Author Topic: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.  (Read 1361 times)

elhuerto

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #20 on: November 07, 2017, 12:50:26 »
Goji berries - lacking in flavour, spreads all over the place and spent more time digging out the roots than spitting out the berries (but only just). Agree on cucamelons too.
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terrier

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #21 on: November 07, 2017, 20:12:26 »
Oca and Salsify are shall I or shan't I crops, I grew Oca for the tasty foliage, what few roots I got were for growing next season and Salsify again seems to be more to eat above ground than below, the problem is getting the whole root out of the ground, every bit that breaks off grows a new plant next season.

galina

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #22 on: November 07, 2017, 21:22:49 »
Deb, I certainly agree on ocra - can't make that one work either.  Melon much the same until this year when suddenly one variety just worked.  In the greenhouse - and the melon was Petit Gris de Rennes.  I've saved seeds and will grow them again.  Fully ripe they were just so delicious.  Also for the first time I have grown Kohl Rabi and they are great.  Cabbage type top leaves and nice crunchy bulbous below. 

I agree about sharks fin's melon  - they were huge this year.  Nice for making pickles and the Spanish make jam out of them.  The soup with crab sticks sounds great - will try that, thanks Saddad. 

I tried lablab beans this year and they did nothing but flower a bit.  Disappointing.  On the other hand the achocha very fabulous. 

I tried Salsola Soda a few years back.  Didn't germinate either.  I complained and got another packet.  The seeds have to be very, very fresh.  Seeds don't last at all.  Second attempt germinated very well and grew quickly too into biggish plants.  Unfortunately we didn't then like the flavour much, pity.   

I actually like cucamelons very much, nice crunchy snacky little bits, halved in a salad, very nice.  But mostly snacked out of hand in the greenhouse.  I have also pickled them instead of cucumber and that worked well too.

Every radish has nice crunchy seed pods, not just Rat's Tail.  Just that Rat's tail bypasses the root stage.  Any of the longish rooted radishes has long seed pods and those make delicious salad ingredients.  Round radishes tend to have shorter seed pods but the longer seedpods are better to munch on.  :wave: 

Rats tail radish
Khol Rabi
Okra....too much effort for sod all result!
I would add all melons as they are my nemesis and I've tried all sorts of varieties in all sorts of settings and have yet to grow a melon bigger than a tennis ball. I can however grow Sharks fin melons bigger than basketballs but sadly they are not as nice to eat! And grow like Triffids!


Vinlander

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #23 on: November 08, 2017, 12:44:28 »
Just noticed Florence doesn't like salsify - well I wouldn't eat it raw...

However I love everything else about it.

It is absolutely trouble free - even the volunteers are no trouble - I can't see how any crop that you eat before it flowers can ever be a real pest - as soon as it is big enough to annoy it's big enough to eat.

It's good in soups and stews but outstanding roasted and the flavour is unique - nearly - scorzonera is almost the same except it has more pests so the bigger and blacker it gets the more likely you are going to actually have to peel it and perform surgery. Worse, it won't stand waterlogging that parsnips and salsify don't even notice.

Also the flowers of scorzonera are boring compared to the rich purple blooms of salsify (Jack-go-to-bed-at-noon) - https://rockcottageyear.files.wordpress.com/2014/05/dsc_0071.jpg

I don't want to rant, but whatever you think about the French they know about food and they love salsify - they even buy it bottled. It's pricey though - presumably for eating out of season.

Cheers.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2017, 12:58:33 by Vinlander »
With a microholding you always get too much or bugger-all. (I'm fed up calling it an allotment garden - it just encourages the tidy-police).

The simple/complex split is more & more important: Simple fertilisers Poor, complex ones Good. Simple (old) poisons predictable, others (new) the opposite.

galina

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #24 on: November 08, 2017, 17:30:43 »
Ahh Vinlander, but Scorzonera has one huge feature in its favour.  Salsify is annual and you can't eat the roots in the second year.  On less than ideal, stony and clayey soils the roots don't get that big in a year.  Scorzonera on the other hand can be left for a second year, tucked away in a corner and then the roots are huge.   I love both of them but there is much more food from scorzonera. 

Having said this, I spaced my salsify roots well, then harvested only from the largest in an attempt to get better roots and that has worked fairly well.  Still nowhere near as big as my two year old scorzonera, but definitely bigger.

The foliage of both can be eaten as spring greens, but I prefer to cook them, not eat them as lettuce substitute like some suggest.  I have not yet tried it, but apparently breaded and deep fried flower buds are a real delicacy.  :wave:

squeezyjohn

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #25 on: November 08, 2017, 21:38:16 »
I don't want to rant, but whatever you think about the French they know about food and they love salsify - they even buy it bottled

I've been served some dreadful stuff in France including tripe ... and they make tea using a microwave.  Nuff said!

