Topic: Second and third year plot holders

[Melbourne12]

We're starting our second full year, plus we had half a season in 2005.  This year for the first time we've grown some tulips for cut flowers.  We've also planted fruit trees and bushes over the winter months, so we're beginning to think longer term.  I'm building a fruit cage.  We've extended our raised beds.

As for varieties, we'll grow loads of tomatoes and beans, just as we've done in the past two years, but we're also going to try a few new things (to us) such as fennel and celery.  If they don't work, well, too bad.

[Rosyred]

Second year for me and i'll be growing more as last year I lost alot due to slugs, birds, just dying etc so thats what i'm doing this year sow more of everything maybe in two sowings.

[kt.]

Most has been said already

1) Water the plants at the bottom of the stem rather than on the leaves so they dont burn.

2) When you plan - plan to sow early late and main crop of as many varieties of veg as you like to eat. It keeps your plot active, keeps you in food, & if it is full of veg - there is less room for weeds to push through.

3) Dont forget about inter-cropping with quick growing veg. (to fill gaps as you harvest stuff out)

4) Permenant paths are now in my preferred position.

5) If you can - dont have all your water barrels in one corner of the allotment. I have some on opposite corners. Saves carrying.

6) Experiment with something new each year - be it fruit or a different veg. If you dont like it - at least you have tried it ;)

[Mouseski]

Second year for us too - and the old boys said we wouldn't last! ;D

1. Panic less - if it grows it grow if it doesn't, stick something else in.

2. Plant much more sweetcorn - just too delicious not to :)

3. Plant less cabbages - there is a limit to how many you can eat in a week :-X

We are already finding the planting diary we used last year (as recommended on A4A!) really helpful to avoid the mistakes of last year. Leeks in the airing cupboard - what was i thinking

 ;D

[Tee Gee]

I think I am on about my 23rd year and I haven't got it right yet and I don't expect I ever will ???

But then again thats the beauty of it all, I think if I had it all stereo typed I might give up!!

[gary]

Thanks for all of your replies all valuable infomation. If I and the other newbies have learnt one thing it is that no matter how long you've been doing it you don't get it right every time.

Mouseski. How much is much more sweetcorn? I plan a 12 feet by 4 feet bed for sweetcorn and one for minipop (for two of us but have had a few requests for spares). This is one of the things i am looking foward to most.

To any one courgettes. 3 yellow and 3 green agian for two. also requests for spares and I have the space should I plant more?

Gary

[cornykev]

Preparing the ground.
Growing veggies that my family like.
Getting the sowing and planting times right.
Growing more carrots.
Patience when waiting to plant (frosts).
Keeping everything diaryed.
More hoeing less weeding.
Enjoy it don't let it become a chore.
Making use of the non rotation plants to fill the gaps
And finally as Coznbob says don't sow all the tomato seeds, I kept this one quiet but I had over a hundred tommy plants last year, bloody garden looked like a garden center. :o :o ;D ;D ;D

[mc55]

To any one courgettes. 3 yellow and 3 green agian for two. also requests for spares and I have the space should I plant more?

I grew 2 yellow and 2 green courgettes last season and had them coming out of my ears - double figures some weeks, the size of marrows.  Just two of us and we were swamped - even neighbours, friends and work colleagues started to avoid us when they saw the little monsters bulging out of carrier bags.

[Mouseski]

Mouseski. How much is much more sweetcorn? I plan a 12 feet by 4 feet bed for sweetcorn and one for minipop (for two of us but have had a few requests for spares). This is one of the things i am looking foward to most.

We planted 24 plants last year in a 6 foot by 5 foot space (ish!).  This year we are tripling production! Theres just two of us but it won't go to waste. We are even aiming to take a camping stove to eat it as fresh as possible. Mouth is watering at the thought. :D Will never touch the tinned stuff again!

[Robert_Brenchley]

How far apart did you put them, and how good was the crop? I always put my plants 18 inches apart, interspersed with the odd squash.

[gary]

I have read else where that 12 inch spacing all round in a block is better but what do I know I have never grown it before!

Gary

[Curryandchips]

I do the same as Robert ...

[Robert_Brenchley]

I put mine in a block, with three rows side my side, everything spaced at 18 inches, and a few squashes among the corn. The spacing really depends on the size your corn grows to.

[Mouseski]

THey were about a foot apart(started in loo rolls and then planted outside with plastic bottle hats until they established), in a block. there were three butternut squash rambling underneath.

We got at least two cobs off each. Going to attempt three sisters planting this year to make good use of the space. I don't know if this is good production but it tasted so fiiinnnnne

[Robert_Brenchley]

It sounds a pretty good use of the space if you got that many cobs.

[Jeannine]

Bit of advice re your sweetcorn, forgive me if I am preaching to the converted here, but there are a lot of newbies out there.

Planting corn early wil not give you better results, actually it is one veggie that dislikes it.The earlies  have an internal time shedule, if you are starting in pots it needs to be timed so that  from germination to planting out should only be about three weeks, they will stop growing in the pots and take a while to recover so transplant indoors into larger containers rather  than keep them in little pots if the weather is iffy. It is better however to wait till the weather has warmed up and germinate and plant out quickly. If you direct seeds wait till the ground is warm.

