Author Topic: Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?  (Read 2584 times)

woodypecks

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Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
« on: May 16, 2017, 20:10:36 »
I,m growing a Heritage variety of Squash and because I am going to share out the seeds and want to keep them pure , I can not grow any other Squashes in my garden this year ...but ...I was wondering ..can I still grow Cucumbers ?
Would Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
Anyone know ? I need to be really sure or may be best not  to grow them at all this year ? :coffee2:   Thanks in advance
  :wave: Debbie
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galina

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Re: Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
« Reply #1 on: May 16, 2017, 20:26:31 »
There is good news and bad news for you Woodypecks.  Bad news - squash can easily be crossed by squashes growing in your neighbour's garden or your neighbour's neighbour's garden.  Bees will travel quite a distance and the large flowers of any squash are very attractive to them.  So I really recommend isolating and handpollination every time with squash unless you live a significant distance from other squash growers.

There are crossing barriers between different species of squash, not every squash can cross with every other, it matters what type it is, what species.  Often seed sellers will tell you the species.  In an isolated garden you can grow one cucurbita pepo (for example a courgette), one cucurbita maxima (for example an Uchiki Kuri), one cucurbita moschata (a butternut)  and none will cross with each other.  But your cucurbita pepo can cross with another 100 yards away, unfortunately and so could the others.  For them not to cross with the neighbours, you need to live without squash growing neighbours. 

Howerer there is NO danger at all of squash crossing with cucumbers, you are safe there.  :wave: 
« Last Edit: May 16, 2017, 20:33:20 by galina »

Digeroo

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Re: Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
« Reply #2 on: May 17, 2017, 05:08:05 »
Bee travel quite a distance.  We had someone with a hive at the allotments and the bees were quite distinctive, and about a mile away there were loads of them in my garden.   So not only do you need to not have squash growing neighbours but possible the entire town needs to be squash free.

You will have to play bee and pollinated the flowers yourself. Keep the flowers in a paper bag and use an elastic band to keep the flower closed after you have pollinated.  They are not only pollinated by a bees but also small black pollen beetles so you need to keep the flower well sealed off.   

galina

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Re: Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
« Reply #3 on: May 17, 2017, 07:26:11 »
Woodypecks, I put together a short 'how to isolate/handpollinate squashes' with pictures.  Maybe you find it of interest.  https://www.allotments4all.co.uk/smf/index.php/topic,79990.msg813910.html#msg813910

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woodypecks

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Re: Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
« Reply #4 on: May 17, 2017, 22:33:33 »
Galina and Digeroo , thankyou so much for all this info . I am quite a long way away from anyone..but will try and pollenate them myself as advised . Thanks again Debbie   :coffee2:
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Digeroo

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Re: Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
« Reply #5 on: May 18, 2017, 04:33:54 »
Just looked at your profile, what a lovely place.   

woodypecks

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Re: Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
« Reply #6 on: May 20, 2017, 20:34:49 »
Galina -- I,m really going to have to watch those flower buds then !
 Digeroo - Thanks....the garden is my playground :)
 I,m growing the Gete -okosomin squash ........ hopefully  . Only one of four seeds generously given to me has germinated , I sowed three and saved one to try again  next year .
 Hope to share out seeds from mine hopefully after harvest to anyone who might be interested .
  The story of this Squash has changed along the way , but it is still a very interesting and indeed a Native American Indian heritage seed  .
   I,ve met new friends and learned new wisdom of nurturing the Earth and ways of growing vegetables and fruit . I,m enjoying being part of the story .
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Digeroo

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Re: Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
« Reply #7 on: May 21, 2017, 06:05:33 »
Not sure your can get a squash of the same variety if you do not have two plants.  You need a male from a different plant of the same variety. 

Has the non germinated seed rotted off. Press the seed gently and if white oozes out, then it is useless.
If the seed it still hard I would suggest more heat.  It the seeds are still hard, I would suggest damaging the seed at the round end.  I put mine in damp kitchen roll and then put in a plastic bag and put on a sunny windowsill. 
I took some squash seeds to Crete on holiday and left on the table in the full heat of the sun and every squash and courgette seed germinated in two days.

johhnyco15

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Re: Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
« Reply #8 on: May 21, 2017, 06:13:07 »
no cucumbers cannot cross with squashes  however as said in previous reply squashes can cross however i believe the  fruit comes good to variety only the seeds may differ if grown hope this helps
johhnyc015  may the plot be with you

Digeroo

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Re: Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
« Reply #9 on: May 21, 2017, 10:05:05 »
I have had another idea, can you beg a male flower from the person who gave you the seeds.  Or use a feather to pick up a little pollen. You do not need much.

