Topic: "Dog Whisperer" using pinch/prong & electric collars!!!!

[cocopops]

I have been a great fan of Cesar Millan, and with many of my friends love his show.  I always suspected that he was slightly tougher with the dogs off camera but last night I was stunned.

In the last few episodes I have noticed that the dogs wear very similar silver collars.  Last night I noticed that it was either a pinch or prong choke chain.  I know they are not readily available in the UK, the RSPCA in no way condones them, but I have seem them in France and they are like torture items.  Later on in the show he is working with a Labrador, and whilst he was shhhhing at the dog I spotted an electric dog collar.  In later scenes it was covered with a neck-scarf.

I do not know what angers me more; the fact that he proclaims to be the 'leader of the pack' by 'whispering', or that he was using such horrendous training 'tools'.

Also I owe Betula an apology, I did try an electric collar on one of by dogs and it was horrific.  You were right, who would want to electrocute their dog :-[.

[*pixie*]

I dont condone either but maybe the owners use the metal collars and he stuck with what they used? Im afraid Im a die hard cesar supporter.
 
I have seen him with the electric collar only once to train them away from rattlesnakes and they do have several settings starting with beeps and buzzes.

I hate them and think they should be withdrawn from the market. I used to work in a pet shop in the south and it was an area where more people had spare cash shall we say. Too many people wanted to order them BEFORE trying any other techniques for a quick fix.

For the likes of Cesar using the E collar on Daddy(his fave pitbull) to help teach the pack that rattlesnakes are to be avoided at the rattle of the tail as he cannot check them off lead, as long as its used responsibly I have no problem in THIS INSTANCE. Rather a small buzz/shock than another dog (will smiths wife lost her Husky X to a rattlesnake bite that week) getting killed by a rattler. But thats lesser of 2 evils and rattlesnakes cannot be avoided in their area and rarely to dogs recover from their bites if they are envenomated.

In order books in pet shops (Ancol I think was one company) you can get the metal prong collars but Ive never seen any pet shop stock them and was in the trade for 12 years.

I dont believe Cesar is any 'tougher' with them off camera to be honest. His methods are common sense. We have very head strong breeds and nothing anyone would do would convince me to let me working huskies off the lead, not even him but we have used his techniques with our pack since we intro'd our ridgeback last year and they are great dogs who dont fight, they share bones, are settled and very content.

[lewic]

Too many people buy these p*nis extension dogs to make them look macho. They have been bred for aggression, not obedience, so it is no wonder so many owners resort to an electric collar to assert their authority.

Nowadays there is no earthly reason why anyone needs to keep a dog which is strong enough to kill someone - if these breeds were outlawed then there would be no market for these devices. A rolled-up newspaper and bag of chocs should suffice!

[flossy]

   Lewie , I am behind you,

    People who use these methods are,  LOW LIFE !

     WHAT ARE THEY THINKING OF ....   dogs are sensitive and intelligent animals,

      This is  abuse of the worst kind,  heaven help us , what is it all coming to ?

      The animal charities should get involved here ....  pronto !

      floss

[*pixie*]

They have. The collars were trying to be outlawed but for some reason it didnt happen  :(

[kenkew]

A nation of dog lovers? What a load of cobblers when we allow this sort of treatment.
 The 'collar' belongs on the person who thinks the dog needs it!
 Ban them!.... >:(

[terrier]

Nowadays there is no earthly reason why anyone needs to keep a dog which is strong enough to kill someone - if these breeds were outlawed then there would be no market for these devices. A rolled-up newspaper and bag of chocs should suffice!

I hope you're not suggesting feeding chocolate to dogs? It contains Theobromine which is toxic and dogs cannot tolerate it. Even if your dog is fit it can still compromise your dogs health and mental state. There are many deaths attributed to theobromine poisoning every year esp. around Christmas time. I'm not even going to ask what the rolled up newspaper is for  :o

[digswell]

Personally I think all dog owners should be made to try on the collar they areintending to use before they are allowed to have the dog..... might put a few people off.

So called Macho dogs are fine when properly trained using humane methods and kept under control when out and about. It is not the dogs fault it's the defective owners that turn good dogs bad!