George the Pigman

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #26 on: November 09, 2017, 19:01:32 »
Well I definitely agree about cucamelons, goji berries and okra.
I found the yield of Kohl Rabi, scorzonera and salsify was so poor that I eventually gave up. Also gave up on Florence Fennel and eventually on Celeriac. I gave up on Kiwi Fruit and eventually Hamburg Parsley
Asparagus Pea for me is borderline-you have to pick the pods early otherwise they turn hard and inedible.
Rat Tailed Radish I don't find a problem. We have a good crop each year and they are lovely to give a bite to salads.

Though I suppose a lot depends on your local climate and soil.

squeezyjohn

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #27 on: November 09, 2017, 20:13:37 »
I suppose a lot of what can make a crop not worth it is down to the soil and climate on your plot - that seems to be a sub-category here.

I would urge anyone who has given up on kohl rabi because of poor yield to try the variety "Gigant" one last time before giving up on it completely.  Not only are the heads up to 10 times the size of other types, the flesh is also sweeter and crisper with no woodiness (at least on my plot).  I used to feel the same way about florence fennel but I've got a lovely crop coming on outdoors that were sown in to modules at the beginning of August and planted out in September ... they seem to grow much bigger and better in the cool temperatures and wet weather of Autumn.

Seacarrot

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #28 on: November 11, 2017, 13:31:08 »
I Tried Brokali this year - the blurb said.... This variety is a cross between broccoli and kale, which is why the spelling is as it is.

Atlantis will produce small but well formed heads of delicious sweet green with long tender shoots and is a cross between Chinese and European Broccoli.

I had a few nice plants, which quickly bolted into full flower, then smothered in White fly, so the lot got composted. The End.
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Beersmith

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #29 on: November 11, 2017, 23:02:18 »
Salsify has been mentioned a couple of times but curiously the criticism seems to relate to poor yields. I've never found it difficult to produce decent yields. Also it tastes pretty good too. The real problem and the reason I stopped growing it was it's digestibility.  To be blunt it makes you fart. And how! Volumes of gas you would not believe.

Apologies if that is too much information for some.

Cheers

P.S I strongly disagree that celeriac or Florence fennel should fall into the straight to bin category. Neither difficult to grow and both taste great.
Not mad, just out to mulch!

Vinlander

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #30 on: November 12, 2017, 00:29:15 »
Salsify has been mentioned a couple of times but curiously the criticism seems to relate to poor yields. I've never found it difficult to produce decent yields. Also it tastes pretty good too. The real problem and the reason I stopped growing it was it's digestibility.  To be blunt it makes you fart. And how! Volumes of gas you would not believe

Ah, now there's a story - the thing that makes the gas is a sort of sugar (polysaccharide) called inulin. Lots of plants use it to store energy, but it is almost indigestible in our non-specialist digestive systems (I'm pretty sure true herbivores have no problem).

So basically you have a sugar appearing in your lower digestive system because your body has ignored it.

For the bacteria down there it's Xmas and a gazillion other excuses for a party and the result is gas and a bacterial population explosion.

As it happens, this can make your guts more healthy - more friendly bacteria and everything moving more quickly - lots of benefits to your overall health including less cancer etc.

The same things and benefits happen when you eat plant fibres, so nutritionists confusingly refer to "soluble fibre" meaning stuff like inulin (that aren't fibre they just have the same effects).

Now here's the punchline - it is the latest "wonder food" and lots and lots of companies are dying to sell you their inulin extracts for between 13 and 50 a kilo!

Fresh jerusalem artichoke can contain about 10-18g of inulin per kilo (depending on how you read the wiki page) so they would like to charge you about 10 for what you can harvest by planting one root in one square foot of land and waiting 6 or 7 months.

The powder is certain to make you fart just as much, but either they recommend a tiny (and probably useless) dose or it isn't actually what they say it is (which is also useless).

Basically, if like me you've had an allotment for a year or more and you like root veg, then you will have got used to it and will be reaping the health benefits - I have no problem at all with salsify, but if you lived on mostly McGarbage etc. it would be a big shock, and you could probably put those kind of people into low earth orbit by feeding them jerusalem artichokes (where they'd suffocate instead of dying of cancer).

Cheers.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2017, 00:34:08 by Vinlander »
With a microholding you always get too much or bugger-all. (I'm fed up calling it an allotment garden - it just encourages the tidy-police).

The simple/complex split is more & more important: Simple fertilisers Poor, complex ones Good. Simple (old) poisons predictable, others (new) the opposite.

Beersmith

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #31 on: November 12, 2017, 14:50:07 »
Vinlander,

Very interesting comments.

