Author Topic: sharp sand  (Read 9036 times)

plotstoeat

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sharp sand
« on: March 06, 2015, 18:16:35 »
Does anyone know what risks if any there are  in using building sharp sand rather than horticultural sand?

kGarden

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Re: sharp sand
« Reply #1 on: March 06, 2015, 18:48:43 »
Salt ??

pumkinlover

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Re: sharp sand
« Reply #2 on: March 06, 2015, 18:54:14 »
I use it all the time for the alpines potting compost and plunge bed.
Not had any problems! I use Wickes

Tee Gee

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Re: sharp sand
« Reply #3 on: March 06, 2015, 19:21:11 »
Speaking of Wickes I use their kiln dried sand instead of their sharp sand.

This type is similar to silver sand.

Plus the fact! they advertise it as suitable for grouting paviours or for gardening so that is good enough for me.

Sharp sand sometimes know as river sand can be salty but this is usually dependent on where it is sourced from.

Inland sources are usually salt free but tidal rivers or indeed the beach can be quite salty!

The choice is yours!

Palustris

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Re: sharp sand
« Reply #4 on: March 06, 2015, 20:31:59 »
Easy enough to  test for salt in any sand.....taste a little!
If it has tiny bits of sea-shells in it then it is probably dredged from the sea bed stuff.
Never had any problems with any of the ones I have had from Wickes or Homebase.
Gardening is the great leveller.

johhnyco15

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Re: sharp sand
« Reply #5 on: March 06, 2015, 21:31:02 »
ive used sharp silver and builders sand from  time to time and never had any probs  :blob7:
johhnyc015  may the plot be with you

plotstoeat

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Re: sharp sand
« Reply #6 on: March 07, 2015, 13:42:01 »
 :wave:Thanks for all the useful replies. I have some sharp sand left over from laying paving so I will use it up. If it's a bit salty it might deter the slugs!

gazza1960

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Re: sharp sand
« Reply #7 on: March 22, 2015, 18:40:55 »
Can I just ask about the merits of sharp sand to help break up claggy soil.

Here in Dorset my growing area  soil although treated with plenty of dung last winter and black plastic covered ive still found this spring that when dug up its still in large clods......it has been suggested that sharpsand.....more compost....seaweed...or just simply
removing the top 6 to 12 inches and replacing with good quality top soil which is fine but bloody expensive......

any thoughts on a method that wont break the bank.....okok....if we must be drastic then so be it.

cheers

GazNjude

Ian Pearson

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Re: sharp sand
« Reply #8 on: March 22, 2015, 19:34:59 »
There are standards for salt content in building sands, as it can lead to corrosion of metal building components such as reinforcing bars. I think there is a maximum content of 0.15%. I've had no problems using it in seed compost mixes, but it might build up in soil if used frequently.

Gazza 1960, sand will work, but it takes huge amounts. It's probably more practical to take a multi-stranded approach; as much organic matter as possible intimately mixed in, some lime to increase soil structure by flocculation, no walking on beds to avoid compaction, timely cultivation to avoid clodding and smearing, deep-rooted/tap-rooted green manure crops to improve sub-soil, slightly raised beds to aid soil warming in Spring …  ...

plotstoeat

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Re: sharp sand
« Reply #9 on: March 22, 2015, 19:35:51 »
Can I just ask about the merits of sharp sand to help break up claggy soil.

Here in Dorset my growing area  soil although treated with plenty of dung last winter and black plastic covered ive still found this spring that when dug up its still in large clods......it has been suggested that sharpsand.....more compost....seaweed...or just simply
removing the top 6 to 12 inches and replacing with good quality top soil which is fine but bloody expensive......

any thoughts on a method that wont break the bank.....okok....if we must be drastic then so be it.

cheers

GazNjude

Whatever you add just seems to disappear! The cheapest way that I have found in the past is autumn digging , leaving plenty of air between the clods, so the frost can break it down. Wouldn't like to do it now though! Not good for the back!

kGarden

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Re: sharp sand
« Reply #10 on: March 23, 2015, 10:29:23 »
I've bought topsoil in for beds in the past (in gardens where the soil was "impossible").  Lovely black fenland stuff ... but it needed just as much organic matter adding, going forwards, as any other soil I've ever gardened with.  I should stick to what you have and improve it.

Breaking down the clods (e.g. if you want to make a seed bed) is a technique, rather than an impossibility.  You need to time it just right after rain where it has dried enough to break easily, but not wet enough to compact or stick to your boots when you work it.  It takes more than one rain shower to break large clods, and more organic matter, and years!, will mean the clods are smaller.

or, if you have NO pernicious weeds / roots, the consider rotavating it (e.g. hiring one for the weekend).  Don't do that if it is at all wet though - easier if you own your own rotavate rather than having to book a hire one for a specific time - which guarantees rain, doesn't it?!!

goodlife

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Re: sharp sand
« Reply #11 on: March 23, 2015, 11:44:02 »
Can I just ask about the merits of sharp sand to help break up claggy soil.