As for chocolate no-one has told our greyhound that human chocolate is bad for her, wherever we hide it she will find it, last months toll of chocolate and other nice things was:

1 x Milkyway
1 x Mars Bar
1/2 x KitKat (we came home and caught her in the act)

and her most audacious yet a 1lb gift box of Kendal mint cake which was wrapped and unopened, in a carrier bag, and in a shopping bag in the bedroom!

All of which she neatly unwraps and consumes while we are out or in another room. She also supplements her diet with paper tissues or pieces of kitchen towel which get ripped up and eaten (takes her about 10 seconds to find one that we thought was out of her reach!

[twins 59]

I have a rescue dog he is a staffie and he is so soft,people say I wouldnt hsve one off them, but the grandchildren love him,
twins 59

[Barnowl]

I did see a collar that squirted lemon verbena when the dog barked. Curious to know what people think of that ?

PS Don't have a dog nor a collar, just curious :)

PPS Saw someone using an electric collar on a labrador once - horrible.

[skyblu]

Let's not forget that Cesar deals with dogs that are usually problem dogs beyond most people's help.  they often have extreme agression issues and require serious behaviour modification in order to stop them having to be euthanised.  Cesar does not use electric collars as a matter of course, he only does so when all else have failed or is likely to do so.  If a couple of small shocks saves that dog from being put to sleep then in my book it is worth it and to be fair I imagine that if faced with that choice, that the dog in question might well prefer that option too!

These dogs have usually reached this stage because their owners are too busy treating them like cute little fluffy toys or children.  They are not! they are animals and as we see all too often, will happily bite the hand that feeds if it darn well wants to. 

These devices are extreme and undesirable but if used correctly by someone who knows what they are doing, they may just be the difference between life and death for that dog.

[gardentg44]

Toucha me dog a smacka ya face >:( >:(

[cocopops]

Let's not forget that Cesar deals with dogs that are usually problem dogs beyond most people's help.  they often have extreme agression issues and require serious behaviour modification in order to stop them having to be euthanised.  Cesar does not use electric collars as a matter of course, he only does so when all else have failed or is likely to do so.  If a couple of small shocks saves that dog from being put to sleep then in my book it is worth it and to be fair I imagine that if faced with that choice, that the dog in question might well prefer that option too!

These dogs have usually reached this stage because their owners are too busy treating them like cute little fluffy toys or children.  They are not! they are animals and as we see all too often, will happily bite the hand that feeds if it darn well wants to. 

These devices are extreme and undesirable but if used correctly by someone who knows what they are doing, they may just be the difference between life and death for that dog.

I understand your comment.  What I don't understand is why he does not mention that he uses these methods of training and says it is 'whispering'.

[betula]

I have admired him but not so sure now  >:(

I f your living depends on getting the dogs to behave  he may have resorted to desperate measures. >:(

To my mind it is cruel.Fullstop.

Rolled up newspaper?.....................I have paid the price for that one.My westie now goes bonkers if you walk around with a news paper........thank you mum for your great idea ::)

Thank you for your comment cocopops....it is appreciated ;D

[debster]

our dog is only corgi sized but he is very very strong even hubby says so, we believe him to be a patterdale terrier cross, now i have had lots of chance to look at him and i would not be surprised if he has staffy in him, whatever he is he is a beauty how people manage some of the larger dogs is beyond me and i often see kids out walking them  :o

[cocopops]

I have admired him but not so sure now  >:(

I f your living depends on getting the dogs to behave  he may have resorted to desperate measures. >:(

To my mind it is cruel.Fullstop.

Rolled up newspaper?.....................I have paid the price for that one.My westie now goes bonkers if you walk around with a news paper........thank you mum for your great idea ::)

Thank you for your comment cocopops....it is appreciated ;D

You were the one that questioned the electric dog collar.  I wish I had listened, £200 later it was awful.  I can just get him to wear a collar now.  Got a good regime that does not involve anything that upsets him and he has at least two hours a day off lead.  The only electic fence here is around the chicken run.

Cocopops x