Topic: Which Act takes precedence?

[Tin Shed]

A question for you all regarding Acts of Parliament.

A neighbour came round today to show the OH a final bill from a well known phone provider threatening baliff involvement if it remains unpaid. Our neighbour has various problems and is unable to speak. The phone has not worked for a while so I imagine that she thinks that she doesn't have to pay. Anyway OH rang up the provider on her behalf - as she cannot speak and her understanding is not too good either - and they refused to speak to him quoting the Data Protection Act [or another act - he can't remember!].
He asked them how this matter could be dealt with and got no answer.
Surely this is discrimination contravening the Equality Act - but which Act takes precedence? Which way forward  - as baliff involvement is not something she would be able to deal with and they will not let anyone else speak for her to help to try and resolve the problem.

Interestingly the local NHs Direct were quite happy to speak to me on her behalf in the past.

[Digeroo]

British Telecom are a real nightmare.  I ordered the internet and pay for it but becuase my husbands name is on the bill they will only talk to him.  What you need to do is get her to grunt a bit on the phone and thereby agree that they can talk to you.

Every other organisation tries to cooperate but BT is very prickly.  Other people allow two names on the bill so two people can deal with it, but not BT. 

I would suggest writing a letter and getting she to sign it saying you can deal with them on her behalf.  But do not hold your breathe about it.

If I was a man they would not know I was not my husband, so I do not know why there are so fussy.  They cannot give out information because of the Data protection act but this should not mean that they cannot take in information that you provide.

Since the bailiffs are involved I would suggest calling their legal department.  Surely the letter threatening the bailiffs has some kind of contact phone number on it.

[grannyjanny]

Is there someone else living in the house with her, who has used the phone if she cannot speak? Does she have an advocate to look after her interests?

 

[pumkinlover]

I would suggest the Citizens Advice Bureau, to help your neighbour and protect yourself.

[Tin Shed]

The neighbour does not have an advocat living near so usually comes round to us with any letters. A brother lives a distance away  -  we now have his phone number, he is aware of the situation and will follow it up.
Every business large or small has to have proceedures to deal with disabilties, but whoever the OH spoke to were happy to quote one Act, but appear to be able to ignore another!

This type attitude/discrimination makes me so angry especially as at work we try to ensure that everyone is aware of discrimination  -  sorry, rant over

[Unwashed]

A neighbour came round today to show the OH a final bill from a well known phone provider threatening baliff involvement if it remains unpaid.

Baliffs cannot get involved without a warrant of execution subsequent to a County Court Judgment, and if a creditor just threatens to "involve the baliffs" without the court order it's likely an offence under the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 and your neighbour would do well to write you a letter authorising you to make a complaint on her behalf to your local Trading Standards.

It's also likely an offence under tat act for the The phone company to refuse to discuss the issue with the creditor's appointed representative, though they are right that to discuss the issue with you without that appointment would be an offence under the Data Protection Act.

The phone company will have to have made reasonable adjustments to the provision of its service such that your disabled neighbour does not receive an inferior service because of her disability, and that will include provision for dealing with an unpaid bill, though your neighbour will have to tell the phone company what her disability is, or authorise you to discuss it with them.

[Digeroo]

I am sure you are right unwashed,  but if you loose the ability to use the phone, to read, to organise your affairs the world becomes a very hostile place.  Many of the call centre staff have no concept of the problems involved.

I have been trying to get various organisations to limit the number of words in a letter to a maximum of twelve.   

[Unwashed]

You might find it helpful to read the Office of Fair Trading's guidance for Consumer Credit Licence holders, as the phone companies will need a licence.  If your neighbour's phone company is not working within this guidance gather up the evidence and make a complaint to the phone company, and to Trading Standards.

[Unwashed]

I am sure you are right unwashed,  but if you loose the ability to use the phone, to read, to organise your affairs the world becomes a very hostile place.  Many of the call centre staff have no concept of the problems involved.

I have been trying to get various organisations to limit the number of words in a letter to a maximum of twelve.   

I have every sympathy for your situation and completely agree, I hope I didn't give the impression I felt otherwise.  I've seen the evidence that certain phone companies as a matter of routine appear to flout their consumer protection obligation and the enforcement authorities appear to be content to sit on their hands.

[PurpleHeather]

Sadly, as usual there are insufficient facts here to come to any judgement or even offer usefull assistance.
,
However, there are several associations who can help with the dispute.

All the information on these should be available at any public library, citizen's advice, trading standards and so on.

A local county councilor or even MP will act on your behalf too.

Firstly though, check if the debt can incur interest. If so, register that the bill is in dispute and whilst it is, no interest charges should be added.

Bailiffs can only be called AFTER the county court has decided in favour of the provider.

Letters accusing any one of owing some one else money, regardless of the fact that the victim does not owe money to any one should never be ignored.

Truth is I could say you or any one else owes me  loads and seek to recover it. If you ignore me then there is every chance I could get a county court judgement to agree that you do owe me and then I can get the bailifs to take your belongings away to reimburse not only me but their costs too.

It may seem odd but although I may run the risk of getting a prison sentence for doing it. I could also get away with it.

[Unwashed]

Sadly, as usual there are insufficient facts here to come to any judgement or even offer usefull assistance.

You're too hard on yourself PH, some of what you said was almost helpful. ;)

[Digeroo]

I usually find the asking to speak to a supervisor gets a better response.  Most organisations the supervisor will ring you back if you insist.  The problem does not appear to be that the person is trying to get away with paying for something they have had, but rather that they want to be treated in a fair manner.  

You did not give the wrong impression unwashed I just wanted to empathise with this persons problem.  I cannot remember how many companies I have had a set to with over my husbands affairs.   I decide what I think it fair and reasonable and stick to my guns until they capitulate.   And yes I do win in the end.   But each hassle can lead to huge amounts of unnecessary stress.  

BT and Lloyds Banks have been particularly difficult, while the Inland Revenue managed to be particularly charming when needed.  

[grawrc]

With regard to Data protection and the company refusing to discuss things wit you... I had the same problem dealing with things for my fil - blind and deaf. On a number of occasions I got around it by telling them it was OK, I didn't want to discuss anything and I didn't want them to tell me anything. I just wanted them to listen to what I was going to tell them, to note it down in fil's file and to send HIM a letter confirming what I told them. That seemed to work and, since I was the one that opened his mail for him, I also got confirmation that they had the facts.

[Tin Shed]

Thanks for all your comments and advice.

PH, I am not disputing the unpaid bill etc and obviously can not give out all the details.

I understand the Data Protection Act, in that information can not be given out to all and sundry, but a company small or large  - in this case it was the baliffs, must take into account any disability and do their best to ensure any disabled person can access their service, even if it means giving out simple advice , not just shrugging off the situation. As Digeroo said - the world can be  a very hostile place if you have a disabilty.

 I am really more interested in how certain Acts work together  - or not  - especially as in situations such as this, when we may need to speak or ask for information on our neighbour's behalf , may well happen again to us again. The situation has been resolved as the bill has been paid and we have been able to contact the brother quickly this time, but it concerns me that other situations may occur when he is abroad/out of contact.  
 
In an emergency who can get information on her behalf?

Perhaps our neighbour and her brother need to organise an local advocate for her.