Topic: Fish or wildlife pond?

[Froglegs]

Have started to dig a pond in my garden,have been told if i put Goldfish in it, it will not be as wildlife friendly as it would be without, is this true?. And will Sticklebacks,Minnows and Goldfish live together in the same pond?.

[Margaret]

There are fundamental differences between the needs of fish and amphibians,which is mainly what people have wildlife ponds for.

Newts and frogs need still water,well planted out in a good layer of mud at the bottom of the pond,and definitely NO pump,as they can get minced in one!Insect life will proliferate in such conditions,which is what tadpoles and newts feed on.The frogs can hibernate over the winter in the mud and the balance of the pond will occur quite quickly.

Fish however need  a pump and filter for optimum health,as they need to be fed and they produce a lot of waste.The pond needs to be bigger and deeper ,and not too thickly planted,though a selection of oxygenating weed and lilies to cover the surface,all planted up in pots,enhance the look and help create a balance.I hate to see bare ponds with Koi in, it saddens me as all fish like to swim through plants and nibble them,they also need shelter and when goldfish breed it is esssential for cover .

 A lot of people do end up with frogs in their fish pond but obviously not the other way round!! so if you want to do your bit for nature,and keep the expense down,then leave fish out.Though i do believe you could keep a  few minnows or sticklebacks in a large enough pond,as they do not grow like goldfish and other carp species.

[Multiveg]

Am thinking about a pond for the new plot.
Remembering the one my dad built in the garden - quite deep (deep enough for water lilies, still didn't get the "one" ordered from Bakkers..). It didn't have a pump/filter. What my dad did was to fill up the old plastic one with water for a few days. Then this would be drip-fed into the pond after a couple of days. The drips would oxygenate the water. Water would be changed every so often this way.
We had goldfish, shubunkins, comets and fantails. They survived the winters. My dad boarded up one end of the pond, we used a plastic ball to float though we still went down to break ice. One summer, the fish population grew! We weren't expecting it to happen - 2 black (Jet and Ebony) fish plus 3 others (Spot, and I can't remember the other names of the fish).
We had frogs - though if I looked at them, they'd disappear (maybe it was because I'd catch them and stick them on a lily pad!). We had newts. There was a plank to help the amphibians escape.

[star]

Im......still.....doing my pond ::), But its going to be for whatever decides to inhabit on its own accord, Im not into fish ponds myself, and would far rather see native species with somewhere to live.

So many ponds have dissapeared in recent years, its rather nice to see frogs, toads, newts, dragonfly/damselfly......and other things appearing as if by magic. Even leeches can be brought in by birds as eggs stuck to the feet..........amazing :)

[Margaret]

very sensible train of thought,Star.So many ponds have dried up in the wild,by being drained for watering crops and from a lack of attention.I have found frogspawn in puddles,in fact hubby has a photo of me trying to scoop some up from  drying up puddles on holiday one year with a lunch box!!and relocate it to a better place.

Amphibians do desperately need all the help we can give them and i read today that toads now are vulnerable to a killer disease that is sweeping the south of England and could spread.We may eventuallyhave none left it is so virulent.So sad.

I have one lonely toad in my garden,he eventually decided to try and be like a frog so that they would hang around with him!!Luckily this year there has been a lot of slugs so he doesn't go hungry.

[silly billy]

I used to have a garden pond full of wildlife including frogs and all manner of insect life and I also had 3-4 goldfish in the pond.I think as long as you only have a couple of goldfish in a pond and they are well fed you can still have plenty of wildlife but don't make the pond too small. I am no expert but I don't advise sticklebacks as they seem to prefer running water and can be quite aggressive although small, especially when they breed.

[Froglegs]

So if the pond is big enough theres room for both.

[ninnyscrops]

Our little garden pond is still home to 3 goldfish that were here when when bought the place nearly 25 years ago. It's about 6 x 3 feet.  If you put your pump on bricks off centre towards the deeper end, it doesn't suck in the tiddly wildlife that prefers to wallow in the mud at the bottom. We have dragonflies hatching every year, newts, frogs, leeches and the birds drink and bathe in the shallow end. Water lilies and iris are the main prob cos you have to take the dead leaves off the first and divide the second quite often. It's the best place to sit beside on a crisp spring morning and see all the activity or warm summer evening and unwind IMHO  :)

[keef]

My pond is about 8ft x 6ft and averages 2.5ft deep. I put 3 goldfish, a couple of crucian carp and a couple of koi in it when I dug it about 20 years ago.. the koi did'nt last long. But now i have 30+ odd goldfish type things! they breed every year. A couple of the inbreads seem to be blind - it does'nt seem to bother them though.. but I suppose I need to take some out really.

I get frogs, toads and newts, mine has no perminant pump anymore so that helps. I also have an old sink next to the pond with no fish in it, i normally take some (not all) of the frog and toad spawn out the main pond and put it in the sink.. as the fish love to eat it. This method works well as i quite often see teeny weeny frogs about later in the year.

[ninnyscrops]

Don't take the blind ones out Keef - one of mine has been blind for years and seems to cope! Another thing I've just thought of is netting. Did it for a few years as we have a huge oak tree in the land behind, but we had a frog caught it in one year and he lost a leg  :( (but he coped for a long while) and a nuthatch stuck (boy, do their beaks hurt) so we don't bother now - just net the leaves off at the weekends. 

[Froglegs]

So if the pond is big enough theres room for both.

And a pump is not such a good thing to have, i was thinking in the way of having a waterfall. Is there any wildlife friendly pumps/filters i can use?.

[keef]

Don't take the blind ones out Keef - one of mine has been blind for years and seems to cope! Another thing I've just thought of is netting. Did it for a few years as we have a huge oak tree in the land behind, but we had a frog caught it in one year and he lost a leg  :( (but he coped for a long while) and a nuthatch stuck (boy, do their beaks hurt) so we don't bother now - just net the leaves off at the weekends. 

No i wont, i might take some of the normal ones out to reduce the numbers a but.

[silly billy]

So if the pond is big enough theres room for both.

And a pump is not such a good thing to have, i was thinking in the way of having a waterfall. Is there any wildlife friendly pumps/filters i can use?.

Most pumps I've ever used have had a piece of sponge like material which prevents anything being sucked in to where the propeller is so any wildlife would be fine and as previously stated if you sit it on some bricks so its above the bottom of the pond this will help prevent anything being hurt. My last pond had a pump with a fountain and a frog spitting water out and my pond was teeming with wildlife, I never found any wildlife trapped in the sponge or the propeller.