Author Topic: Orangutan and palm oil.....  (Read 3542 times)

Melbourne12

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Re: Orangutan and palm oil.....
« Reply #20 on: February 25, 2010, 10:24:33 »
From the 2008/09 palm oil consumption figures

Total world consumption 42.1m tonnes, of which

Thoroughly good and ecologically sound chaps in the Far East (China, Japan, Indonesia, Malaysia, Thailand) 15.0m tonnes, 35.6%
Thoroughly good and ecologically sound chaps in the sub-continent (India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka)  8.3m tonnes, 19.7%
Lazy westerners trashing the planet (EU, USA) 5.3m tonnes, 12.6%
Thoroughly good and ecologically sound chaps in ROW 13.5m tonnes, 32.1%

OllieC

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Re: Orangutan and palm oil.....
« Reply #21 on: February 25, 2010, 11:16:40 »
Have you got those figures per head of population? Also, it is the West that dictates how most of the rest of the world lives so it is still lazy-arsed westernisation.

Most people here (in developed parts of the world) have a choice about how they live and what they consume, most people in developing countries don't. So yes, we are lazy for sitting here kidding ourselves that we have no choice.

Clearly you've made up your mind, this stuff is great and there is no alternative, nice one!
« Last Edit: February 25, 2010, 11:20:32 by OllieC »

Melbourne12

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Re: Orangutan and palm oil.....
« Reply #22 on: February 25, 2010, 13:04:49 »
Have you got those figures per head of population? Also, it is the West that dictates how most of the rest of the world lives so it is still lazy-arsed westernisation.

Most people here (in developed parts of the world) have a choice about how they live and what they consume, most people in developing countries don't. So yes, we are lazy for sitting here kidding ourselves that we have no choice.

I don't subscribe to the theory that only the western world is "developed", and the rest are somehow culturally enslaved.  But, FWIW, here are the figures per head for yearly consumption of palm oil in kilograms per capita, using the same demographics as above:

Far East 8.40 kg/person/year
Sub Continent 5.43
Western World 6.54
Rest of World 5.04


Clearly you've made up your mind, this stuff is great and there is no alternative, nice one!

My mind could be changed in an instant by a convincing argument.  Neither do I think it's great.  It's a very poor quality oil indeed.  Like most A4Aers, I'm sure, our household uses very little palm oil.  I had a quick prowl through the store cupboard and could find hardly anything. *  We make our own bread with butter or oil.  We consume a little chocolate and biscuits, but no margarine, processed cakes, commercial batters, and so on.  But millions of people do, and of course the catering trade uses it.  I'm not going to be so snooty as to not eat curries at modest restaurants, or fish and chips, or a commercial sandwich at the various offices at which I might find myself working.

But for those who think that substitution of unsaturated oils for saturated fats like palm is the easy answer, let me set them ....

Melbourne's Kitchen Challenge

Put to one side the butter or margarine that you normally use.  Instead buy a bottle of sunflower, or rapeseed, or groundnut, or soy oil.  Actually, any cheap blended vegetable oil will do.  It will probably be a rapeseed/sunflower blend..

Using your usual recipe for pastry, but substituting oil for your usual pastry fat, make a nice pie.  Sweet or savoury, doesn't matter.  Record your family's reaction to it.

Similarly, make a cake.  A sponge cake will be less wasteful of ingredients than a fruit cake, but either will do.  Again, record the reaction of those who are offered a slice.

Remember if you normally use butter or margarine to substitute 80% oil, 20% water.  If you use a solid baking fat like Trex or lard, it's a simple equal weight substitution.

Finally, let's do a sandwich for lunch.  Spread the bread with oil (I'll forgive you the 20% water) rather than butter or spread.

If you can honestly come back to me and say that the end result was as nice (or perhaps nicer) than normal, I'll be convinced.



* I do have a block of jaggery, or palm sugar, used in Indian cooking.  Mea culpa.

PurpleHeather

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Re: Orangutan and palm oil.....
« Reply #23 on: February 26, 2010, 07:13:46 »
We got rid of our bears, wolves and many other wild creatures centuries ago so that they did not interfere with our agricultural aspirations. By hunting the creatures to extinction. Or chopping down our forests and destroying other habitats.

I did see the programme and do understand both sides of the issues.

There are just too many humans in the world all of us wanting the best we can get from the world's resources. We are criticizing 'third world' countries who ultimately supply our needs, for doing exactly the same as we have already done.

We can not feed ourselves, provide our own fuel or clothing unless we import the materials for our needs. It is pretty scary if you think about it. We produce very little and if no one will export to us we will starve.

 

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