Author Topic: pea and bean failure  (Read 2765 times)

cambourne7

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pea and bean failure
« on: June 29, 2017, 23:47:00 »
Hi All,

I have planted 3 times now multiple beans and peas some saved and some newer seed and so far i have got 1 plant !! one !!

What have i been doing wrong so far i have tried

- planting in toilet rolls
- planting in place
- planting in modules

Using seed compost and have tried a mix of the fen black/mushroom compost i have in my beds.

Used both tap and rain water

HELP

Cam

galina

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Re: pea and bean failure
« Reply #1 on: June 30, 2017, 06:22:00 »
Sorry you are having such problems.  Are these for the greenhouse or outdoors?  It isn't so much the planting medium (ordinary compost from the supermarket and tap water should do fine to get them started), but maybe the watering regime and the temperature.  It can get very hot in the greenhouse, unless you leave doors open or have automatic roof vents etc.  White seeded beans are very sensitive to over watering. 

You don't say how old the seeds are, but I remember an earlier post about you having left your seeds in the greenhouse over winter and that could have reduced their viability considerably.  I think this is the reason for your problems rather than compost or method of seed starting. 

I would start again with a new packet of early beans and mangetout peas, as time is marching on.  Or see if the local garden centre still sell a tray of runner beans for planting out.

Best of luck Cambourne  :wave:

Hi All,

I have planted 3 times now multiple beans and peas some saved and some newer seed and so far i have got 1 plant !! one !!

What have i been doing wrong so far i have tried

- planting in toilet rolls
- planting in place
- planting in modules

Using seed compost and have tried a mix of the fen black/mushroom compost i have in my beds.

Used both tap and rain water

HELP

Cam

Plot22

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Re: pea and bean failure
« Reply #2 on: June 30, 2017, 06:48:08 »
I have a row of Hurst Green Shaft peas and half a row of Robinsons which I saved the seed from last year. Both varieties have done very well with almost 100% germination. I soak the peas for about 15 minutes in tepid water and discard the ones that float. I them chit them on damp kitchen towel. After a week to 10 days in a dark cupboard they have chitted and I sow them at the allotment. The mice do not bother them if they are chitted and they are emerging from the soil in just over a week if I keep them watered. I also soak French Beans and Runner Beans (Firestorm) but instead of chitting them I grow them in pots in the greenhouse before transferring them to the allotment as I do not need the same quantity that I need with peas.
I always save some pea seeds from the previous year and have in fact set pea seeds that are several years old with very similar results.
« Last Edit: June 30, 2017, 06:51:09 by plot22 »

Digeroo

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Re: pea and bean failure
« Reply #3 on: June 30, 2017, 07:07:58 »
It is so frustrating when this happens.  I had a lot of problems last year.

I put peas and beans into damp kitchen roll and cover with plastic and put on north windowsill.  A check after a few days to make sure that the paper is still damp.

Try again on Wednesday 5th, it is a good day for peas and beans. 





ancellsfarmer

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Re: pea and bean failure
« Reply #4 on: June 30, 2017, 09:09:56 »
Would suggest that you plant peas 25mm deep,25mm apart in moist compost* ,well compressed. and then do not water until you see them emerging.Temperature to be moderate, 15deg C. Partial shade is fine. Typically visible in 5-7 days, green in 10 days, ready to plant out 14-18 days
*I use metre lengths of plastic gutterfitted with end caps; with 5mm holes drilled at 15cm centres along the lower edges, 6mm above bottom
Freelance cultivator qualified within the University of Life.

Paulines7

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Re: pea and bean failure
« Reply #5 on: June 30, 2017, 11:43:10 »
I am sorry to hear about your pea and bean failure, Cam.   I always start mine off wrapped in warm damp kitchen roll, put into a polythene bag with a label and placed in the airing cupboard.  They need checking daily and some may have started the next day so take those out as soon as they have sprouted and put them into modules filled with multi purpose or seed compost.  Put them on a shelf in the greenhouse if it is not too hot as they will be less likely to be eaten by mice/voles/shrews etc.