I'm not a veggie but only eat meat 3-4 times a week and consume quite a lot of fruit and veg. Sadly I've never been able to adapt to salsify. I could try a long term trial to adjust but fear Mrs Beersmith would sue for divorce before I succeeded.  Interesting mention of Jerusalem artichokes - same problem.

Cheers
Not mad, just out to mulch!

Silverleaf

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #32 on: November 13, 2017, 00:27:57 »
I think some people never get used to inulin no matter how much they eat.

Plot 18

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #33 on: November 13, 2017, 09:06:49 »
Yes, many people are intolerant, some even classify it as an allergy....

Vinlander

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #34 on: November 14, 2017, 11:16:39 »
Yes, many people are intolerant, some even classify it as an allergy....

That's ironic, since inulin has been used and is still recommended to make stuff sweet for diabetics - no bitter taste and no possibility of it being banned (so far every artificial sweetener has proved to be evil - many, maybe all, can actually cause diabetes).

Nobody who eats root/stem storage vegetables can avoid it completely - but if it's possible to tone it down by breeding then it could increase the varieties available to people who find it a problem.

I'd actually eat more artichokes than potatoes if it could be tamed without "throwing the flavour out with the bathwater". I prefer the flavour to potatoes - and no blight problem.

Cheers.

With a microholding you always get too much or bugger-all. (I'm fed up calling it an allotment garden - it just encourages the tidy-police).

The simple/complex split is more & more important: Simple fertilisers Poor, complex ones Good. Simple (old) poisons predictable, others (new) the opposite.

rowbow

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #35 on: November 15, 2017, 11:02:36 »
Yes, many people are intolerant, some even classify it as an allergy....

That's ironic, since inulin has been used and is still recommended to make stuff sweet for diabetics - no bitter taste and no possibility of it being banned (so far every artificial sweetener has proved to be evil - many, maybe all, can actually cause diabetes).

Nobody who eats root/stem storage vegetables can avoid it completely - but if it's possible to tone it down by breeding then it could increase the varieties available to people who find it a problem.

I'd actually eat more artichokes than potatoes if it could be tamed without "throwing the flavour out with the bathwater". I prefer the flavour to potatoes - and no blight problem.

Cheers.

One of my friends gave me some oca tubers, they taste like new potatoes with a hint of lemon, easy to grow not affected by blight.  :icon_cheers: (no side effects)
Spring has arrived I am so excited I have wet my PLANTS

George the Pigman

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #36 on: November 15, 2017, 20:20:23 »
I've had the same experience with Jerusalem Fartichokes. Unfortunately if you have irritable bowel syndrome or diverticular disease these non-fermented polysaccharides like inulin can cause lots of problems - the gas triggering attacks. I developed the latter condition a few years ago so they are all now definitely off the menu for me.

Thanks for the tip about Gigant Kohl Rabi - I'll have a go at that next year.
Also for the tip of growing the Florence Fennel in the Autumn. It makes sense. They need to be kept moist at all times otherwise they bolt. I love Florence Fennel - and its supposed to be good for controlling gas!!
« Last Edit: November 15, 2017, 20:24:04 by George the Pigman »

Vinlander

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Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #37 on: November 17, 2017, 10:41:39 »
That reminds me - other ways of taming Fartichokes have turned up on this forum.

1) Roasting them unpeeled (scrubbed) and whole until they turn into delicious bags of sweet smoky savoury mush - this just means putting them in with the potatoes at the start of the roast (I recommend guinea fowl over chicken for the taste that chickens used to have, organic chicken is a massive improvement but isn't as close).

Putting them in later with the parsnips doesn't cut it.

This method (for me) removes the pain entirely by making them no worse than the parsnips; so I haven't tried going slower and longer, but anyone who has a problem should try it... whatever the chemistry is (?), it works better with a long slow roast.

2) Winter Savory has been recommended by TV experts for Fartichokes, and though Wiki doesn't mention this it does say it is a traditional cure for flatulence.  My bush died before I heard this so I'm looking for a new one to give it a go.  That would hopefully make it possible to 'fix' the problem of quick cooking so I could make them into soup -  it's probably the best soup in the world.

I haven't tried putting the normal quick soup into a slow cooker for hours - I really must try that - certainly less work than doing a special roast for soup (though it's so different from roasting it might not work).

Cheers.
With a microholding you always get too much or bugger-all. (I'm fed up calling it an allotment garden - it just encourages the tidy-police).

The simple/complex split is more & more important: Simple fertilisers Poor, complex ones Good. Simple (old) poisons predictable, others (new) the opposite.

Allotments 4 All

Re: "Novelties" = best picked straight into into the compost bin.
« Reply #37 on: November 17, 2017, 10:41:39 »

 

anything