If you are using the supersweet or sugar enhanced, it need  even more heat to germinate than the usual corn ( 70f) regular corn needs 60F

They need to grow a certain amount of leaves within 30-40 days  before they tassel even if the plant is not ful sized by then.

 If planting direct,plant 4-6 inches apart in rows 30 inches apart with a minimum of 4 rows,so a block if you are not planting many. Don't plant in soil that is too cold , they will rot, you can cover with clear plastic till they germinate. USE treated corn to prevent rot if the weather is less than it's bets.It needs a lot of fertiliser,thin to 8-10 inches apart for  regular corn, large varieties or doubles need 1 foot but not more as pollination can be hampered. Keep free of weeds till 1 foot high then let them go,Plants have very shallow roots, so don't cutivate too close.
Pick a variety that does well in a short season if you are north.

I start mine inside in May, so they can go straight out without a pause,when they are two -three weeks old.

Some varieties have to seperated from others.

Regular Corn.  Hybrid or OP.Varieties  can be mixed.

Sugar Enhanced  needs no isolation from other varieties either in it's family or from the ones above,

Super sweets ( wrinkled corn)must be isolated from other types by 25 feet  or both types will cross pollinate and the resulting corn will be starchy.

It is therefore useful on a lottie to know what your neighbour is growing.

. Hope this is of some use  to someone.

XX Jeannine

[bennettsleg]

For me, it's been work with the soil you have and don't waste time & effort on things that just don't do well in the soil or conditions you have.  Don't be a martyr to planting & sowing times if you have a busy life, it goes in when you have time & the weather is favourable, not when it says so on the packet.  And lastly, what's a few weeds, tch, stuff still grows. ;)

Agreed, absolutely.

Year 2 por moi and lessons that I've learned are:
- Just because you have an allotment your Carbs- & Protein-lovin' OH won't suddenly start to like veg. ::) ;D
- OH saying asparagus (or other veg) would be lovely suddenly becomes "asparagus is alright" when you announce that you're putting aside land for an asparagus bed to hold 20 crowns.
- Grow the stuff you love that is expensive (globe artichokes) or invisible (chard) in the dastardly supermarkets.
- Be aware that the changing weather patterns will also change your sowing times. I was still harvesting courgettes in mid October because of the weather.
- Don't sow too early or too much and the kitchen is not to be considered a greenhouse. Unless you are growing chillies... 
- Your spine is for life, not just for shifting the manure delivery.
- Invest in some thick plastic to line the back of the car - keeps everyone happy.
- Spending an hour each weekday in the summer digging out rocks the size of a football is a genuinely great way to wind down after battling with your boss & the London traffic. Can't wait for the long evenings to return and this poxy weather to end.
- Courgettes & squash take up much more space than you imagined and can be difficult to give away...
- NEVER forget to take your water with you! Great handfulls of raspberries are lovely but don't make up for the dehydration.
- Weeds grow. Alot. Weeds laugh at you when you try to poison them. Some weeds can be eaten and who gets the last laugh then, eh? Mwahahahaaa!
- Mow/slash/burn weeds before they flower, that way they won't sow more weed seeds and you will also not upset your neighbours.
- Buying plug plants is not cheating.
- When the neighbouring plot holder has mesh cages and a son with a valid shooting license, take heed: pheasants and pigeons are a problem.  Make some mesh cages of your own.
- Mulch, mulch and mulch some more.
- All those bricks and paving slabs will never lay themselves nor be enough to cover your paths.  Give up and use cardboard, newspaper and straw.
- JCB strimmers are a pile of poo and will never work when you need them to.
- Stop fretting.  The only people who have plots that look like Kew belong to people who practically live on their plot.
- If you're going to plan and constantly re-plan your allotment layout on work time make sure that you A: have your back to the wall  ;D and B: send a copy home to work on when it's raining.
- If you're invited to the site's social highlight of the year, don't forget to turn up because the World Cup is on...
- Mum is a World Champion weeder of the highest order.


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Jeannine - that's marvelous advice!  Being a Newbie of the Complete Numpty variety, none of my sweetcorn worked last year.  I hear everyone raving about them and find little tiddling plants that won't grow above 6 inches even though they were started in pots.  Due to no greenhouse/windowsills I need to direct sow and will use your advice and see what happens!

To any one courgettes. 3 yellow and 3 green again for two. also requests for spares and I have the space should I plant more?
 

Oh my GAAAAWWDD!! NOOOOO! Plant one of each variety ony - they'll probably feed a family of 30!  I planted two of each (and I'm the only one who likes courgettes - but only when they're babys) and had a hard time trying to grab them all before they became proper courgette size (yerk  :-\) or marrows ( :-X :-X :-X).  The courgette flowers though are a glorious boon and many a flower was used for risotto/ tempura/ stuffed.

[Mouseski]

Great advice Jeannine,thanks,  I have made notes - must protect and nurture my favourite crop :D

[ellkebe]

3rd season - so let's see ...

weeds don't take time off just cos you do!
pests are king and life is short so get over it and learn to accommodate them  ;D
remember to harvest what you grow (D'Oh  :-[ !!)
grow what you eat, but you might just eat what you grow so give something new a go!!

[gary]

I have learned a lot from this, so thanks for all your input. I also hope other have also gleamed some infomation from this post, but I intend at the end of the year to ask everyone the question "What have you learned this year?"