Silverleaf

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Re: Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
« Reply #10 on: May 21, 2017, 11:09:18 »
Not sure your can get a squash of the same variety if you do not have two plants.  You need a male from a different plant of the same variety. 

You just need a male flower and a female flower, they can be on the same plant or different ones.

Some plants are self-incompatible and have mechanisms in place that prevent them from pollinating themselves (brassicas are an example of this iirc) but squash doesn't care at all.

You can absolutely get fertile seeds from a single squash plant, but in practice you've got more chance of finding a female and a male flower open at the same time if you have multiple plants.

galina

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Re: Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
« Reply #11 on: May 22, 2017, 04:49:36 »
Not sure your can get a squash of the same variety if you do not have two plants.  You need a male from a different plant of the same variety. 


Like Silverleaf said, you can use a male and a female flower from the same plant, that's called 'selfing'.  There is no barrier to this.  If possible use a second plant, just for a bit more genetic variability (the very minute differences from one plant of the same variety to another).  Also for practical reasons, it gives you more chances to have a female and a male flower at the same stage of maturity.  For this reason I would also suggest sowing the remaining seed (and fingers crossed for the others!).  But there is no problem with selfing if that's how it works out  .  :wave:
« Last Edit: May 22, 2017, 04:53:10 by galina »

woodypecks

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Re: Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
« Reply #12 on: May 23, 2017, 08:10:36 »
Thanks for all your tips and ideas folks .
 The seeds came from a friend in America and I am very lucky to have got them .
Out of four - I saved one for next year ...sown three... only one came up ..the others are still in the greenhouse , I haven't totally given up on them ...but anyway , the one  that has come up is now in its next size up pot and looking good .  It sounds a bit scary , to tie up the flower buds etc , but I'm going to give it my best shot .
 Also , I always thought that the Squashes have male and female flowers on the same plant ...if I,m wrong then I might as well give up now   :BangHead: Debbie  :wave:
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galina

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Re: Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
« Reply #13 on: May 23, 2017, 08:33:59 »
  It sounds a bit scary , to tie up the flower buds etc , but I'm going to give it my best shot .
 Also , I always thought that the Squashes have male and female flowers on the same plant ...if I,m wrong then I might as well give up now   :BangHead: Debbie  :wave:

Yes they do have both male and female on the same plant.  But with just one plant you have fewer chances of having both a male and a female at the same stage of development.  You need to tie them the evening before they would open naturally.  When they are large buds and both male and female need to be at the same stage.  A bit of observation on how squash flowers develop and you will get there.  They need to be handpollinated in the morning the following day.  Then the female retied to stop further pollen access to the hand pollinated female.  If tying is not what you like to do, you can use wedding favour bags or home made blossom bags (out of net curtain material).  But tying is easier and the flowers are nice and big to work with.  Good luck  :wave:

galina

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Re: Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
« Reply #14 on: May 23, 2017, 08:45:44 »
I have looked on the internet to research your squash woodypecks.  It is a rare native Indian cucurbita maxima squash with brown seeds, slightly similar to a Pink Banana squash.  It is in the same species as Crown Prince, Buttercup and Uchiki Kuri squashes.  Good luck with it.  :wave:

woodypecks

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Re: Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
« Reply #15 on: May 25, 2017, 20:06:51 »
Thankyou Galina ..you are a star ! I'm sure I can do this . It is in its next size up pot in my husbands solar shed at the moment ..I need to be sure it has it's roots really growing away before I put it outside .
It has two tiny buds coming already . If I see that I have a male and female flower , I,m thinking maybe to pollinate while it is still here in the shed ?
    I grew the Pink Banana Squash last year...enormous ..and so creamy in texture when cooked , really lovely . The Gete -okosomin is said to be delicious too .
 Thankyou ever so much for your really useful instructions on how to pollinate the flowers..and I,m sure that other people will be interested too .  Debbie   :sunny:
 
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Silverleaf

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Re: Could Cucumbers cross with Squash ?
« Reply #16 on: May 27, 2017, 07:20:49 »
Thankyou Galina ..you are a star ! I'm sure I can do this . It is in its next size up pot in my husbands solar shed at the moment ..I need to be sure it has it's roots really growing away before I put it outside .
It has two tiny buds coming already . If I see that I have a male and female flower , I,m thinking maybe to pollinate while it is still here in the shed ?
    I grew the Pink Banana Squash last year...enormous ..and so creamy in texture when cooked , really lovely . The Gete -okosomin is said to be delicious too .
 Thankyou ever so much for your really useful instructions on how to pollinate the flowers..and I,m sure that other people will be interested too .  Debbie   :sunny:
 

Your first few flowers will most likely be males - they usually make loads of males first until the plant gets bigger and then they start making females too, assuming the conditions are good.

 

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