Topic: Newly planted cucumber plants dying off

[George the Pigman]

Last year I bought two cucumber plants from a reliable nursery and planted them in a grow-bag. They seemed to do OK initially but after a couple of weeks stopped growing,went floppy and died on me. I replaced them with two new plants from a different nursery and they grew OK.
This year I bought two more (same nursery as the first lot that died)and put them in a Tomorite grow bag. Now the same thing has happened after a couple of weeks with one of them. I have dug it out and there is no evidence externally of rot or stem damage.
Any clues what is happening?

[strawberry1]

the stem rots very easily. I always plant mine on a mound with a moat around for watering. You could use something like a tomato grow ring and water in that moat

[Beersmith]

Is it possible to check the condition of the roots?  There could be some clues there.

I have sometimes given myself problems with gro bags by inadvertently over watering and drowning roots.

Cheers

[George the Pigman]

The stem didn't look rotten or soft strawberry1. I am now suspicious the other one is going the same way. Could it be a virus/fungus in their stock or something like that - or even in the Tomorite grow bag itself.
However I will have a look at the roots as suggested Beersmith. The grow bag was very wet when I opened it but I didn't water until the surface was dry.

[PondDragon]

It does sound like the wet growing conditions could be the problem. Apart from rot, waterlogging prevents oxygen getting to the roots. Paradoxically this then hinders water uptake and transport to the leaves, so symptoms can look similar to drought.

[Tee Gee]

The grow bag was very wet when I opened it but I didn't water until the surface was dry.

There is your problem I think!

Cucumbers are susceptible to neck rot which occurs at ground level so to try and avoid this,either do as Strawberry says and build a mound,or do as I do is to sink a plant pot at the base of the plant and water into this.

The aim is to keep the surface of the soil relatively dry

When filling the pot try not to let it overflow and wet the surrounding soil, using a 4"-5" pot tends to give a reasonable application of water

[galina]

Thank you Strawberry and TeeGee   

[Vinlander]

Approach grafting onto a rootstock while the plant is in a pot will solve the problem with root and stem rots (the figleaf/"sharkfin" -  gourd/"melon" Cucurbita ficifolia is a very good choice).

Unfortunately every time I've done it there was a "good" cucumber year and the only difference was slightly more vigour and an extra month of cropping right up to the first frosts.

This year I didn't sow any C. ficifolia - duh.

I don't know whether to blame the demon Murphy for my memory slip or the bad cucumber year - Occam's Razor says the former but...

Since I find approach grafting more reliable and versatile (it works perfectly well when the stems cross each other - even at right angles)  it's possible to graft a separate rootstock to every node of a good early plant from the garden centre. The fanciest types (all-female F1) are the obvious choice since you are doing all that fiddly work anyway.

Cheers.

[George the Pigman]

Tee Gee I think that may be the answer. Last year I potted the cucumbers straight into the bag after I opened it. They both died but the next two I put in in were OK. By then the compost in the bag would have dried out.
Why the compost in the bags should be soaking wet I do not know. You would think it would encourage fungal disease.
I used to grow cucumbers in pots but switched to bags because it was easier. Now I am thinking of going back to the tried and trusted pots!

[George the Pigman]

A further follow up! The second of the plants that initially I planted went the way of the first. However there was no evidence of stem rot. However there was a pathetic root system Can one get root rot without stem rot?

[BarriedaleNick]

Despite being quite careful 2 out of 3 of mine have gone the same way.  I think it was too cold and damp and the soil remained too wet for too long.  I do have a couple of backups but I'll need to be more careful with them!

[Crystalmoon]

Hi everyone I grew my cucumbers from seed & have been very careful with them indeed yet I have lost 4 out of 5 planted even with them being planted under a plastic sheet pegged down firmly to make a greenhouse for them in a raised bed. I have never struggled with cucumbers before not even when growing in a north facing garden that got very little light! so I have to assume the freak weather we have been having here in Kent has finished them off as they had decent roots when pulled up but were withered. We are having such insane extremes, very cold mornings & nights but mega hot late afternoons, torrential rain, hailstones etc etc. I have no back ups left now so fingers crossed the one survivor will give me a crop. I may buy a couple of replacements if I see some in a couple of weeks when hopefully the mad weather has sorted itself out. Jane   

[Tee Gee]

I have another theory here and that is the quality of the compost they are in!

I am finding quite often now that these peat reduced/ free composts are not as free draining as the composts of the past, and as such they often become water- logged yet the surface of the compost looks quite dry. Faced with this, the temptation is to add water which exasperates the situation and drowns the root system because there is very little air in the compost.

Your description of the roots of your plants suggests this.

Cucumber are my Achilles heel and I rarely have success with them so I am no expert.

Touch wood I will have more success this year as my plants are in the greenhouse border which consists of well drained loamy soil.


So containers and grow bags coupled with with poor draining compost might be the cause or at least part of it!

I have a look at my compost as I open each bag and assess if it needs more grit in it, and if it does I add some coarse sand.

Oddly enough this years batch (humax) is very fine and a bit sandy so it seems we can't win.

So another one I put down to the EU bureaucrats who want us to grow straight cucumbers  in composts that quite often are not fit for purpose.

I'm out!!!

[George the Pigman]

Tee Gee I think you may have hit the nail on the head. The Tomorite bag has seaweed incorporated. Even after several weeks the bottom of the compost is still very wet. One sees the surface dry and waters but because  of the compost mixture it is still soaking underneath. Not very useful if your trying to gauge when to water.
I have always found that a problem with peat-free composts which is why recently a lot of compost producing companies seem to have given up on them.
So far the replacement cucumbers seem OK.