Topic: AminoPyrlid Mulch Warning

[Digeroo]

Having got an apparant problem I would like to post my own personal warning about mulching with manure. 

Do not mulch with manure.

I was very careful, only used a bit at a time etc and still managed to have a problem, but it is only in one small area which I mulched with manure.  The rest of the manure was buried and has cause no problem. 

I have never mulched with manure before, usually use grass clipping from my own chemical free lawn.

[ceres]

Sorry, but this is rubbish.  If the manure is contaminated, it doesn't matter whether you mulch or dig it in.  It will still affect your plants.  The only potential difference between the two methods is the speed at which plants might be affected.

[Heartysoup]

If it's contaminated you shouldn't use it at all. For the foreseeable future you need to source your manure from somewhere you know, where you can find out what exactly's been used. There are alternative soil conditioners and mulches, I don't think as good as manure, but needs must.

[cornykev]

I shall be giving manure a wide birth from now on, with the misery this has cost some people I will be using my own and free council compost from now on.  :( :( :(

[staris]

it's really difficult to be sure that manure is infected with aminopyralid the only real test is very expensive ,i'm having problems myself with suspect manure my beans looked like yours and also some tomatoes ,my beans have recovered my tomatoes did not.
i've tried the beans test and at the moment they all look fine although they are only a couple of inches tall so it's early days yet.
i've had lots of strange things happening like the nettles around the manure have got curled up leaves, i also planted a few nettles in the top of the heap expecting them to wither but they are doing fine, another strange thing is i replaced the affected tomato plants and one of them is showing the symptoms of affected manure but it's in a different place and has definatly not had any manure near it so i,m no closer to being sure if it's infected or not.
as others have said if you do have infected manure i wouldn't use it at all other than spreading it on a bed that is not in use and keep turning it over until next year, this is not an option for me if mines infected as i've got 8 ton of it  :(

[Digeroo]

I am beginning to think that the most suspectible plant is not the tomato but the sun flower. 

I have used loads of manure and it seems to only be the mulched ones that are a problem.  I understood this was because the soil breaks down the problem.

Sorry, but this is rubbish.

  What you are saying is that everything is soon going to die.  This will be devasting, everything is growing so well.

[ceres]

Sorry, but this is rubbish.

  What you are saying is that everything is soon going to die.  This will be devasting, everything is growing so well.

No.  What is rubbish is your assertion that mulching with manure causes damage but if you dig it in, it doesn't.

If your plants that are in an area that had manure dug in are showing no damage, then THAT manure WASN'T contaminated.  Any contaminated manure that was dug in over last/winter spring WOULD HAVE damaged the plants as the rotting down/neutralising process COULD NOT have happened quickly enough to not damage the plants.

[Emagggie]

How old was the manure you mulched with Digeridoo? If it was fairly new then it would not be good for mulching.

[realfood]

Some of our plotters had used manure as a mulch round young fruit trees and rasps before we realised that the manure was contaminated. Some of the young trees have died and the rasps have distorted shoots and leaves.
They have now scraped the manure away from the plants and we shall see what happens.
I have posted some of the photos here:-http://www.growyourown.info/page164.html

[Digeroo]

The manure is all very well rotted.  I just hope that only one batch is a problem.  Most things are growing very well.  Luckily only a few plants are affected, I am just worried about how many more will show signs.

[staris]

some things don't show any signs such as brassica ,sweetcorn, courgettes.

[Digeroo]

I have lots of brilliant looking peas, broad beans and potates so not all the manure can have a problem.  They are dripping with crops. 

[Eristic]

The point most of you are overlooking is the solubility of the contamination. The poison travels freely through the soil where it can strike down susceptible crops some distance from the manure. CornyKev may have the right answer at least in the short term. Stop using it. I use an enormous amount of manure as part of my cultivations and when my Italian neighbour once asked me what I would do if the manure ran out I told him I would worry about it when horses stopped shitting. Maybe that time is approaching.

Sunflowers are extremely susceptible to the poison as are all its relatives such as dahlias but are not so useful as the broad bean for indicating toxicity simply because most of us haul in the manure during the winter months.

[sunloving]

we talked to the managers at our local tip about contaminated manure disposal ( we still have a two year old pile ) They said we should bag it and put it in the general houshold waste (ie this will go into the landfill) So this is what we are going to do.

Our tomatoes in the greenhouse contaminated last year have really bad symptoms , they are very weak looking with curled up new leaves . Its going to be very difficult to move on organically from this becuase alternative fertilisers aremostly bad, fish blood and bone/battery chicken poo/ horse hoof!
Im so angry at dow still.