
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Tee Gee. I have some armillatox. Please explain to me exactly what you do and I will put my Autumn King in using it. Don't forget that I am using your spent compo method as well. So when do I use the armillatox before or after the filling of the trench and do I have to leave it for a while before I sow. Sorry to be so demanding ;D
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I'm sure that armillatox would prove effective against the carrot fly. With all those tar acids in armillatox I wouldn't touch them either.
Jeyes is another (Tra Acid) favourite on our site - the older boys drench their soil in jeyes before putting the carrot seeds in.
I tried armillatox as a deterrent for white rot, the smell of it instantly dissuaded me from its 'organic' acceptability and I refused to grow anything edible there for a couple of seaons.
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The reason I have planted Chives with my carrots is I like to listen to people that have had success with doing this, :)
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I've covered mine with a Lidl mosquito net.. no idea whether it will work or not. Have been warned that carrots never grow on our site though, so it might be a waste of time anyhow.
Saw a supposedly fly-resistant variety called Fly Away, anyone tried these? Did wonder if they were particularly tasteless thus less attractive to pests!
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The carrot fly has given a lot of people a lot of grief over the years. Some will say it does not fly over 18", rubbish.
First have a look at where you are going to grow your carrots. The fly hides in scrub, bramble and any other bush that grows in or near your garden, so growing any where near that should be avoided.
There is no point in putting up netting if you have had carrot fly in that place previously because it will still be there in the soil waiting for you to plant.
Some of the growers i know and including myself came to the conclusion that Jeys Fluid is no longer affective against the fly so now at the end of the season we sterilise with bleach ( GASP i HEAR ) two capfuls to a gallon of water. No i am not worried because by the time it comes back round to planting the bleach will have been flushed through the soil and gone.
Like TEE GEE i have considered using Armillatox but my prefer ed method would be to water it in a couple of weeks prior to planting hoping it will kill off any thing left in the soil that the bleach did not get.
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Thanks for the response and as I thought it is quite a varied response.
A number of questions have been asked which I will give MY opinion on.
Note; Anyone who disagrees with me please respond in the usual manner, after all it is a 'debate'
What rate of dilution will you be using for that experiment Tee Gee?
How soon will you have any results?
It will be as the manufacturers recommendation.
The beauty of the armilatox bottle is; it comes with its very own measuring container.
Can't remember what the details are but I fill the gauge to the top mark and add 2 galls of water to it.
I won't know the results until I harvest the carrots .......assuming I get a harvest ::) ;D
managed to get my hands on some( BROMOPHOS)
Have to use it sparingly though
Try this for economy; put a drop of Bromophos in the foil pack, I found that half filling the foil packet was sufficient. Shake the foil packet to mix bromophos and carrot seed together then sow the seed/bromophos in the normal manner (see slide show below)
I am using your spent compo method as well. So when do I use the armillatox before or after the filling of the trench and do I have to leave it for a while before I sow.
Ok prepare your 'Vee' trench as previously instructed then form a drill in the top of this i.e. as you would in normal soil (see slide show).
Soak the drill with the armillatox mix then sow seeds again as shown in the slide show.
Note; OK the seeds shown in the slide show are lettuce seed but the same principle applies to any other type of seed including carrots.
http://www.thegardenersalmanac.co.uk/Data/Seed%20sowing%20outdoors/Seed%20sowing-%20outdoors/seed%20sowing-%20outdoors.html (http://www.thegardenersalmanac.co.uk/Data/Seed%20sowing%20outdoors/Seed%20sowing-%20outdoors/seed%20sowing-%20outdoors.html)
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Thanks Tee Gee. I'm going to try some with the spent compo and armillatox and some with just the spent compo. We have rotated our crops over thepast 3 years since we got the plot and before that it hadn't been worked for approx10 years. So the carrot fly hasn't reall had time to get established. I am still going to cover both lots just in case. Think I might just sow a few up a corner just using the Armillatox without netting for experimental purposes.
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I do much the same as TEE GEE except i don,t put my seeds directly onto the soil.
First i make my drills
[attachment=1]
water it then add a layer of compost and then water that
[attachment=2]
I then add my seeds and water them in
[attachment=3]
finaly cover them with anther layer of compost and water that
[attachment=4]
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Tee Gee is quite correct in his proposals. Many years ago I carried out experiments on defeating carrot fly - the results were in fact posted on the oldBBC Gardening Board several years ago. The main conclusions were that once the seed have germinated there is no period of more than about 2 weeks during the summer when carrot fly are not active, and that cover from sowing is vital, and also that there was still some damage from carrot fly which could not possibly have penetrated the cover.
When I repeated the experiment I first soaked the carrot bed (4ft wide, with the carrots sown in rows across) and a surrounding border 1 ft wide with cheap coffee mixed at drinking strength to shift all the slugs, then a week later with Armillatox at the same concentration as the instructions recommended for Club Root a full 6 weeks before I intended sowing (this 6 week period was actually quoted in the Armillatox instructions at the time - I don`t know whether it still is, but it is also necessary because of the coffee).
