Topic: Am I the only one who thinks this is dangerous?

[PurpleHeather]

OMG how very British.

Go abroad and you will see all sort of terrible things in other countries which will keep your gob smacked open so wide you wont be able to draw breath.

Actually it is not safe. I do agree.

Remeber though, this child is loved by her father/mother who is allowing this to happen.

NOW
Child A
There is the parent who is going out on their bike and they are leaving the child home alone.

The child is left alone and is stressed.

Child B
There is the parent who is going out on their bike and taking the child with them

The child is happy.

I do not know the risk of child B having an accident but I do know that child B is 100% unhappy.  Child A is stressed and that could cause probems

Think about it.

RISK is part of life


As a fifteen year old in the 1960s my most memorable experience is doing a ton without a crash helmet as the pillion on my then 18 year old boyfriend's motorbike.  The wind made a funny noise on my dangly earings I can still hear it now in my memory. It was totally legal  then and great fun



In the event of an accident or incident the authorities and the insurance companies will sort it out.

Most people survive unscathed. Some people do not.

We legislate for the majority. Quite right too.

 That is why we have those totally uncomfortable straps in cars called seat belts Hate them personally and I shove a large hand bag between me and them whilst riding as a passenger to stop them stangulating me.

Road safety? well the best idea would be to stay at home all the time. But who knows what might drop from the sky.

Kids used to play out. Now they stay home watch TV and play on computers.

Is that healthy?

It is not that I do not agree with you about road safety. It is that I think that there are things which are more important

[Hector]

Having worked in a Head Injury unit I strongly disagree that "most come out unscathed"

Roads are more heavily populated now and cars/bikes achieve higher speeds.

Many kids/adults who are not "strapped in" are the ones who rocket through windows and hi the tarmac....or hit the driver/front seat passenger killing them or causing major head and neck injuries.

Risk is a part of life, but as parents we have a responsibility to minimise it (within reasonable and legal limits) to protect children until they can make their own risk assessments/decisions.

Many kids do play out (mine included) and are healthy fit and well-balanced.

[Jeannine]

Absolutely Hector..totally agree with you..what more can I add..shh Jeannine

XX Jeannine

[saddad]

I cannot remember a time when it was "legal" to drive a motorbike at 100 mph?  :-X

[shirlton]

It doesn't really matter what our opinion is. I am sure that in this country it is against the law to have a  child on the back of a motorbike. Leathers or no leathers.

[brownowl23]

I have to say that health and safety rules and legislation are there for just that, to protect people especially children. Alot of people, and I have to say contravertially alot of older people think some of it unnecessary.

I have my own MIL who say let the boys ( my 3 year old twins) do what they want, what does it matter if the end up at A&E!! She wonders why i dont let her look after them.

The thing is that yes its is marginally better to have the kid riding pillion than being left at home. My biggest question would be where the hell is the drivers commonsense and care for the child.

Sadly alot of people just dont think of the consecquences of their actions and the impact it has on others.

Imagine if that kid had been accidentally knocked off that bike by the likes of me, a car driver, how would I have felt as a parent myself and would I have been able to live with myself for killing someone elses kid. No I wouldnt!!!!

[non-stick]

I dont believe there is any age limit for a pillion passenger. If I'm right the only criteria is that they can get both feet on the pegs and if under 17 (i think) need parental permission. I'm a rider and always wear full protective gear no matter what the weather and make sure any pillion does the same. Yes riding without a lid gives a great sense of freedom but so does life and being able to think. Brain damage caused by smacking tarmac at many miles per hour doesn.t.

I've just come back from two weeks in France and watching people hammering down the autoroutes on big bikes in flip-flops, shorts and t-shirts made me cringe. To be honest they might as well not use a lid as the mess they'd be in if they came off doesn't bear thinking about.

The enforcement of seatbelts has probably prevented no end of traumatic head and neck injuries caused by going through the windscreen, or into the back of a front-seat passenger/driver. Got to be worth any percieved discomfort (which would pale into insignificance against a smashed face/neck). Most modern ones are adjustable and you can buy gizmos for a better fit.

Five people a day were killed in traffic accidents last year and around 200k were injured over the year - that has to be important!

[davyw1]

Unfortunately the law is you must wear a crash helmet the rest is up to the individual.
I think it is irresponsible for any parent to a child at risk, and what responsible parent would leave a child alone at home or put them on the back of a motorcycle unprotected.
There is risk in every day life but you do your best to minimise it by taking the proper precautions

In the event of an accident or incident the authorities and the insurance companies will sort it out.

That statement is absolute crap.
Do you not think that the people who have to attend these accidents are not affected by what they see and have to deal with and since when has an insurance company brought a dead child back to life.
Try going to some ones house on Xmas eve to tell them that there daughter will not be attending the party as she has been killed in a motorcycle accident or even worse try taking a dead child from a distraught mother.

If the parent on the motorcycle attended just one motorcycle accident he would have his child wrapped in the best protective clothing you could buy.

What price do you put on a child's life

Most people that say " It wont happen to me " get away with it, some don't get to finish the sentence

[BarriedaleNick]

It doesn't really matter what our opinion is. I am sure that in this country it is against the law to have a  child on the back of a motorbike. Leathers or no leathers.

