Topic: A tall story

[titus a duxas]

 Hi All
I grow the tall pea  Alderman and was wondering whether the pea Colassal / Alderman debate was resolved as some time ago it was discussed on the forum
Is it the same pea ? Anyone know
 thanks

[alkanet]

I thought Alderman was the same as Tall Telephone, or vice versa

[titus a duxas]

Yes............ Alderman it can be called Telegraph a usa thing I am led to believe
"True pea or not true pea that is the confusion"
Either way the tall pea I grow is a winner. 

[alkanet]

i think it was given the name telephon(e) before the telephone was invented

[goodlife]

Alderman and Telephone are different peas, but Alderman and Colossal are same...it was Victoriana nursery that called 'their' peas with Colossal name as they selected some plants that are supposed to grow much taller than 'ordinary' Alderman.
'SUPPOSINGLY', because I've grown 'ordinary' Alderman side by side with Colossal and there wasn't any difference what so ever to either lot.
You can read story of 'their' pea from here..
https://www.victoriananursery.co.uk/Pea_Seed_Victorian_Colossal_Climbing/

[RobinOfTheHood]

It's probably irrelevant but I've sowed 120 Alderman in modules in the last 4 weeks and got a grand total of 10 that have germinated. 4 have died since.

Trying some fresh Unwins seed from Asda to see if it helps but I've never had any real success with them. Is there a secret that I don't know?

[galina]

It's probably irrelevant but I've sowed 120 Alderman in modules in the last 4 weeks and got a grand total of 10 that have germinated. 4 have died since.

Trying some fresh Unwins seed from Asda to see if it helps but I've never had any real success with them. Is there a secret that I don't know?

Peas like deep modules (love toilet roll inners or the commercial root trainers),  In ordinary modules, they quickly show roots at the base.  However that does not kill them.

It may be helpful not to bury the peas too deep and allow for 2 weeks before writing them off.  Damp, but not too wet.  However they do actually sprout well in an ordinary sprouter, then as soon as you see a root coming out of a pea seed, you can place that into some compost (shallow). 

It might help the diagnosis to find out what happened to the peas that haven't sprouted.  Are they just sitting there or have they 'disappeared' from the modules, ie rotted away. 

Still time for another try.   

[titus a duxas]

I use a 1l pot 12 peas dumped in 1 inch below compost watered well once then in a propagator heated or not
The main reason is to stop those thieving mice
Transplanting has never been a problem, I tried root trainers and loo rolls etc ok but a lot of faffing around
keep it simple

[galina]

I use a 1l pot 12 peas dumped in 1 inch below compost watered well once then in a propagator heated or not
The main reason is to stop those thieving mice
Transplanting has never been a problem, I tried root trainers and loo rolls etc ok but a lot of faffing around
keep it simple

You might have sown too deeply and germinated too hot, would be my best guess.  Mine germinate in a frost-free conservatory. 

Here is a picture of some of my experimental peas and how I germinate them (and how a 4 inch deep module wasn't quite deep enough for them at this stage!).  They were moved into individual newspaper pots quickly and are now planted into the garden.

 

[goodlife]

It's probably irrelevant but I've sowed 120 Alderman in modules in the last 4 weeks and got a grand total of 10 that have germinated. 4 have died since.

Trying some fresh Unwins seed from Asda to see if it helps but I've never had any real success with them. Is there a secret that I don't know?

Like Galina mentioned...the usual things to 'kill' peas so that they don't germinate is either too wet compost or mice...and mice can dig the seeds out even without compost showing signs of disturbance!

[Silverleaf]

An inch deep sounds like too much to me too, and I wouldn't bother with the propagator.

You could try pre-germinating on damp kitchen paper maybe? Just keep an eye on them though and pot them up as soon as they sprout.

[galina]

An inch deep sounds like too much to me too, and I wouldn't bother with the propagator.

You could try pre-germinating on damp kitchen paper maybe? Just keep an eye on them though and pot them up as soon as they sprout.

I never sow everything to leave some seeds over should disaster strike and I need a second attempt.  This means that I regularly have old seeds to use up, like some 2005, 06 and 07 peas earlier this year.  As I don't expect full germination, I stuck them into my sprouter on the kitchen windowsill.  You can see the roots come out of the seed very easily and remove any that sprout to a pot.  These were the oldest seeds I had hanging around and the white seeded types had about half germination, the darker seeded ones near 100 percent.  The darker seeded ones sprouted within days, the white seeded ones took just over a week. 

As it happens, germination was good enough that I could have sown these into pots, but I didn't know that at the time, so the sprouter was the obvious solution.  And such longevity is only possible because these were not bought seeds, but home saved seeds.  With bought seeds you don't know how old they are when they are packeted.  The only criterion is whether they pass a germination test when they are being put into packets.  Several batches of my ancient seeds would have passed that test easily!

Sorry I am thread-drifting.  Just wanted to say that Silverleaf's suggestion of pre-sprouting is a good idea with peas in my experience too.  I would not do it with white-seeded beans (because these rot so easily), but it works well with peas. 

Hope your next attempt with Alderman goes much better, Robin.

[titus a duxas]

Is there some sort of misunderstanding in this thread?
As my second post I mentioned sowing an inch and using a propagator(Mouse free zone) with success to be told it could be too deep and not to use propagator
Unless I read it wrong its Robininthewoods  whos had bad luck not me

[Silverleaf]

Is there some sort of misunderstanding in this thread?
As my second post I mentioned sowing an inch and using a propagator(Mouse free zone) with success to be told it could be too deep and not to use propagator
Unless I read it wrong its Robininthewoods  whos had bad luck not me

10/120 germinated isn't bad luck???

[galina]

Is there some sort of misunderstanding in this thread?
As my second post I mentioned sowing an inch and using a propagator(Mouse free zone) with success to be told it could be too deep and not to use propagator
Unless I read it wrong its Robininthewoods  whos had bad luck not me

Yes there has been confusion. Helping how to improve germination of peas has been the overriding motive though.  Keep doing what works for you.  And the best of luck to Robin.    

[artichoke]

On the subject of depth, I have been happy for years with rooting my peas in damp cloth, sowing the results in shallow gutters where their roots have nowhere to go and get tangled with each other, and planting out into shallow ditches in the ground, with a bit more fine soil raked over them. They seem to get away, as long as I protect them against birds and deer for a bit. I expect single plants in deep pots would get away faster, but it is so much more trouble. I love Alderman.

[RobinOfTheHood]

Well thanks all for the advice, fresh seed in 9-hole trays and a cold greenhouse has resulted so far in 14/18 germinated and there's plenty of time for the other 4. 

[brownthumb2015]

 On the 4 Th April i dug a spade wide and about a inch deep trench scattered the peas evenly  covered them up then  gently raked to get the soil even. They've   been watered every other day now their about a inch or more up    looks as if nearly all germinated   time to put the netting up  would put it up b4 now but never got round to it  Ps we have loads of mice around  peas cant have been on the menu this month 

[ancellsfarmer]

Dont be complacent, its often when they are at the 1" stage that they get dug up and the seed end eaten, leaving the green part to wither. We've got voles who are a menace in this respect. Active day and night. Some incursions into the population over the last month(little nippers!) but adjacent heathland is riddled with "walking stick holes".
Relentless air patrols by buzzards,kestrels and red kite not curing the problem. Grrh!

[titus a duxas]

To be mice free I..........half fill a plastic bucket with water add a load of grain and use a piece of wood at an angle as a ladder the mice get in but not out
Any where near your germinating peas