I have some spare Moonlight runner beans if you would like them and may have some sugar snaps.  Please send me a pm with your address if you would like me to send you some.

lottie lou

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Re: pea and bean failure
« Reply #6 on: June 30, 2017, 18:31:07 »
Sorry to hear of your probs Cam.  Rest assured you are not the only one having problems.  Worst year ever fo pea, beans, pumpkin and courgettes.  Must be cos I've lost airing cupboard - went for combi boiler and walk in shower just in case I got old

saddad

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Re: pea and bean failure
« Reply #7 on: July 01, 2017, 21:50:32 »
my broad bans failed to germinate too.. got about a dozen from 72 beans,,, but they are now in pod so I'll  be eating fresh Broad Beans any day now..

picman

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Re: pea and bean failure
« Reply #8 on: July 02, 2017, 09:44:29 »
I don't plant peas in pots or anything, straight into the ground when its warming up, always lime the drill  well ( Mag lime is best ) put in lots of seed I mean lots ... a good soaking then lime again after covering the seed . I then use small plastic mess (15mm Sq) over the top to the row to stop the mice ! They are in a net cage to stop the pheasant ! I was a bit late this year so just in flower, might get the pea moth :( 
Photo late May
« Last Edit: July 02, 2017, 09:50:21 by picman »

cambourne7

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Re: pea and bean failure
« Reply #9 on: July 13, 2017, 00:14:34 »
Hi All,

Thanks for the updates, Mother in Law has not been well so a lot of my time has been spent with her so appologies for the delay in getting back to you all xx

The seeds were all bought just before christmas so fairly new and in date appart from one which i got in the last seed swap in birmingham get together.

I am going to try germinating some on a wet towel and see what that brings as digeroo suggested and a second lot as pacman suggested and see how we get on after that i will just buy some plants :)
Paulines7 thanks for the offer its very kind but for now will try the seeds i have to see if there the issue :)

thanks all xx

cam

Tee Gee

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Re: pea and bean failure
« Reply #10 on: July 13, 2017, 10:27:09 »
Quote
Rest assured you are not the only one having problems.  Worst year ever fo pea, beans, pumpkin and courgettes.

I have noticed that seed problems have increased a great deal over the last few years and I am putting much of it down to what has happened to amateur gardening over the last few years.

For example there has been a proliferation in organic gardening,peat free composts,banning of some herbicides and pesticides,weather change ( global warming), and this is the biggest factor of all I think.

We don't see the same weather patterns anymore that is; it is often quite warm when we would expect it to be cold ( milder winters) it is dryer when we expect it to be wet (April showers spring to mind)

We seem to get extremes in heat & cold rather than a gradual phasing in of warmer temperatures, e.g I heard the weatherman on TV last night predicting light frosts in some areas.

Apart from affecting us humans what are all these changes doing to the flora and fauna?

I know I tend to use seeds that I have tried and tested over the years simply because they work for me but many of these do not seem to be as good as they once were.

I get to thinking that all these things above are affecting the metabolism of plants,in particular seed production. I often think the seeds/ plants that are deemed indigenous to the UK are being affected by these changes.

Then there is the insect food chain which I think has also changed for example some pests were culled during cold winter months thus keeping their numbers down,others appeared when the weather warmed up and it is these I think most of all are the ones that are being affected,I am thinking mostly of the pollinators, that is there are fewer of them and I think this is an indigenous thing.

I noticed last spring(April 2016) it was quite warm so out came the insect life only to find that although it was warm there were very few pollen laden flowers about for them to feed on. Then May turned out very cold and I think many of the hungry  insects were killed off before they could perform their reproduction cycle.

I know a few of us noticed last year that their were fewer ladybirds and hover flies to keep the aphids down,plus there were fewer bees so possibly less pollination took place resulting in a higher percentage of non- viable seeds being produced.

Trouble is: we only find that such events manifest themselves the  following year when we sow the seed produced from the previous year.

Strange how I have good germination from seeds that are from pre 2016 ( part packets) than I have had from newly purchased seed, could much of what I have written above be true rather than speculation?

I think this is a problem the gardeners of the future are going to have to contend with, so I wish them the best of luck.

And notice.........I have only discussed natures part in this.......just think when you fetch commercialism into the calculation, what will happen when the seed merchants find more ways to cut costs even further.

So in conclusion I ask;are my thoughts too pessimistic and that I imagining things?