Here in Dorset my growing area  soil although treated with plenty of dung last winter and black plastic covered ive still found this spring that when dug up its still in large clods......it has been suggested that sharpsand.....more compost....seaweed...or just simply
removing the top 6 to 12 inches and replacing with good quality top soil which is fine but bloody expensive......

any thoughts on a method that wont break the bank.....okok....if we must be drastic then so be it.

cheers

GazNjude

Like others have already mentioned...organic matter...loads and loads of it and for several years in running. One of cheapest ways of doing it..other than 'harvesting'/collecting free 'stuff'..is straw bales, layering the clay with good thickness of straw in 'lasagne' style', but starting it in trenches will greate airier feel to the clay and the rotting compost will add organic matter and humus into clay. It is not ideal bed for that many crops at first, but at least spuds will appreciate it and after season other crops will cope in it too. It is good to start this 'treatment' in late autumn=early winter to give the straw several months to 'settle' in and soften before spring planting.
What the clay needs is 'carbon content'...straw, shredded cardboard....even sweecorn/maize stems will work, and there is no need to chop them, just lay them flat in trenches :icon_cheers:....though how many of us really have good quantity of the these..
Horse supply places sell big bales of chopped plant stalks...to be used instead of straw..they are excellent stuff! Slightly courser than straw but not quite woody neither and big bales are not that expensive neither. I buy the stuff for my chickens bedding and use it in a plot...there is few different brands that are based in different plants...all by products of agriculture..eg rapeseed etc..
Autumn leaves are good improver too but they will need something more rougher to go with it to keep the clay from compacting wet leaves in flat layers.
Bracken...another brilliant source of plant material and many land owners are more than happy to let you harvest it as much as you can take it away..you can use it fresh in same manner as straw or let it dry and use it later on the year :icon_thumleft:

...or you could start doing pottery...  :tongue3: :glasses9:
« Last Edit: March 23, 2015, 11:48:48 by goodlife »

ACE

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Re: sharp sand
« Reply #12 on: March 23, 2015, 16:49:33 »
I found this method of improving soil by accident. We had a 75m x 7m herbatious border. To save on weeding one year and as they were felling trees up the road we spread all the shredded trees on the whole border. Now I know you are all shouting 'but it takes the nutriment out as it is breaking down' so to nuetralise the effect I spread the compost/soil improver from the local tip over the top of that.£12 a ton.  We turned it as we maintained the border.A couple of years later we decided to strip the bed and divide the plants before replanting. I have never had such dark rich soil as it was then, it broke up the clay and it  all turned into a really nice fine tilth.

kGarden

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Re: sharp sand
« Reply #13 on: March 23, 2015, 17:44:38 »
I know you are all shouting 'but it takes the nutriment out as it is breaking down'

I've read that that is only a problem if the wood-chip is incorporated into the soil, if it is just a mulch then there is negligible effect (the soil just gets on with its thing I suppose, rather than also having to provide a homestead for the bugs that break down the wood chip)

I don't suppose that would give you the same soil-improver as the combined-product route that you went down, which sounds excellent

plotstoeat

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Re: sharp sand
« Reply #14 on: March 23, 2015, 18:09:15 »
I know you are all shouting 'but it takes the nutriment out as it is breaking down'

I've read that that is only a problem if the wood-chip is incorporated into the soil, if it is just a mulch then there is negligible effect (the soil just gets on with its thing I suppose, rather than also having to provide a homestead for the bugs that break down the wood chip)

I don't suppose that would give you the same soil-improver as the combined-product route that you went down, which sounds excellent

I have discovered that adding wood chippings to the compost bin makes super compost , probably for similar reasons

kGarden

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Re: sharp sand
« Reply #15 on: March 23, 2015, 19:23:52 »
Now why didn't I think of that ... thanks :)

I'm often short of "browns" for the compost bin, particularly if I have a pile of mower clippings (consequently I pile them separately in a slimy heap :( ).

I have a huge pile of wood chippings which I was letting rot down for a couple of years before using ... they'd be much more useful put through a composting cycle :)

plotstoeat

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Re: sharp sand
« Reply #16 on: March 23, 2015, 20:47:59 »
After a few months they will completely disintegrate. I also throw in any soil, turf or old compost.

gazza1960

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Re: sharp sand
« Reply #17 on: March 23, 2015, 22:13:56 »
some great options folks,having been along to Hillhead Hampshire observing Americas mobile floating strike platform aircraft carrier
in the Solent this afternoon I observed the ebbing tide below me starting to show its FREE samples on the tideline in the shape of bladderwrack,after reading about scottish crofters using tonnes of the stuff to enhance and help break up their heavy earthed growing ground it will go some way to helping us with our problem along with some of your valid suggestions.

cheers all

GazNjude

 

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