The bed was covered immediately after sowing and remained covered throughout, and there was no fly damage whatever.
For those with slug problems, the border around the carrot bed should be re-treated with the coffee about every 6 weeks, and this will stop slugs repopulating the bed. However, no coffee should be applied to the crop itself until it is fully mature, or severe chlorosis will probably result. With maincrop (Autumn King type) coffee can be applied direct to the crop from late September onwards when growth has ceased and this will provide slug protection for those left in the ground
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Sorry to ask ( I know I should be able to find my way around the site better) but where do I find Tee Gee's spent compost thread? obviuosly tried search but don't seem to be able to find.
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there's a couple of threads that come up if you search for re used compost and add Tee Gee to the search name box. Wasn't sure if this was what you wanted?
1066
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As I recall I referred to this extract from my web page on carrots;
In manured ground insert blade of spade into the bed and push it backwards & forwards to form a 'V' shaped trench.
Trickle in a proprietary potting compost* into the trench and sow the seed as previously described.
This method is particularly beneficial in dry seasons.
i.e. the manure retains sufficient moisture in the ground between rain showers to keep the carrots going.
This method also reduces the chances of stunted or forked growth.
* You can substitute any used compost e.g from seed trays pots etc providing it wasn't used for diseased plants and the roots were all seived out of it.
The full link is here; http://www.thegardenersalmanac.co.uk/Data/Carrot/Carrot.htm (http://www.thegardenersalmanac.co.uk/Data/Carrot/Carrot.htm)
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Yes it was 1066 thank you.
Tee Gee your a Gent. if patience is a virtue you must be the most virtuous person I have come across thank you.
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We're planting carrots and onions in close proximity in the hope this will confuse them.
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it won't ! use netting ;)
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Thanks TeeGee on your piece on Bromophos,
If it works it shold last years.
kes
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Having tried about every method one can think of go with what Tony says, use fleece or fine netting.
There are other methods that will give you some reasonable chance of getting a crop such as planting the seed in a shallow drill and back fill as the carrot top grows and then earth up arround making it to deep for the fly to get to the carrot.
Don,t plant till about mid June.
Things i have tried,
Rope soaked in Jeys Fluid and layed alongside the row of carrors
Rope soaked in Kerosine and laid in gurrering alongside.
Moth Balls in neeting bags and suspended along the rows.
Sprayed the carrot top with a mild solution of Jeys Fluid
Sowed between onions.
None works as good as fleece
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What about the tall container method - does that work (I have this year put carrots in a dustbin)? Will I still need fleece?!
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Should be OK in a dustbin without fleece... if the slugs don't lay off the fly will go hungry on my Lottie... >:(
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I had some in a dustbin last year(although it was my first year for everything)it was a haven for wood lice and snails :-X
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i fleece mine & sow in a wide trench like you would sow peas, had a very good result too saves on thinning out,.
try this link
http://www.marshalls-seeds.co.uk/vegetable-plant-growing-advice-ggid45.html
all i know on these little beggers is they only fly 18" high as they dont like hights!
and are around from march till june, touch wood they havent found mine yet next to the garlic :-\
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Quite a few well knowledgable gardeners on this site have said it time and time again about the carrot fly not being able to fly above 18" is a load of rubbish.
They only fly below 18" untill you plant your carrots in a 2ft 6" trench then they fly at the hight of 2ft 7"
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Planting your carrots surrounded by onions and chives seems to be the method for deterring carrot root fly that works best for me and other people I know. Crop rotation is also essential.
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I've edged one side of the roots bed with Welsh onions in the hope it might help to deter them.
Janet
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Scorzonera is a companion plant for carrots - it's supposed to repel carrot fly.
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have a read!!
http://www.wernethallotsoc.org.uk/problems/carrot-root-fly.php
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carrot fly are a very small, weak-flying insect, and according to some can't fly very high from the ground.
Leaves and Snow-Flakes are also very weak flyers, but that does not stop them being BLOWN OVER my 7ft high fence!!!
Fleece them, or lose them!
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and according to some can't fly very high from the ground.
It has also been said that bumble bees cannot fly.
I would assume that somewhere in the region of 18" above ground level is probably an optimum height for accurate carrot location and as such the fly chooses to cruise at this heirgt. It would almost certainly fly higher should it find itself in a non-productive area then it would home in on far weaker carrot signals.
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Is it more a problem on allotments where lots of people are growing them, might it be easier to grow them in the garden at home. Just a thought. (I have them, but only occasionally) ;D ;D ;D.
Janet
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have to agree with you there Grannyjanny. as i only ever have the odd attack with or without covering but i am strict about rotaton and they are never planted in the same place twice iykwim.