 I hope so for gardening sake!






Paulh

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Re: pea and bean failure
« Reply #11 on: July 13, 2017, 22:19:15 »
I think what you say is part of the story but alongside those external factors there is the commercial pressure to which you allude, and I think that this has resulted in declining standards over the last few years (whatever quality standards exist that seed companies are supposed to meet). I feel I get fewer seeds in a packet, they look poorer quality and they produce poorer results.

Or may be I'm just getting to be a grumpy old man (as my t-shirt says).

squeezyjohn

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Re: pea and bean failure
« Reply #12 on: July 13, 2017, 22:50:43 »
There is something happening with the climate which definitely feels noticeable ... they call it global warming, but global weirding is a better term as it is making extreme weather more likely and patterns less predictable.

As for your seeds, TeeGee ... the seed men have been conning us punters for longer than just recently!  I've read victorian writings which are every bit as suspicious of the seed men as your post is ... the best thing I ever did was to ditch hybrids and try to find the best true-breeding varieties and add seed-saving to my gardening routine along with isolation cages and everything.

It really works ... self-saved seeds have proved to have massively better germination rates ... a lot of them are the favourite old varieties too like Tender & True parsnip and Aquadulce Claudia broad beans.  I got nearly 100% germination rates from last years parsnips!

Tee Gee

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Re: pea and bean failure
« Reply #13 on: July 14, 2017, 00:41:01 »
Quote
the best thing I ever did was to ditch hybrids and try to find the best true-breeding varieties and add seed-saving to my gardening routine along with isolation cages and everything.

I basically agree with you John but I don't tend to go as far as you with the seed saving.

For example I never buy  runner,French or broad beans Plus  I also save such veg as tomatoes, sweet and chilli peppers to name a few, but with brassicas I don't save them for two reasons and they are :

It's too much of a hassle to collect the seed so I buy hybrids as opposed to open pollinated varieties because I usually get what it says on the packet.

The only problem I find with these is they all tend to mature together which is understandable when you consider they have been bred for the commercial growers for that very reason, as it means they can automate harvesting.

I have sometimes saved cucumber,courgette and squashes and have even saved potato varieties such as PFA and Charlottes as these tend to be quite expensive relative to the more run of the mill varieties.

As An aside: I mentioned in another post I have had  problems with the Charlottes I bought this year but not with the ones I saved from last year so my feelings there are this is down to the seed supplier.

So I agree with saving things such as these simply because I can be more selective on what I save  unlike the seed merchants who deal in bulk collection which to me must increase the chances of some shall we say dodgy seeds getting through their quality control systems.

Then when you get to the prices well that is a rip off at least it is with the big names in the trade so I sometimes shop around and I am not against going to £ shops on occasions.

A few years ago seeds used to cost a fraction of a penny per seed now they often cost pennies per seed and I have even seen cucumbers sold at £1 a seed.

I think everyone will have now got my drift regarding what I think on how much things have changed for the amateur gardener over recent years so I am not going to say any more on the subject.

BTW Camborne: Sorry for hijacking you thread but at least I think you will see that your problems are not quite of your own making as many of us are having similar experiences as you....Tg



Borderers1951

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Re: pea and bean failure
« Reply #14 on: July 16, 2017, 10:04:37 »
I had a problem earlier in the year when mice ate almost all the newly planted seeds.  If you planted them in cells of compost the tell-tale signs of feasting mice are little holes where the seeds had been extracted.  Directly planted seeds can be harder to detect but that does not mean they haven't been feeding the rodent pea-bandits.  On here I was advised to soak the seeds in paraffin.  I did so and was lucky enough to get another few rows planted in time for a crop.

Borderers1951

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Re: pea and bean failure
« Reply #15 on: July 16, 2017, 13:42:53 »
Further to my previous post:  Many years ago, my regiment returned at the end of June from a deployment overseas.   On checking my old notebooks, I find that I planted a couple of rows of peas in about mid-July and got reasonable returns in late September/early October.  I didn't make a note of the variety but Dr Hessayon's book advises plating an early variety at this time of year.  I was living in Wiltshire at the time and had the advantage of a mild climate.  This idea may not be of use if you live further north, however, you might like to consider it.

 

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