It isn't against the law per se, as far as I can tell as there is no age limit at all.  The issue has been raised in the HoP before but I think the law remained the same.  There is no requirement for anything other than a crash helmet and some vague mumblings about the bike being fitted with suitable pegs...

Only motorcyclists who have passed a motorcycle test can carry passengers. (Regulation 16 of the Motor Vehicles (Driving Licences) Regulations 1999)

The machine must be equipped with suitable supports or rests for the feet of the pillion passenger. (Regulation 102 of the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986)

Pillion passengers must be capable of sitting astride a proper seat securely fixed to the motorcycle.

This may require specific adaptations to accommodate young children. (Section 23(2) of the Road Traffic Act 1988)

A pillion passenger must wear a safety helmet. (Motor Cycles (Protective Helmets) Regulations 1998)

So what this chap did is not illegal - it may be dumb or not but there seems to be a bit of an over reaction if you ask me - god forbid that social services get involved.

[bikegirllisa]

This sort of thing makes me insane.  >:(  As a biker, and the wife of a biker, we both go mental when we see people riding along with a pillion with no protective gear.  What does he hope will protect her in the event of an accident?  Sun-block?  Jesus.  By all means, take risks with your own safety if you want to, but leave your kids out of it.  Grrr.

Whenever one of our kids is on the back of a bike with us (and they are 18 and 17 now), they are (and always were) wearing full protective gear, including a back protector. 

Risk is part of life - but not putting yourself in needless danger.  And the single biggest treasure you have as a parent is your kid.  Why would you EVER endanger that?

[Jeannine]

totally agree and frankly I cannot,no matter how hard I try, see another angle to this one.As far as I am concerned it is endangerement of a minor..chargable here

XX Jeannine

[BarriedaleNick]

Im just a bit surprised at how judgemental people can be when they don't have full knowledge of the facts.  For all we know it could have been the one and only time he did this,  we don't know how fast he was going or how long he was on the bike - suppose he was cruising along a 5mph and just to the end of the road and back - would that be so bad?  He was within the law regarding bikes and I think in the Uk we don't have specific endangerment laws (could be wrong) so you would have to allege child abuse..

[petengade]

 When on holiday in Thailand , seemed an everyday occurrence, dad with the crash helmet and mum and two children on a moped plus shopping on the handlebars

[1066]

When on holiday in Thailand , seemed an everyday occurrence, dad with the crash helmet and mum and two children on a moped plus shopping on the handlebars

That's because the man is (normally the main) the bread winner, and if you only buy 1 crash helmet, the bread winner will be wearing it.

[Emagggie]

Im just a bit surprised at how judgemental people can be when they don't have full knowledge of the facts.  For all we know it could have been the one and only time he did this,  we don't know how fast he was going or how long he was on the bike - suppose he was cruising along a 5mph and just to the end of the road and back - would that be so bad?  He was within the law regarding bikes and I think in the Uk we don't have specific endangerment laws (could be wrong) so you would have to allege child abuse..

and suppose some idiot had careered into them-not his fault re. the way he was riding his bike, but as for the consequenses to the child who was improperly clad-it doesn't bear thinking about.

[Jeannine]

Ask yourself this.If you had a visitor who had a bike and two hemets and he offered to take your child for a ride and it was in regular clothes or shorts would you let it go?

XX Jeannine

[BarriedaleNick]

Ask yourself this.If you had a visitor who had a bike and two hemets and he offered to take your child for a ride and it was in regular clothes or shorts would you let it go?

XX Jeannine

Unfortunately I don't have kids so can't comment but I certainly wouldn't condemn others for doing what they think is right.

[ACE]

Unfortunately I don't have kids so can't comment but I certainly wouldn't condemn others for doing what they think is right.

Because somebody thinks it is right, it doesn't follow that it is right. It is totally irresponsible to take a child on a motorcycle at any speed without proper protective clothing. Not against the law, but common sense should have been applied. I could not live with myself if my children were scarred because of my actions. But then I must have different values than some posters on here. Being a one time badassed biker, I could chose what I would wear, with children who know no different and sometimes no fear it is the parents responsibility to make sure they are safe.

[BarriedaleNick]

Because somebody thinks it is right, it doesn't follow that it is right.

Of course - which also means that just because you think somethink is right (in this case how to dress on a MB) - it doesn't follow that you are right either.  ;)
I just prefer not to judge people based on limited facts.  Was it dangerous? (original question) - Maybe? Maybe not? Probably not the safest thing in the world but not reason enough to get the authorites invovled as some have suggested.

I see children on the back of push bikes in London quite a lot - Helmets - DayGo "invisibility" jackets - proper mounted seats - sensible adult riders.  Is that safe?  Does it endanger the child? If an errant driver hits them then they are toast so according to some of the "logic" on this board they should be reported to Child Services.  What about kids on bikes - shouldn't they be banned as well.  What about smoking in the house with children - very dangerous - report them as well.

[Lishka]

back to the OP........so what did you do Betty?