Topic: New plot is hard as concrete!

[GeeGee]

Zigzag.

I was thinking along the lines you have suggested. Forget about planting this year and just concentrate on getting the soil into good condition for next year. Give me time to actually make up my mind what I'm going to grow too. Hey! I'm a woman, what do you expect regarding me needing all that time to make up my mind!?!?!?  ;D

You have really cheered me up by telling me I can put raw manure on top as a mulch. My dear old dad would never touch raw manure, but if I think about it logically his garden was already full of veg so he wouldn't would he.

I'm off to the local DIY centre to get some really strong black bags. Then I'm down to the horses every evening to collect their daily presents to me. OH will love me, the car could smell beautiful!!!  :o

Actually, I'm hoping that if I seal the bags well enough the smell shouldn't be too bad. If this method of transport works then I shall set up some compost bins on the allotment and just ferry the fresh poo to there so old farmer can't pinch it.

[artichoke]

Dare I suggest a raised bed made of straw? There are at least 2 threads in Edible Plants discussing this, one of them mine. The point is that you can lay out your straw on top of the hard clay, wet it thoroughly and wait a bit, then make planting holes for quite a varied list of plants.

The straw stifles the weeds, softens the ground (as you water it), enables you to at least grow something, and leaves you with well rotted compost/mulch at the end of the season to dig in as the ground softens in the autumn and allows you to cultivate it.

Of course, this depends on whether you can get straw bales at a reasonable price, get them laid out on your ground, and on whether or not you have water laid on. Eg:

http://s152.photobucket.com/albums/s186/strawbaleman/?action=view&current=P6040322.jpg

http://s152.photobucket.com/albums/s186/strawbaleman/?action=view&current=P6040326.jpg

[GeeGee]

Artichoke.

Brilliant suggestion. However, at mo straw is really hard to get hold of. Wrong time of the year and all last season's that would've been cheaper to start with has now gone completely or you would need a mortgage to buy it. Have been trying to source hay for the horses because our normal supplier is out completely, can't find any anywhere in this area, unless I wish to pay in excess of £7 a bale, plus delivery charges. Ouch!

[artichoke]

Ah, that's a shame. I bought mine in the autumn for £3 including delivery.

Do you know any farmers with spoilt hay who simply want to get rid of it? I have a generous neighbour who has left some free bales on my plot, and I have turned them into mulch and a coldframe. People warn you about weed seeds, but as we get weeds growing whatever we do, it doesn't scare me off. I love to have a few bales of hay about.

[GeeGee]

Zigzag/Davyboi.

Rain? I've heard of the concept but what exactly is this thing called rain?  ???

The old weathermen keep promising it might hit the SE of England, but the best we have had is a spit that dries up as soon as it hits the ground!

I even suggested I went outside and did a rain dance, cos apart from the allotment needing it, the horses do too - for the grass to grow so they have lots of yummy free food and also the hard ground is playing havoc with their poor legs and feet.

OH laughed and said if I did that I'd probably scare the neighbours and they might even phone someone to come and take me away!  :o

[GeeGee]

Artichoke!!!!

Are your psychic!  :o You must have been reading my mind.

As I was typing the last post it suddenly occurred to me that our hay supplier does/or at least did have a few spoiled rounds. He actually looked at them to see if we could utilise bits of them for the horses when they are in the paddock cos the grass is going fast too at the mo.

Would have to work out the logistics cos they are enormous (about 5ft in diameter and 5ft high) and weigh a ton.
Whilst he could get his lorry onto the allotment not sure if we would be able to roll them the rest of the way without damaging someone else's plot. I shall have to do a survey as there are many plots still not even started so it may be possible.

[Bugloss2009]

if your ground is hard, but you can get a fork into it, then don't try digging it, you'll end up with great big lumps that are difficult to break up. Use the fork like you would when aerating a lawn and push it down every 3 - 4 inches , move it back and forth,over the area you want,  and then hoe. It should break up nicely. Works for me anyway

Not such a great method if the plot is weedy, especially with couch grass, but you may be able to hand weed.

actually it's pouring with rain here, so you may be in luck  :)

[GeeGee]

Better make this my last post for the mo, OH would like to go out to lunch!  :)

So quick set of questions

What is the consensus of opinion.

I plan to remove rest of old crop.

Cover with tons of raw horsey poo, and (if I can get it) roll out the hay on top of that.

Or should I put the hay under the horsey poo?

Then cover it with heavy duty black plastic OR weed suppressant OR cardboard.

Which would be the best of the above?

Bearing in mind there is no water there yet and so would only get maybe 50 litres up there at a time (in the horsey water carriers). Any more would be too much! I know the water carriers when full are really heavy and so I will need a chair (as very wisely suggested earlier) to sit down after dragging them from the car to the plot.

Just watch, now I have posted that we haven't had any rain in ages it will pour down for the next 20wks!  :o

Better go! OH is getting hungry and until I've grown a few veggies I suppose I better treat him to lunch out.  ;D

[pumkinlover]

I don't know much about hay but will it contain grass seeds?
I used grass mulch on my potatoes and it ended up seeding ???

[GeeGee]

Bugloss2009

That would be great idea, but unfortunately the ground is chock full of flint and stones. Tried digging the fork in and I kid you not it would not even go in a full inch! It is certainly going to be fun clearing this plot.  ;D

Actually really looking forward to the challenge.

Well we were very hopeful of rain today as it happens, weathermen said rain, even thunder!  :o ;D

So far 2minutes of spit and now its sunny again.  :(

Must go or OH will kill me and eat me instead if he doesn't go to lunch soon.  :o  ;D

[Borlotti]

Whereabouts are you, it is raining here in Enfield, north London.  Bank holiday Monday is usually good for a good downpour. Patience, enjoy your lunch.

[Bugloss2009]

I <borrowed> a half plot that was like that a couple of years ago. In the end I used a pick axe  to dig big holes, filled them up with compost and manure, mad a little mound, and grew squashes in them. Like having underground flower pots  :)

[GeeGee]

Borlotti.

I'm in North Kent. It actually did rain a bit yesterday (whilst we were having lunch). Problem is because the ground is so dry and hard the rain just didn't sink in.  :(

Worse still it seemed to have rained in sections.  :o Had to do a few errands after lunch and some places looked like they hadn't even had a drop.

It has been overcast for most of the day today, normally you would expect to go out and get wet, but the clouds just don't seem to want to let go of their load.

Ummmmmm. A bank holiday Monday. Now there's a thought!  :) You're dead right there Borlotti it does normally rain on a bank holiday.

[GeeGee]

RAIN!!!!! RAIN, RAIN, RAIN! YEAH!  ;D ;D ;D

Being a mum with three grown up children that produce more washing than anyone could possibly imagine, it seems strange for me to wish for this lovely wet stuff, but I'm so delighted I could sing and dance around the garden at the mo.

Good for the garden and hopefully will make the grass in the paddocks grow too.

Problem is it never seems to comes at the right time.  :(  If it continues it could mess up the hay making which I will not be happy about either. Gosh I'm an awkward so and so. Don't tell OH I said that though!  ;D ;D