Topic: Ants - a good thing or bad thing.

[Annadl]

Hi

I've been reading about ants and aphids and am totally confused.

Can someone please explain the relationship between the ants and aphids?

I have been getting one plant infested with ants (but no damage to florence fennel) and then the ants disappear.  Everything is fine, then 4 weeks later one of my lettuce is infested with ants.  So I pull it out.  Next thing my whole row of lettuce (mediterranean salad mix) are infested with juicy black fat aphids UNDER ALL of the leaves and quite heavily withing the lettuces.

Shouldn't I have gotten rid of the ants?

Any suggestions would be really helpful.

Also, with the gentle Lux soap (that is biodegradable) and gentle on woollen clothing with minimal phosphates be OK as a soap wash for the aphids?

Thankyou
Anna :-[

[jennym]

The aphids are sap sucking insects. The excess sugary sap is present in their excreta, the shiny stuff known as honeydew. The ants like this, and therefore go where they can get it. Ants also make nests in the roots of plants, sometimes disturbing the soil to such an extent that the plant cannot get enough water.
Normally I get rid of the aphids first by blasting with water only. You should use only horticultural soft soap such as you find in garden centres. But try just water, that's all I use. The ants I don't find so much of a problem, but my soil is heavy clay. If I found ants on a plant, I'd just wash them off. they don't actually eat the plant.

[Obelixx]

Ants are a problem.  They bite.  They sometimes make nests under plants which causes the drainage to be fierce and the plant dies of drought.  They also farm aphids for the honeydew they excrete whilst digesting your treasures and will actively move aphids to new plants and then defend them against all foes such as ladybirds and lacewings.

One easy way to deal with ants is to mix one small bottle of clove oil (essential oil from pharmacy or health store) into a 10 litre can of water and pour over nests and infested plants.  They don't like the smell and move on.

I deal with aphids by squishing with my fingers on easy access plants such as roses, nipping the young tops out of broad beans and hanging fat feeders around so that queuing tits feast on the aphids.  They can also be removed with a blast from a hose-pipe.  Other than that a horticultural soft soap spray can be used late evenings after the good guys have gone to bed.

[Obelixx]

Ants are a problem.  They bite.  They sometimes make nests under plants which causes the drainage to be fierce and the plant dies of drought.  They also farm aphids for the honeydew they exrete whilst digesting your treasures and will actively move aphids to new plants and then defend them against all foes such as ladybirds and lacewings.

One easy way to deal with ants is to mix one small bottle of clove oil (essential oil from pharmacie and health store) into a 10 litre can of water and pour over nests and infested plants.  They don't like the smell and move on.

I deal with aphids by squishing with my fingers on easy access plants such as roses, nipping the young tops out of broad beans and hanging fat feeders around so that queuing tits feast on the aphids.  They can also be removed with a blast from a hose-pipe.  Other than that a horticultural soft soap spray can be used late evenings after the good guys have gone to bed.

[Annadl]

What are tits?

And if I blast the aphids with water don't they just move on to another plant?

Anna

[robkb]

Hi Annadl,

I can vouch for Obbelix's clove oil advice as this was the same advice given to me on the BBC forum (probably by Obbelix!).

I think if you blast aphids with water it snaps their sucker-thingy and they can't feed any more.

Cheers,
Rob ;)

ps. in this context, tits are small birds.

[jennym]

Aphids have a wingless stage as well as a winged stage. If you blast them off the plant, (they are usually in the wingless stage when actually doing the damage) they can't move very far and starve to death.

[Obelixx]

Hi Rob - The original advice was from someone clever like Dee Ashton or Loopyloo I think.  I had a nest under rhubarb plant and the clove oil worked a treat.

Annadl - tits are a large family of birds including blue tits, great tits, willow tits, marsh tits, coal tits, long-tailed tits..........  The first two are the commonest and I have them feeding and nesting in my garden.    They eat caterpillars too so are a great garden friend.

[Annadl]

Thankyou for your replies.

I have the aphids at both stages, except the wingless ones are quite plump. I have tiny ones too.  Hundreds of the  larger ones so won't be able to squash them.

I will give them a blast with the hose tomorrow.

My salad mix is almost ready for harvesting and I don't want to lose them.

Anna ;D

PS:  What would have caused all of the holes on my radish leaves?  It looks like they have aphids too but only smaller.  My salads don't have holes in them ???

[Robert_Brenchley]

I don't have any problems with aphids since as soon as they start building up the tits move in and clean them up. If you have trees or bushes nearby they should be around; they don't like going far from cover. You could try hanging a peanut feeder in a strategic spot; once they spot the aphids they're finished. That being said, I haven't had problems with aphids on lettuce, and if they're out of sight they'd probably be safe from the birds.

[Annadl]

We do have a few birds.  I don't know if I should attract them to the vege garden by feeding them nearby or just leaving them to it?

Anna

[Obelixx]

Hi Wardy - last year the caterpillars outnumbered the tits in my garden too so we netted our cabbage this year.  No caterpillar problem but all the pointy ones burst while we were away on holiday as we were having a drought.  Can't win.

I hang fat balls on the trellis where I have roses growing and they do eat the aphids there.

[Annadl]

Would garlic plants interspersed between the lettuce deter the aphids?

Anna

[Obelixx]

I don't see why not.  It's recommended for planting with roses to deter greenfly.  Chives, leeks and any member of the onion family would be good but I'm not sure about the crop rotation sequences.